General Discussion

Silent3

(15,909 posts)

25. Is there some particular reason you seem eager to broaden...

Tue Apr 22, 2014, 02:04 PM

Apr 2014

...the application of the word "woo"?

Other people have tried to explain the difference between bad science in general and the specific kind of bad science that is "woo". I'd like not to repeat any of that, so I'll try a different take on the issue.

Does Pradaxa do what Pradaxa set out to do? Does it at least cover the "effective" part of "safe and effective"? The law of gravity doesn't become "woo" because dropping an anvil on someone's head kills him.

To the extent that Pradaxa is effective, does it do more than a mere placebo would? Even if it isn't more effective than a placebo, is that only because of bad experimental control procedures, not an outright dismissal of the need for such things as control procedures?

Did anyone developing or selling Pradaxa ever appeal to "things beyond our understanding" for how it works? Did they eschew controlled studies altogether rather than falsifying data or hiding bad results? Did they rely on anecdotes from people who'd tried Pradaxa self-reporting its effectiveness?

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

41 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

re: What is or isn't "Woo", how about Pradaxa? Science or woo? Should it have ever been OKd at all? [View all] Electric Monk Apr 2014 OP

A drug being dangerous doesn't make it "woo" cthulu2016 Apr 2014 #1

It sure as heck wasn't "good science", yet it was approved for use. nt Electric Monk Apr 2014 #2

Clinical efficacy and safety trials not infrequently fail to detect the extent of adverse effects. hlthe2b Apr 2014 #4

Woo "attempts to place itself as scientifically, or at least reasonably, supported." Electric Monk Apr 2014 #6

Not a single person on this thread supports your broad brush use of that term. Time to rethink... hlthe2b Apr 2014 #10

The OP was an open question, for discussion, not an absolute conclusion. nt Electric Monk Apr 2014 #11

You are using a term that does not fit nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #19

Wrong. n/t pnwmom Apr 2014 #29

LOLOL hlthe2b Apr 2014 #31

They've released a drug whose effects cannot be measured pnwmom Apr 2014 #32

Honestly, pnwmom hlthe2b Apr 2014 #33

I used to work with investigators who were carrying out clinical trials, pnwmom Apr 2014 #34

I agree with you with respect to acupuncture, which has been shown to induce release of endorphins. hlthe2b Apr 2014 #36

I don't think the OP was saying that the conduct of clinical trials is woo. pnwmom Apr 2014 #37

What you will likewise find is a dearth of research on alternatives to many orthopedic surgeries.. hlthe2b Apr 2014 #38

To clarify, woo isn't the procedure or item itself NuclearDem Apr 2014 #41

This is another attempt to have members of DU accept Woo as science.... VanillaRhapsody Apr 2014 #9

+100 Vashta Nerada Apr 2014 #17

And sometimes the drug companies suppress the reports of the adverse affects. SheilaT Apr 2014 #28

Yet another issue, but not reflective of clinical trials failing to detect adverse effects = "woo" hlthe2b Apr 2014 #30

There is a diabetes med nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #8

Nadine... Even the best of scientific method (clinical trials) can fail to detect serious adverse hlthe2b Apr 2014 #12

In that case there was clear fraud nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #18

It may well have been. I'm sorry you experienced that. hlthe2b Apr 2014 #20

Look up Avandia nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #21

Indeed. You are correct with respect to Avandia. hlthe2b Apr 2014 #24

If all bad science was woo... cthulu2016 Apr 2014 #26

The word 'woo' is seriously overused on this website. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Apr 2014 #3

and no it doesn't VanillaRhapsody Apr 2014 #7

That's because it is jargon, slang made up by a specific community Bluenorthwest Apr 2014 #23

That imprecision is a deliberate attempt to discredit the word mathematic Apr 2014 #27

Still not woo.... VanillaRhapsody Apr 2014 #5

This is Woo TlalocW Apr 2014 #13

I have actually seen THAT Woo at a 7-11 paying for gas once! VanillaRhapsody Apr 2014 #14

No, pharmaceuticals aren't pseudoscience. NuclearDem Apr 2014 #15

Chiropracty gets dismissed as woo here, and I don't claim it works by magic. nt Electric Monk Apr 2014 #16

Because of vertebral sublaxation and whether it actually exists or not. NuclearDem Apr 2014 #22

Is there some particular reason you seem eager to broaden... Silent3 Apr 2014 #25

This message was self-deleted by its author riverwalker Apr 2014 #35

I get what you are trying to say. laundry_queen Apr 2014 #39

Not woo. The clinical trials were done as required and it is effective in preventing stroke. Avalux Apr 2014 #40