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Orsino

(37,428 posts)

863. A draft in which upper economic brackets were better represented...

Fri Apr 25, 2014, 02:11 PM

Apr 2014

...might address some of your concerns, which I share. However! On no known planet would en entrenched ruling class such as ours not simply exempt themselves. I will never support a draft before that problem is dealt with, and if we were able to deal with it, I suspect we would not need or want a draft.

One of the problems associated with the last US draft was low pay. A captive work force that cannot collectively bargain is instantly deprofessionalized and loses important incentives for success. Morale suffers in direct (if not geometric) proportion. Low military pay causes the same sort of economic malaise that low pay in any sector does, and is championed by the same cheap-labor conservatives.

When I say I want this nation to be more worth defending, I mean that I want it to value its citizens' humanity and its labor more highly. Build me that nation, and I think you'll find plenty of volunteers who would serve cheerfully and compete for success. We would be the sort of nation that didn't semi-declare wars for profit, and didn't glorify weaponry over courage, honor and dedication.

Until we build that nation, I will not consign anyone to involuntary service.

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This message was self-deleted by its author [View all] AcertainLiz Apr 2014 OP

Involuntary servitude? Never. Jgarrick Apr 2014 #1

it's called handmade34 Apr 2014 #175

No, it's more accurately described as slavery. Lasher Apr 2014 #258

Not any more..... ballyhoo Apr 2014 #278

How about serving in the nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #732

That would be okay with me. I've ballyhoo Apr 2014 #735

National service in most countries that have it nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #737

That sounds like a way to go, where such an option ballyhoo Apr 2014 #739

That is not even a conversation though and that is a problem nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #740

I resented that when I was in the service and it began ballyhoo Apr 2014 #741

We may very well be reaching that point nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #742

Well, I leave the house with trepidation every day ballyhoo Apr 2014 #746

Not a problem, I have to do some writing nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #747

I'm sorry about how you feel about your service AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #974

You held a WW II military commission? Did I misunderstand? Thanks for clarifying uppityperson Apr 2014 #743

I'm scratching my head on that one too..... panader0 Apr 2014 #806

..and the legend grows..... dionysus Apr 2014 #934

we better add another to that impressive resume! dionysus Apr 2014 #935

Pardon me? Do you NOT clean YOUR house? Do you not do maintenance to YOUR house? And are you Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2014 #856

Took the words out of my mouth... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #865

I definitely think that is the typical Republican attitude... Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2014 #866

Yeah, I'm surprised it's here in DU... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #867

Honestly, I'm not. There are plenty of Republican moles in here which get outed every day nt Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2014 #872

Oh? Seriously? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #883

Some would know better than others. nt Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #888

Well, don't be vague then and give a concrete answer. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #896

Returning trolls would know best. That's self-evident. Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #901

And who would they be? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #903

That depends on the troll, n'est-cest pas? Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #905

Are you trying to say you're a troll? I don't follow... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #907

No, not at all. nt Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #909

Well, in the future, don't be so rude and actually be constructive. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #911

One man's rudeness is another adam's constructivity. Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #913

Either you're implying I'm a troll or you're just trying to bother me AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #914

Buh bye. nt Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #917

It is good that others can see it too AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #964

Not wanting others to be forced into involuntary servitude is a Republican attitude? Jgarrick Apr 2014 #873

Post removed Post removed Apr 2014 #875

Well, its the Republicans most fiercely against it AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #970

You bet I do. And I'm not willing to force a young person into involuntary servitude Jgarrick Apr 2014 #877

Oh! So it's not YOUR country? It's someone else's so you owe it nothing? SO Republican. SO NRA Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2014 #878

Yeah, I don't get this attitude either here AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #969

I think we should just expect two or three years of service AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #971

Oh, so we're only going to tell young women and men what to do with their bodies for a few years. Jgarrick Apr 2014 #972

Like we already do, so yes AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #975

Mandatory education only applies to minors, not adults. Jgarrick Apr 2014 #980

So? It's still selective. All I'm saying is to move the bar up a bit. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #989

Controlling another adult's life for years is only moving the bar a "bit"? Jgarrick Apr 2014 #994

Yes it is AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1004

We should, not just the military nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #2

Oh I agree AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #30

How would you set up such a national service system? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #47

At 18 a kid reports to a center nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #68

Oh I agree with this totally AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #80

Yup, you need officers nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #92

Hey I agree again :P AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #99

You go into the service, as an E-3 and owe uncle sam for college nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #102

Yeah, we're on the same wave length AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #120

Ah the testing... is exactly what led to 90 day officer wonder during WW II nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #124

I guess I would do what Finland does in this regard AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #128

Well, we are dreaming, it won't happen nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #131

Yeah I agree, but it's still fun to muse about. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #138

I served ten years nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #139

Wow, why were you doing service in Mexico? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #146

I grew up in Mexico nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #149

You have a very interesting background AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #152

Thank you for always sharing the truth as you see it, Nadin! -NT Anansi1171 Apr 2014 #478

Yeah, he/she has a good perspective :) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #681

Why are you so focused on the military? This country has way tblue37 Apr 2014 #1002

Well, I'm not just focused on the military AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1008

It Wouldn't be a big Hit With the Firemen's Union AndyTiedye Apr 2014 #264

In California the ccc supports firefighters right now. nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #286

Exactly AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #697

I do, since Reagan civil service is evil nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #700

Indeed AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #703

Those older adults remember Nam nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #716

I hear ya, and I understand their feelings, but I'm not proposing a Vietnam style draft AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #729

Exactly! That would be great! But ... there would need to be some kind of mechanism to ensure a RKP5637 Apr 2014 #279

That is why none has to worry about this happening nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #287

Sadly, often the US functions more as a cash register than a country. BTW, change 'goof idea' RKP5637 Apr 2014 #573

That's horrible what happened to him. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #570

I agree that it could have some positive effects, but also some negative effects el_bryanto Apr 2014 #3

It kind of would give jobs to a mass unemployed force AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #31

Forcing Workers to Compete with Conscript Labor AndyTiedye Apr 2014 #242

A lot of this stuff should be done with conscripted labor as opposed to high paid workers AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #330

FFS. Sure, why pay people when you can force them to be slaves? TBF Apr 2014 #785

Aw, come on. You'd feed them and give them a cabin to work in. uppityperson Apr 2014 #786

Is my memory failing or didn't this country fight a war about this about 150 years ago? greatauntoftriplets Apr 2014 #787

National Service = Slavery. Weird that Americans seem to be the only ones who think this... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #796

I don't understand your comment. stone space Apr 2014 #810

I can't take this "National Service = Slavery" comment seriously anymore... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #812

At least, National Guard should be mandatory.nt clarice Apr 2014 #4

Why do you say that? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #10

Here is what I was thinking the benefits might be. clarice Apr 2014 #18

Yeah I agree with you on all this. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #27

Some people can be very cruel. nt clarice Apr 2014 #104

We used to have such a thing, back in the dark ages, when we were fighting something called MADem Apr 2014 #5

Just make the draft equitable AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #29

So it's more moral to force someone to endanger their life against their will? Jgarrick Apr 2014 #105

In a war, yes AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #111

I don't know JustAnotherGen Apr 2014 #283

War sucks, but it's immoral not to expose everyone to it if its a necessary war AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #338

My dad JustAnotherGen Apr 2014 #468

Yeah I agree with you to an extent AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #471

Here's something that would make me to for it JustAnotherGen Apr 2014 #475

Yeah, I'd agree with this as well. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #477

wise person, you are handmade34 Apr 2014 #187

I assume this is sarcasm? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #193

absolutely not... handmade34 Apr 2014 #209

Wow, thanks! AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #211

Has Never Been Fair -- Cannot be Made Fair AndyTiedye Apr 2014 #262

Make everyone do it or have a fair lottery. Easy as pie. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #334

I have an idea... ohheckyeah Apr 2014 #427

lol BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #434

It would make a great book and movie, don't ya think? ohheckyeah Apr 2014 #437

hahahhahahahahahahahahahaha uppityperson Apr 2014 #455

Yeah sounds like a good idea AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #457

Let me try again. Drafts are unequally applied. The ONLY way to get it equal is to uppityperson Apr 2014 #466

You can make it equal AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #469

No, I can not make it equal. I have tried but it never is. You are wrong, I can not make it equal. uppityperson Apr 2014 #472

Now you're just being needlessly sarcastic and hyperbolic AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #474

You told me I could do something, I point out I can not and you insult me. Gotcha. uppityperson Apr 2014 #476

Not easy as pie because we live in an oligarchy. pangaia Apr 2014 #489

I think conscription would erode the oligarchy. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #491

HUH?? pangaia Apr 2014 #500

Witty rebuttal :P AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #502

Oligarchies are all knowing, all seeing and unalterable? AcertainLiz May 2014 #1045

Not everyone has the same capabilities. wickerwoman May 2014 #1031

Thanks for all this, you bring up some valid points AcertainLiz May 2014 #1046

? wickerwoman May 2014 #1058

Oh please, don't confuse GDP with economic well-being AcertainLiz May 2014 #1061

Not everyone CAN Do It AndyTiedye May 2014 #1035

If you medically can't, you won't. AcertainLiz May 2014 #1047

Community Service is a requirement for graduation from High School in my area notadmblnd Apr 2014 #33

Was for me too AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #49

It wasn't for me back in the days of olde. Thankfully. Jgarrick Apr 2014 #110

Not two years worth, though! MADem Apr 2014 #125

No. I think it was 40 hours in 4 hour increments notadmblnd Apr 2014 #135

Give it time. Someone WILL bring the "uncompensated labor" lawsuit. MADem Apr 2014 #177

this service (mndatory community service) handmade34 Apr 2014 #215

It wasn't that easy to buy one's way out of the Civil War draft Art_from_Ark Apr 2014 #170

Sure--it was a perk for the One Percent of the era. An unfair one, to be sure. MADem Apr 2014 #176

I remember reading about people buying "replacements" in Team of Rivals davidpdx Apr 2014 #268

I regard it as a One Percenter's perk--a vestige of the days of serfs and lords. MADem Apr 2014 #271

Whereas I think Arver vs United states was wrongly decided. Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2014 #6

Is jury duty immoral and disgusting? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #8

No, and no. Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2014 #17

It's not immoral and "anti-freedom" to force people to do some things in service to society AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #25

Are you able to distinguish between calling a policy and a country immoral? Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2014 #28

You're not making a convincing argument. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #34

Well, I am, but you're choosing to ignore it. Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2014 #48

I read it, and it's totally subjective AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #51

I'm afraid that unless you provide more details as to your objection, I can't help you. Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2014 #58

All you've said is its unnecssary, thus its immoral and anti-free, thus evil and bad...I guess. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #62

What about compulsory education? demwing Apr 2014 #123

If done to compos mentis adults then yes, I do. N.T. Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2014 #127

In other words - a little evil is OK for the kids, but not for me demwing Apr 2014 #294

Thanks for this :) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #572

Parents can Opt Out and Homeschool AndyTiedye Apr 2014 #265

But they still must "school" demwing Apr 2014 #267

Because mandatory schooling secures the child's right to an education. wickerwoman May 2014 #1032

Yeah, my point exactly. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #571

What is your definition of involuntary servitude? oldhippie Apr 2014 #37

But conscription is not banned by the 13th Amendment AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #44

It isn't? oldhippie Apr 2014 #50

No, it isn't. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #54

No, ..... oldhippie Apr 2014 #61

But the law isn't based on your personal opinions. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #65

Yes, I know that, but ..... oldhippie Apr 2014 #69

You said its banned by the 13th Amendment AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #72

Uh, no I didn't ..... oldhippie Apr 2014 #78

Uh, yeah you did... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #89

Ok, I'll try to be more clear ..... oldhippie Apr 2014 #112

So in other words, you think it forbids it. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #115

Again, what is your definition of involuntary servitude? oldhippie Apr 2014 #52

Im okay with some forms of involuntary temporary service. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #56

And I am not .... oldhippie Apr 2014 #60

Okay? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #64

Really? Serious? oldhippie Apr 2014 #75

Well, you can't save everyone :P AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #95

We still have a draft on the books, we just don't use it anymore. It's a last-ditch thing now. MADem Apr 2014 #185

I'm not proposing a draft though AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #191

You're proposing a draft. You just don't realize it. nt MADem Apr 2014 #222

Some states PAY people for jury duty. So it's involuntary, but is it "servitude?" MADem Apr 2014 #181

In any National Service scheme people would be paid. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #183

My point is as I've articulated it upthread. It's a shitty idea. MADem Apr 2014 #196

I don't see any evidence of this AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #197

You don't see ANY evidence? REALLY? MADem Apr 2014 #221

Thanks for the general Wikipedia link on the subject AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #229

If you don't like the "general Wikipedia" you are free to click on the extensive list of MADem Apr 2014 #232

So slavery is ok when they are not really citizens. dilby Apr 2014 #7

Slavery? I didn't know Norway and Finland for ex. were major practiontioners of slavery AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #12

I've got to correct you there KitSileya Apr 2014 #813

It does officially AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #817

De jure it may have conscription, KitSileya Apr 2014 #823

I'm skeptical of what you say AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #826

Obviously, you refuse to have a serious discussion online KitSileya Apr 2014 #830

I can believe you if you give me some evidence contradicting what I've read online AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #835

The elites will love this proposal, more cannon fodder. Shoulders of Giants Apr 2014 #9

But the elites couldn't get out of it. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #11

Hahaha BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #14

Why? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #19

Well BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #250

Seems like you could use this argument against taxation then? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #327

yes? BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #366

So you're against taxation? :/ AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #370

Heh BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #376

So...are you against taxation or not? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #380

What BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #406

Give anyone severe penalties for draft dodging. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #411

What? BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #414

Wut? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #416

things are not equitable or fair in this society BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #422

" things are not equitable or fair in this society" They can be though AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #429

Liz BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #431

If you think thing can never improve, why even bother with politics? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #438

Its called being realistic BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #443

If you think everything is hopeless, why waste your time? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #448

It is better BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #452

Well, you just sound like a bitter quitter. I wish I could inspire you with hope. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #459

He doesn't sound bitter to me. Gemini Cat Apr 2014 #486

He does to me AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #496

Whatever. Gemini Cat Apr 2014 #504

At least you've been polite :) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #506

Huh? BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #588

I'm tired of arguing with you, so let's just leave it at this AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #607

Separate fantasy world and real life in the U.S.of Oligarchy..the Elites ALWAYS GET AWAY with It. 2banon Apr 2014 #750

Like they did in WW II and Korea nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #759

Elites get out of taxation so let's get rid of taxes! AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #798

They got out of it the last time the draft was around. Shoulders of Giants Apr 2014 #15

I dont think Iraq would have happened if we had a draft AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #21

Of course it would have happened. jeff47 Apr 2014 #84

I don't think unnecessary wars would happen with a draft, and Im not the only one to make that AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #100

And you're not the only one who is wrong about that argument. jeff47 Apr 2014 #246

I guess we'll disagree that Vietnam was necessary AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #333

Have you studied the Viet Nam war? Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #341

I studied it both in school and on my own AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #354

Just curious how a 19 yr old would have such an opinion Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #362

Why can't I have an opinion on it? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #367

Who said you couldn't? You made a point in your profile Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #371

Who said I knew much about it? I don't AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #374

Liz, in your school, pangaia Apr 2014 #485

Sort of yeah, I even had a Vietnam War vet as a history teacher :P AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #488

Sort of? What doe 'sort of' mean? pangaia Apr 2014 #490

They briefly touched on these subjects AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #494

They "briefly touched on these subjects." ? pangaia Apr 2014 #507

Yeah it wasn't very in depth actually AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #509

Vietnam was utterly and completely unnecessary. jeff47 Apr 2014 #576

We fought to protect South Vietnam. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #609

Let them be insulted BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #631

Since I've heard the total opposite from all the Vietnamese I know, and their families AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #635

My sources? BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #644

Thanks, but I've never heard this from the Vietnamese community before AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #647

There were plenty of other countries we did not protect. jeff47 Apr 2014 #658

Gotta start somewhere AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #667

Oh.my.god. I can't believe anyone wrote that statement in the year 2014. 2banon Apr 2014 #765

Would you prefer I time travel to 1969 and write this? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #801

Of course it would have 'happened.' pangaia Apr 2014 #108

Yeah and an all volunteer force enables this AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #114

As someone else here explained, pangaia Apr 2014 #153

They're wrong AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #157

Your proof that it would not happen is that it would be a shorter war. jeff47 Apr 2014 #247

You have a horrible concept of refutation... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #332

So things would have been better Union Scribe Apr 2014 #353

Why is it a bad idea? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #361

I will only reply once Union Scribe Apr 2014 #363

I can be moved by convincing arguments. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #372

It didn't prevent the war in Vietnam. Gemini Cat Apr 2014 #497

I don't think it could have because it needed to be done AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #498

Wait a second- Gemini Cat Apr 2014 #508

Against North Vietnam, yeah AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #510

Why? Gemini Cat Apr 2014 #517

To protect South Vietnam, our ally. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #518

LOL! Yeah, sure. Gemini Cat Apr 2014 #519

Witty rebuttal :) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #520

Ok. Gemini Cat Apr 2014 #522

Thanks for your responses :) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #523

Sure, welcome. Gemini Cat Apr 2014 #525

So time to move the goalposts then? jeff47 Apr 2014 #575

Thanks for your very "long" rebuttal, but it's really pointless and incorrect AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #613

Reading. You are utterly and completely failing at it. jeff47 Apr 2014 #660

Yeah, I'm not going to bother with you any longer AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #668

It would have happened sooner. MADem Apr 2014 #234

If we had a Draft, We'd be at War With IRAN AndyTiedye Apr 2014 #263

We'd be invading Iran if more Americans would potentially die? Doesn't make sense AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #335

Except a lack of Volunteers AndyTiedye Apr 2014 #596

An exception to a lack of volunteers? What are you talking about? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #599

So DOD is redusing the force due to a lack of volunteers nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #701

Bush / Cheney would have invaded Iran AndyTiedye Apr 2014 #1019

You do know military pay is getting cut right now right nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #1023

Would Have to be cut a lot more to pay all the conscripts AndyTiedye Apr 2014 #1024

I am talking reality right now nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #1025

With an Army Several Times Larger AndyTiedye May 2014 #1034

The elites play by different rules, no matter the game. nt City Lights Apr 2014 #20

Not really, no. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #23

Of course they will. They got out of the draft. LeftyMom Apr 2014 #55

Why is it inevitable they would? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #59

Because the elites dictate policy, and in every war with compulsory service in US history the elites LeftyMom Apr 2014 #87

Don't worry, the elites do not want one nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #97

Such a system would erode elite control AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #106

For the 100+ years we actually had one it did the opposite. LeftyMom Apr 2014 #126

We never did AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #134

Sure they could--ask George W. Bush and Dan Quayle. nt MADem Apr 2014 #201

Just don't give them exemptions. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #204

They didn't GET "exemptions." They got the equivalent of a "no work/no show" job. nt MADem Apr 2014 #207

Just give them jail time if they refuse to report. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #302

They're the ones making the rules. ForgoTheConsequence Apr 2014 #384

We the people will make the rules AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #602

Yes, let's fill the prisons with draft resisters--that worked SO well back in the day! MADem Apr 2014 #586

Like THAT ever happens. Jamastiene Apr 2014 #966

So it's impossible to ever have people treated fairly? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #967

In America, yes. Jamastiene Apr 2014 #973

So nothing will ever change in that regard? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #979

They always have. Why would it change now? chrisa Apr 2014 #292

Why have taxation if the rich can get out of it? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #301

Also ironically its the elites most opposed to this idea... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #38

Ironically it is them who are far more opposed to it than you are nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #119

It costs upwards of twenty thousand dollars to get an E-1 to his or her first duty station. MADem Apr 2014 #259

Disagree BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #13

Maybe at this very moment AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #35

Ok BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #249

Drafts are war killers for one AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #326

They are? BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #377

Well, there's this example AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #382

Lol BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #387

Lulz AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #393

What BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #404

No, it shouldn't even have, because those were necessary wars. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #409

Myopic view BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #412

I said a draft prevents unnecessary wars and gave sources to that effect AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #417

And yet BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #420

Vietnam was just? ohheckyeah Apr 2014 #436

+1 Gemini Cat Apr 2014 #537

You say, "... because those were necessary wars...." pangaia Apr 2014 #484

Strictly keeping with the US AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #487

Korea and Vietnam were both lies. pangaia Apr 2014 #511

How were they lies? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #512

I gave you something easy to google. pangaia Apr 2014 #515

Fair enough... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #516

How was Vietnam necessary? BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #590

I'd like for you to tell that to the Vietnamese community here in the US. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #610

So you know, I know the community. nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #997

Well, I figure most Vietnamese here would agree with me, since they waive the South Viet. flag AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1006

Either San Diego or LA nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #1009

I'm an OC baby actually :P AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1010

Yup, the other community where you have large immigrant communities nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #1012

I love our ethnic diversity here in OC personally AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1014

I love diversity myself nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #1016

I embrace diversity AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1020

"hey feel no one should have to have any responsibility" cyberswede Apr 2014 #1027

How is it right wing? AcertainLiz May 2014 #1042

Well... cyberswede May 2014 #1043

Okay, let me see... AcertainLiz May 2014 #1051

I do, too. I think we should be required to serve our country pnwmom Apr 2014 #16

I'm also for compulsory voting AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #40

Anyone who votes only because it's compulsory is someone I don't want voting in the first place Jgarrick Apr 2014 #118

Then you don't want Australians voting AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #121

If any individual Australian is so shallow as to only vote under the threat of a fine...yes. Jgarrick Apr 2014 #165

Think about it marions ghost Apr 2014 #297

Exactly. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #611

If "national service" is defined very broadly, I could potentially support the idea. lumberjack_jeff Apr 2014 #22

Agreed AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #24

Mandatory military service would just make the Defense budget even bigger than it is. Gormy Cuss Apr 2014 #26

Not really AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #32

Germany got rid of conscription in 2011. MADem Apr 2014 #239

I know Germany got rid of it, and that some want to bring it back, which makes sense AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #328

You're using a thirteen year old article written by a neocon nutjob to "prove" your point? MADem Apr 2014 #524

What article are you referring to? I've used several. Mostly from liberal and left wing sources. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #529

Follow your own discussion--the link in the post I was responding to. nt MADem Apr 2014 #536

Well, you're wrong in any case. Check some of the other links I've given... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #543

That's just BS AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #532

You use articles written by self-admitted neocons to butress your argument, and MADem Apr 2014 #539

I've been insulted here and told I'm full of it a lot, with no consequences, and I'm tired of it. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #544

What is "insulting" about telling you--and then proving it--that your source is a neoncon nut? MADem Apr 2014 #564

You have been here one week TBF Apr 2014 #583

+ a whole lot! nt DocMac Apr 2014 #829

A smaller budget, or a smaller expenditure per person? Gormy Cuss Apr 2014 #552

The latter AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #556

Curious, where is there data on this? Gormy Cuss Apr 2014 #559

Data on? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #567

Direct personnel expenditures per military member for the countries with mandatory service Gormy Cuss Apr 2014 #582

Well, Israel and several other nations have modern militaries at a much lower cost than the US AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #608

Largely because they don't have the investment in weapons. Gormy Cuss Apr 2014 #614

Why would we need to increase investment in weapons? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #616

Because it would be a massive increase in the number of military members Gormy Cuss Apr 2014 #618

I mean bombs, rockets, drones, warships, etc. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #619

Good or bad isn't the issue under discussion here. The discussion is about cost. Gormy Cuss Apr 2014 #621

You said "weapons" you should have just said "guns" or "small arms" or such AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #625

*I* should have said? I'm responsible for your misinterpretation? Gormy Cuss Apr 2014 #633

Yes, you should be less vague, and the confusion is your fault as the result of your vagueness. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #638

... Gormy Cuss Apr 2014 #642

You were rude first. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #643

No. nt snappyturtle Apr 2014 #36

I agree Liz. 99Forever Apr 2014 #39

Thanks :) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #42

it might be ok to have it in iself, but it wont do anything to prevent militarism JI7 Apr 2014 #41

I think it would. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #43

not based on history and comparisons to other nations like israel JI7 Apr 2014 #45

Well, I disagree. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #46

Lincoln freed the slaves, honey. It was in all the papers. LeftyMom Apr 2014 #53

So Finland, Greece, Austria and Norway for ex. practice slavery? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #57

Your argument is both disingenuous and ultimately irrelevant. LeftyMom Apr 2014 #71

6 points. pangaia Apr 2014 #88

Oh dear... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #90

Finland is 'males only' compulsory military service, favored by Liz because Bluenorthwest Apr 2014 #137

Greece is "males only" as well, and the period of service is brief. MADem Apr 2014 #568

Funny that I say the exact opposite in my original post AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #612

+1,000 nt MADem Apr 2014 #272

Excuse me, mam. 99Forever Apr 2014 #66

You took the words out of my mouth. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #70

Controlling the labor of adults is slavery. LeftyMom Apr 2014 #73

Nonsense. 99Forever Apr 2014 #82

Indeed, it's ridiculous hyperbole. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #91

So if society owns the labor of the individual it's ok, Got you. dilby Apr 2014 #94

More nonsense hyperbole. 99Forever Apr 2014 #159

But don't you know, the "me me me!" attitude is sacred AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #162

What have I taken that I have not given back? dilby Apr 2014 #227

Of course you do! 99Forever Apr 2014 #230

"society is working just fine" handmade34 Apr 2014 #237

Seconding that... marions ghost Apr 2014 #298

What is "involuntary servitude"? nt oldhippie Apr 2014 #155

What is being a "selfish drain on society?" n/t 99Forever Apr 2014 #161

That's what I thought. oldhippie Apr 2014 #189

Because the part about "Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness" RandoLoodie Apr 2014 #275

There are several million people who ... 99Forever Apr 2014 #295

So quite frankly RandoLoodie Apr 2014 #670

Eat a what? 99Forever Apr 2014 #684

:>))))))))))))))))))))))) pangaia Apr 2014 #81

how does your point sytem work? /nt demwing Apr 2014 #143

well. humm 2 points for a basket. pangaia Apr 2014 #148

I've got no problem with the idea..... daleanime Apr 2014 #63

How do you mean? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #67

Liz you have a ton of time to post on DU HangOnKids Apr 2014 #79

It's called having nothing to do inbetween high school and the military AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #93

This message was self-deleted by its author HangOnKids Apr 2014 #256

Already have it ... Trillo Apr 2014 #74

Add some years of compulsory service, after which you can do whatever you want with life AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #83

It would be simple to avoid madville Apr 2014 #76

I agree our system would need massive reforms to make it fair AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #86

Heck yeah lets chain these people up and maybe we can get them to call us master too. dilby Apr 2014 #98

"Slave labor" I forgot that Israel, Finland, South Korea, etc are using slave labor... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #101

Forcing people to work against their will is slavery. dilby Apr 2014 #107

You're kidding, right? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #113

Yes forcing someone to work against their will is slavery. dilby Apr 2014 #116

TIL that Austria and Finland and South Korea have legalized slavery. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #129

Japan had conscription in WWII. dilby Apr 2014 #218

Thanks for your ridiculous hyperbole and dodging my statement :P AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #339

Your two examples--Austria and Finland--only require compulsory service from MALES. MADem Apr 2014 #273

Well, I'd do both males and females for two to three years like Israel. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #340

Males have to do a longer tour of duty than females do in Israel--and only half of the MADem Apr 2014 #425

Well that's easy, just make it more equitable. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #430

Are you in charge of DU now? Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #433

Just a polite suggestion. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #440

You should check the rules on posting. Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #442

I'm sure we've come to an amicable agreement AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #451

You have used right wing and inaccurate sources to "make your case" here. MADem Apr 2014 #527

Salon and Thom Hartmann are right wing sources? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #531

Your little article was written by right-wing neocon nutjob ANN MARLOWE. MADem Apr 2014 #541

You're just trying to poison the well...oh well AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #545

Maybe we can have the people forced into involuntary service ..... oldhippie Apr 2014 #243

Lol AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #696

No to compulsory - Highlight current incentives instead? karadax Apr 2014 #77

agreed AngryAmish Apr 2014 #85

Mandatory, no. Highly encouraged through financial incentives, absolutely. NuclearDem Apr 2014 #96

Conscripts make lousy soldiers, but good cannon fodder. SQUEE Apr 2014 #103

Not really AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #109

Everything I've READ. SQUEE Apr 2014 #117

Funny that I've found differing arguments in a few minutes... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #122

Ah well if that random guy's blog says so, then...case closed. tritsofme Apr 2014 #136

Random guy who happens to be a military expert... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #140

And he doubles as a RW nutjob tritsofme Apr 2014 #144

I don't agree with that AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #151

Arguing for some sort of mandatory non-military service is much different tritsofme Apr 2014 #163

I think I've already demonstrated why I think differently AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #167

He is NOT a military expert--he's a REAL ESTATE expert who spent a few years in service. MADem Apr 2014 #535

Thanks for the brief Wiki page :P AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #542

He didn't serve as many years as I did, that's for certain. He's a REAL ESTATE writer. MADem Apr 2014 #546

Oh forget it AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #548

I'm not the one carrying neocon water in this conversation. MADem Apr 2014 #553

Odd you use a volunteer x4 SQUEE Apr 2014 #141

Having had to lead troops both in Viet Nam ..... oldhippie Apr 2014 #198

And I have read Vietnam vets who say the exact opposite. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #200

Works for Israel davidn3600 Apr 2014 #130

I think the Israeli system has a lot of benefits AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #132

Despite Israel's near perpetual wartime footing, only half of citizens actually serve. MADem Apr 2014 #276

Israel has roughly the land mass and population of New Jersey Hippo_Tron Apr 2014 #373

I'd rather see the military more focused on the National Guard AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #695

Been a busy week huh? NightWatcher Apr 2014 #133

:>))))))))) pangaia Apr 2014 #195

Holy Fucking Shit HangOnKids Apr 2014 #257

Seriously. nt TBF Apr 2014 #293

Let's do this one. Define what you mean by 'truly conscientious objectors' Bluenorthwest Apr 2014 #142

I'd do what Germany did when they had it AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #150

So you were not honest with the poster who says 'I hate the MIC so I'd Bluenorthwest Apr 2014 #166

Hmm? I'm being dishonest about what? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #172

Hating the military has never been the standard for being a moral objector Bluenorthwest Apr 2014 #238

No, you need to pay attention, good sir (ma'am?) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #325

I'm curious as to how mandatory service affects already high unemployment polly7 Apr 2014 #145

Hmm? It seems to have a positive impact on employment in some countries AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #147

I understand that these people would possibly be in that unemployment pool themselves polly7 Apr 2014 #154

I think social services should be able to "take advantage" of the youth in that way. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #158

I didn't say anyone was being taken advantage of. polly7 Apr 2014 #164

Some wars are necessary AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #168

'Most' wars aren't necessary. nt. polly7 Apr 2014 #171

And some are. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #173

.... polly7 Apr 2014 #210

So in wars of necessity, people should be allowed to defer it to someone else? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #212

Exception to the rule and probably partially the fruit of previous less necessary wars. TheKentuckian Apr 2014 #269

Exceptions to the rule always have to exist, what's your point? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #337

I sent an email to then Idaho Governor Phil Batt on my "Harvest Corps" plan. brewens Apr 2014 #156

Intereting idea :P AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #160

I didn't get a real response. Kind of a generic, "The Governor appreciates your idea and will... brewens Apr 2014 #169

Lol, go figure... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #174

Agreed. nt doxydad Apr 2014 #178

Why do you agree, if I may ask? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #179

Agree some type of national service but keep military all volunteer Exposethefrauds Apr 2014 #180

Very intriguing system you propose AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #188

Q: Are you a vet? Exposethefrauds Apr 2014 #192

I will be. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #194

In honor of that I am going to give you Military Life Lesson #1 Exposethefrauds Apr 2014 #203

I'm going into the Army with my boyfriend AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #206

Well good luck with your life choice, one thing for sure it will be an adventure Exposethefrauds Apr 2014 #216

Well, I personally can't wait AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #225

Whether one hates or enjoys their service has nothing to do with my position Exposethefrauds Apr 2014 #266

Well, sounds like the military to me. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #336

Q: Are you ready and willing to die for this country? Y or N Exposethefrauds Apr 2014 #595

Y. That's the simple answer AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #600

Once you raise your paw and are in it does not matter what you are Exposethefrauds Apr 2014 #639

This is all true, and Im fine with it AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #640

If you are actually thinking of going AWOL as an option Exposethefrauds Apr 2014 #654

Only if it's ethically necessary. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #694

You still do not get it, IT is not all about you. You go AWOL you are letting others down Exposethefrauds Apr 2014 #783

So if I have to kill civilians, you'd rather I do that than go AWOL? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #797

If you are unwilling to kill civilians, you have no business joining the military cemaphonic Apr 2014 #1017

Now you're just being ridiculous and obtuse AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1022

Best wishes to you both. n/t PoliticAverse Apr 2014 #220

Thanks :) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #226

I am Pro-Choice AndyTiedye Apr 2014 #296

To a certain extent AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #300

you say you will sign up when "everything I want to do beforehand is done"? uppityperson Apr 2014 #738

"life is not always about just you" handmade34 Apr 2014 #240

Yup! handmade34 Apr 2014 #182

Well, at least some are on the same wave length as me. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #184

Thomas Jefferson... handmade34 Apr 2014 #199

And we agree again AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #202

They will establish a loop hole for the rich kids to get out of the ''mandatory'' part ..trust me. YOHABLO Apr 2014 #186

That'd be easy to overcome AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #190

Of course it would be 'easy to overcome' in theory, in reality not. n/t PoliticAverse Apr 2014 #205

I think it's easier than you think. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #208

Thinking isn't living. ohheckyeah Apr 2014 #444

No. alarimer Apr 2014 #213

No taxation or jury duty or community service then? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #214

None of those are forced labor. dilby Apr 2014 #228

"Taxation is justified, society makes it possible for you to earn your income so you need to give ba AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #231

As taxation is done now, ohheckyeah Apr 2014 #446

Get back to me when our military does more than serve the greed of our elite. nt RedCappedBandit Apr 2014 #217

It would if we had conscription AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #223

You mean like in Vietnam? RedCappedBandit Apr 2014 #245

Vietnam ended because of the draft, so yeah AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #329

Vietnam ended because of Watergate Hippo_Tron Apr 2014 #383

Nixon ran on an anti-war platform AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #391

He didn't run on an anti-war platform. Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #394

High school AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #403

He ran opposing the draft so as to undermine the anti-war movement Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #408

Thanks for proving my point on conscription :) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #413

You claimed Nixon was anti war and when it is pointed out Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #419

I said he ran on an anti war platform, not that he sincerely was. He was a politician after all AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #424

Cite this anti-war platform please. Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #428

Here AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #454

That is funny. It was not an anti war platform. Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #458

Yet he ran on a plan to negotiate a peace and end the draft AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #465

Except I heard many of his speeches. He was not anti-war. Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #481

Give YouTube clips of these speeches AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #482

Here you go: Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #493

That's not pro-war, thats just not pro getting out immediately. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #495

Fail. Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #499

Oh well, since you've resorted to insults, I'm going to ignore you, so I don't have to bother AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #501

Fine.I will not be ignoring you. Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #526

Since Kingofalldems has said everything I would've, let me just offer you some advice... Hippo_Tron Apr 2014 #593

I actually ignored him/her due to their rudeness and paranoia AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #603

I'm not interested in going on patrol... Hip_Flask Apr 2014 #219

I don't think this fits with the reality of the situation AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #224

No, it doesn't. Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #233

How do you mean? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #304

I'm a dual citizen. nt Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #331

Of? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #693

Does that matter? Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #887

What are you talking about? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #895

Uhhhh.... I am a dual citizen. I had to do mandatory service in the other country. Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #899

Why don't you go into which country this was and what kind of service? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #902

I am in that country. My service is completed. Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #904

What country is this, and exactly why was it a waste of time? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #906

I could ask you the same. Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #908

Being that you refuse to actually say where you're from or how you've come across this info AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #910

It doesn't matter where I'm from. Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #912

I don't believe anything you're telling me, sorry to say AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #915

You haven't answered my question though. Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #918

As a retired Army vet AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #235

Seems to work for a lot of militaries AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #305

Which militaries today are comprised mostly AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #645

Many militaries are made up in large part of draftees and are free AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #648

Guess again AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #650

Um..Europe does have them, as clearly indicated on the map. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #652

You said many AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #653

Well, actually many in the world AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #657

Not Europe as a single polity? How about minority of countries in Europe? uppityperson Apr 2014 #655

You would have a problem serving side by side nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #722

You know I had left this AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #869

I notice you left the IDF out on purpose nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #871

We were talking about Europe before you butted in. AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #874

I am sorry I have a *more global view of the world than you do* nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #879

Yes you did butt in AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #962

I see your feelings got hurt nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #965

Complete your first enlistment... actslikeacarrot Apr 2014 #236

What if I still agree, I guess then it has validity? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #306

you should complete your first enlistment... actslikeacarrot Apr 2014 #749

So..if I still agree with this once I've done a few years, will you take me seriously then? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #800

No AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #876

Then why even give that criteria? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #882

My posts point out you were wrong AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #943

You're not proving your point, and you seem to just be trying to antagonize me AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #953

Says the person AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #963

Reading through this thread, there are a lot of pretty dumb and hyperbolic responses. DanTex Apr 2014 #241

Thanks for at least giving a level-headed response and considering the idea AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #307

I'm afraid I don't have a completely satisfactory answer, but I'll give it a shot. DanTex Apr 2014 #352

Thanks for your input AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #365

Mandatory service = slavery Vashta Nerada Apr 2014 #244

Other than religion AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #651

No. This country's problem is that it doesn't do enough for its citizens, not vice-versa. JVS Apr 2014 #248

I think it goes both ways AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #308

We have massive underemployment, unemployment, and low wage problems. JVS Apr 2014 #348

How so? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #358

Wages are already experiencing downward pressure BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #410

Actually, I'd do what Germany did and Austria does AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #415

Don't care what the sector is BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #418

Not free labor, conscripted but paid labor. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #423

care to address the significant differences BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #426

Conscripted labor there isn't unionized AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #435

uhh? BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #439

So just have those protections AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #445

Oh my god you are naive BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #447

Thanks for the insult, but.. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #456

Liz BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #587

But I'm not suggesting to wave my magic wand and change everything AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #605

Yes, you did actually BlindTiresias Apr 2014 #632

I was clearly commenting on my hypothetical scenario which I even admitted in that post won't happen AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #636

I agree oldandhappy Apr 2014 #251

Sorry. You can't have my daughters. I'll fight back. (nt) stone space Apr 2014 #255

Your daughters oldandhappy Apr 2014 #346

Agreed. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #692

Wouldn't paying a living wage and providing decient working conditions be just as effective... stone space Apr 2014 #807

Meanwhile two experienced teachers will no longer be able to do a job they love wickerwoman May 2014 #1033

What kind of set up would you want to see enacted? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #309

Something fair and with choices oldandhappy Apr 2014 #345

Well we're on the same wave length AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #357

Shouldn't you repeal the 13th Amendment first? (nt) stone space Apr 2014 #252

Why? Conscription is not forbidden by the 13th Amendment AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #310

You have to come from a place of relative privilege noamnety Apr 2014 #253

I'm not from "relative privilege", actually from a lower middle-class upbringing AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #311

You're still coming from privilege here noamnety Apr 2014 #322

I think the government should have mandatory service requirements to the citizens Taitertots Apr 2014 #254

How do you mean? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #312

I generally believe that those who advocate for drafts should be drafted. Xithras Apr 2014 #260

Okay, whats my assignment? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #313

Tie it to education Half-Century Man Apr 2014 #261

That would work :) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #314

I'm not sure I like the idea of mandatory military service davidpdx Apr 2014 #270

Well I'd do both genders AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #315

I think they already have something like that! RandoLoodie Apr 2014 #274

Wow, such hyperbole. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #316

Yeah? No abelenkpe Apr 2014 #277

They do in societies that do this. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #317

You're right, they do abelenkpe Apr 2014 #342

You're probably right AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #355

maybe if we weren't hell bent on getting in wars 2pooped2pop Apr 2014 #280

+++ 1,000,000 +++ n/t RKP5637 Apr 2014 #282

The draft is a war killer as Thom Hartmann said. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #318

Thom Hartmann is wrong about a lot of things. ForgoTheConsequence Apr 2014 #385

"Thom Hartmann is wrong about a lot of things." Maybe, but he's right about this. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #390

Says you. ForgoTheConsequence Apr 2014 #392

Says me and a lot of others. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #396

50,000+ dead americans say "WTF?" Warren Stupidity Apr 2014 #591

What, no variety in that population's voice? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #606

the dead speak as one: no draft no fucking way. Warren Stupidity Apr 2014 #620

Where can I consult the dead on this manner? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #622

I would suggest a trip to the Washington Mall, followed by one to Arlington Cemetary. Warren Stupidity Apr 2014 #623

Okay, so all would agree with you? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #627

Nearly one-third of the 58,286 names on the Wall were draftees pinboy3niner Apr 2014 #634

Since they're dead, I don't think we can know their personal opinions on the matter both then AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #637

I can't support this as you have proposed...... Swede Atlanta Apr 2014 #281

Being that the Constitution doesn't ban conscription, it's a bad argument. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #319

You need to read this by unhappycamper JustAnotherGen Apr 2014 #284

Thanks for this, but conscription is a war killer, not a war feeder. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #320

I don't know JustAnotherGen Apr 2014 #470

The irony is ultra-conservatives and neocons oppose conscription AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #473

Hi Liz, me again. pangaia Apr 2014 #561

I think the hindsight of history gives us all the ability to see mistakes when they were made AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #566

Jeeze ...not this shit again. L0oniX Apr 2014 #285

... TBF Apr 2014 #290

Yea, I fell for it.... pangaia Apr 2014 #580

I vehemently disagree. SamKnause Apr 2014 #288

Why? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #321

I have to give you credit - TBF Apr 2014 #289

You are talking about a dysfunctional society marions ghost Apr 2014 #299

It may be a lot of things - TBF Apr 2014 #303

Military service should always be a choice marions ghost Apr 2014 #344

The OP focused on military - TBF Apr 2014 #347

If you give young people marions ghost Apr 2014 #349

Mandatory service is nothing more than government-approved slavery. chrisa Apr 2014 #291

So countries with such a set-up are practicing slavery? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #323

Do they have ther population we do? No. WinkyDink Apr 2014 #584

Yes, countries with conscription are backwards. chrisa Apr 2014 #669

Well okay, today I learned slavery is still allowed in some western countries AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #671

You don't see the difference between chrisa Apr 2014 #672

How is making people do community service of some sort not slavery? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #673

I should clarify, I'm against any type of forced service. chrisa Apr 2014 #674

You contradict yourself AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #675

One is done as a graduation requirement, the other at gunpoint. chrisa Apr 2014 #676

By that logic, high school is done "at gun point" AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #677

Not A Good Idea jobendorfer Apr 2014 #324

service... handmade34 Apr 2014 #343

Heh, Moses2SandyKoufax Apr 2014 #350

This is easy, put those who the military doesnt need into civil work, as I said. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #360

+1000! People have enough trouble trying to survive without fitting snappyturtle Apr 2014 #521

"... with a middle eastern terror network that is just about half the size of the Crips. " pangaia Apr 2014 #578

You are 19 ismnotwasm Apr 2014 #351

How do you mean? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #359

Yeah, well, Heidi Apr 2014 #356

Peace Corps n/t Tuesday Afternoon Apr 2014 #364

Would be a nice option AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #368

The education system could be reststructured to include these two years and Tuesday Afternoon Apr 2014 #378

Yeah, this is a good idea. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #388

I think the school year needs to be restructured. I think our summer break is too long. Tuesday Afternoon Apr 2014 #397

Summer breaks are too long? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #405

I think they would be happy to be off from Tuesday Afternoon Apr 2014 #460

Hey, we're in agreement :P AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #462

You typically need a useful skill to join the Peace Corps, and there's a reason for that Hippo_Tron Apr 2014 #386

by the senior year our children should have acquired a skill or some knowledge that would Tuesday Afternoon Apr 2014 #401

We're in total agreement here AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #464

That may be true but that has nothing to do with the Peace Corps Hippo_Tron Apr 2014 #592

The Peace Corps is not the only option available. Of course, if they don't meet the requirements Tuesday Afternoon Apr 2014 #594

Sounds like a cool idea AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #691

Some sixteen states require community service for graduation. We had it in Chicago. It's called ancianita Apr 2014 #369

Exactly! Just extend that logic AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #375

Most of our students could get their hours in within one year, positive experiences for most. ancianita Apr 2014 #379

Perhaps, there's a lot of different ideas I think that could work, even if they'll never happen. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #389

My point is that, in high schools throughout the country, your ideas already are happening. ancianita Apr 2014 #398

Not exactly. I had to do community service, but it wasn't long and it wasn't all that much AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #402

I see. Okay. Well, Americorps is pretty national, I'd say. Also, CNCS. Here's info. ancianita Apr 2014 #483

Yeah those are certainly places to start AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #492

I rather like the idea libodem Apr 2014 #400

Thanks for your input AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #407

Who cares if Israel does ohheckyeah Apr 2014 #441

That would work real well in Nebraska. You know, what with buses and trains and whatnot. WinkyDink Apr 2014 #530

Welp... logistics might be a problem there for anything? ancianita Apr 2014 #540

This message was self-deleted by its author ForgoTheConsequence Apr 2014 #381

I agree there should be some mandatory service... ljm2002 Apr 2014 #395

Perhaps it shouldn't be the default, I was just thinking of one model. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #399

I agree. A national service BainsBane Apr 2014 #421

Exactly what I've been saying AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #432

Not sure about how to structure it BainsBane Apr 2014 #450

Interesting idea AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #461

Not sure BainsBane Apr 2014 #463

I think just cutting off some services and rights would be in store for those who dodge AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #467

What this town needs is an enema! Rex Apr 2014 #449

Thanks, pangaia Apr 2014 #581

Oh man, this thread gave me a popcorn tummy-ache. U4ikLefty Apr 2014 #453

I would support this if ... LoveIsNow Apr 2014 #479

I think we agree AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #480

Yeah, boot camp. LoveIsNow Apr 2014 #560

What if someone says they don't want to do boot camp AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #562

You're taking two years out of the safest 8 years for childbearing Warpy Apr 2014 #503

that's one way of looking at it AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #505

First, let's see if we can get Congress to put in a solid six month's work every year. merrily Apr 2014 #513

Yeah, that should be a higher priority :P AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #514

The poor thank you. WinkyDink Apr 2014 #528

For what? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #533

SARCASM. Like they can just give up two years of measly minimum wage? WinkyDink Apr 2014 #579

I'll tell you, there are some folks I work with that would benefit. Glassunion Apr 2014 #534

Who exactly are you referring to? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #538

A handful of coworkers. Glassunion Apr 2014 #547

Lazy people and such? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #549

Not sure what your getting at. P.S. Welcome to DU! Glassunion Apr 2014 #550

Not sure what you're getting at either :P And thanks for the welcome AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #554

I'm simply stating... Glassunion Apr 2014 #557

Heh, good point :) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #563

They don't iron anything, anymore. It ain't yer daddy's military. MADem Apr 2014 #551

Neat! I gotta get some of those. Glassunion Apr 2014 #555

If you're ex-military just swing by the uniform shop; they've got 'em by the hundreds. nt MADem Apr 2014 #558

Nope. Not ex-military. Glassunion Apr 2014 #565

Uniform items are made in our good ole USA. MADem Apr 2014 #569

There have been misses. But mostly home runs. Glassunion Apr 2014 #574

Only for those that start wars lostincalifornia Apr 2014 #577

This would be good for the children of the rich. JEFF9K Apr 2014 #585

Why the rich in particular? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #597

Your last paragraph is how all of the proposals have been structured for the last several years Ms. Toad Apr 2014 #589

What's your point? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #598

Mandatory service contingent on participation in military training Ms. Toad Apr 2014 #601

Why? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #604

Do you really want to discriminate against all the people who cannot participate Ms. Toad Apr 2014 #661

I don't see how it's "discrimination" its just expectation of service and duty AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #664

I am responding directly to exactly what you wrote. Ms. Toad Apr 2014 #678

Define "discrimination" in this case? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #679

This country has long recognized conscientious objection to war Ms. Toad Apr 2014 #688

I mean this AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #689

You are the one who tied your proposal for civil service to military training. Ms. Toad Apr 2014 #709

Btw, couldn't these people just do civil service? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #690

If you read through the subthread - Ms. Toad Apr 2014 #707

Oh this is easy AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #708

Nope. Non-starter. Period. Ms. Toad Apr 2014 #710

Being that very few are true CO's (normally just religious folks who object to all armies) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #713

Tell that to the young men Ms. Toad Apr 2014 #721

The military registry (Selective Service) has a valid purpose, and it should be enforced AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #727

and limit deferments to four Demonaut Apr 2014 #615

What do you mean? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #617

the dick Cheney had 5 for Vietnam...it was sarcasm Demonaut Apr 2014 #624

I laughed pinboy3niner Apr 2014 #626

Hmm? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #628

As a condition of voting, perhaps Android3.14 Apr 2014 #629

How do you figure? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #630

That reminds me of a story... I read, and was made into a lousy movie nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #641

Doesn't that story revolve around required service for citizens of Earth? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #680

Yes, but the background is that the military was treated so bad nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #682

Okay, not such a bright future that author thought up... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #685

Heinlein, like Rand, SwankyXomb Apr 2014 #706

And he is very entertaining. But unlike Rand nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #717

If Wikipedia is to be trusted, I say he had some good ideas AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #977

Not military. But I like the idea. And your job depends upon your parents income--in reverse. McCamy Taylor Apr 2014 #646

Cool idea! AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #649

In your original profile you said you would be joining the military soon Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #656

I think she also said she was 19 - TBF Apr 2014 #687

Google is useful. *link inside* LeftyMom Apr 2014 #699

There it is - TBF Apr 2014 #723

I mostly agree, but disagree with military being the "default". MH1 Apr 2014 #659

You're probably right in the end, and I feel I didn't really express myself well enough in my OP AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #665

No. Tierra_y_Libertad Apr 2014 #662

Do you have a tradition of military service in your family, AscertainLiz? cemaphonic Apr 2014 #663

Yes indeed I do have a military tradition, my dad served in the Army for starters AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #666

That is why when I speak of national service nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #683

Yeah I'm starting with agree with you here AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #686

Supposedly you're 19. Need directions to a recruiter's office? Or is service for Other People? LeftyMom Apr 2014 #698

Did ten years, hubby retired from the Navy after 21 years nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #702

Thank you so much for this. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #705

The fact that a supposed adult is resorting to such childish insults and trolling AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #704

So we're not going to get to see your enlistment photo? LeftyMom Apr 2014 #711

I'm not doing what? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #712

You're 19. Why do you keep saying you're going to join and why haven't you done it? LeftyMom Apr 2014 #714

I really want to know how you know such intimate details of my life AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #715

Do you even know the procedure for enlistment nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #718

Everyone I know who wanted to sign up did so at 17. Little Liz must have the laziest recruiter ever. LeftyMom Apr 2014 #719

And I know people who joined at 25 nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #720

I'm not even sure what I said that offended her so badly? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #724

National service nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #725

But disagree with it all you want, but why is it the most evil thing to suggest to some here? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #728

Actually I didn't go immediately into it after HS because I was considering my options AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #733

Well I for one am glad TBF Apr 2014 #734

Kids are far more active in social media nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #744

This is not facebook - and my nieces wouldn't TBF Apr 2014 #751

It is social media nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #752

Nadin, you needn't insult me - TBF Apr 2014 #768

See here is where we disagree nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #770

Nope - TBF Apr 2014 #771

My lord, whatever nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #775

of course you see "classic bully behavior" Kali Apr 2014 #789

You will join as soon as you "everything I want to do beforehand is done"? uppityperson Apr 2014 #736

Bet it's a lengthy bucket list! greatauntoftriplets Apr 2014 #754

Fuck that bullshit. That is nothing more then slavery. bowens43 Apr 2014 #726

Do you think the same about taxation, compulsory education and the like? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #730

I wish adults could leave the nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #731

Yeah, I'm surprised at the vitriolic response I've gotten AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #794

I wonder whose kids end up on the ground in Afghanistan and whose are in the Nebraska Coast guard. hughee99 Apr 2014 #745

I'd rather just everyone serve in the Guard, and leave the Army/Marines etc voluntary AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #792

your premise on the result of mandatory conscription (read legalized slavery) is deeply flawed 2banon Apr 2014 #748

It is a policy that on principle I support nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #755

The oligarchy would LOVE to institute a draft for wars for their profits. 2banon Apr 2014 #757

On the contrary nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #758

It is cheaper for the military to hire contractors to do certain jobs, such as chow halls which are. actslikeacarrot Apr 2014 #760

The current setup of the military is very much nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #761

I think a draft for National Service would have been appropriate after 9/11 AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #804

Don't presume you know my life, you don't. 2banon Apr 2014 #762

And it is vietnam why you will *NOT see a draft of a military type,* or any other type. nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #763

I'm not ignoring. I'm insisting that national service is a SEPARATE policy. 2banon Apr 2014 #764

Suffice it to say 911 was the moment. nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #766

For me the msg was: any pretext will do to invade another country based on bullshit lies. n/t 2banon Apr 2014 #767

That was later nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #769

uh no i disagree. Bush was beating war drums against the axis of evil before 9/11. I knew on 9/11 2banon Apr 2014 #772

So there was a draft and nobody got drafted? nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #773

huh? I didn't say that. I think you need to get some rest.. I'm done here. 2banon Apr 2014 #776

No I do not need rest nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #778

Somehow they always get their war - TBF Apr 2014 #774

Yeah they got their war nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #777

I truly have no idea what TBF Apr 2014 #779

Prot�g�e, that is a new one nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #780

I get what you're saying - TBF Apr 2014 #784

I don't give a hoot about spellonkers. nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #788

It's insanity, in my view. someone up thread actually said the Vietnam war was a good war. 2banon Apr 2014 #781

It was not nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #782

I admit at first I only considered the military AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #795

I'm not convinced just because people disagree AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #793

I've been around a long long time.. I've thought these matters all my adult life. 2banon Apr 2014 #799

Service is not slavery, stop belittling history and those who suffer in slavery today by comparing AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #802

I'm trying to remember the last time Finland and Norway invaded other countries in the past century. 2banon Apr 2014 #803

So conscription is only slavery if one goes to war? I don't see how that makes any sense AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #805

Jury results Major Nikon Apr 2014 #809

Thanks, though I didn't mean to anger or piss anyone off AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #811

Really? Can you explain this post: Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #815

A Draft? agbdf Apr 2014 #753

Some of your questions are answered in the links in my OP AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #791

I agree with this idea with some modifications - wundermaus Apr 2014 #756

A funny idea AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #790

What's the bootcamp for? stone space Apr 2014 #808

I think everyone should be trained in civil defense and you need to be able to take orders and AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #816

Well, you've deleted all of your OPs TBF Apr 2014 #814

Interesting. Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #818

Just saw that. hrmjustin Apr 2014 #820

I wonder if she can be convinced to delete this one also? Kingofalldems Apr 2014 #821

If only ..... nt TBF Apr 2014 #822

Not from her journal. LeftyMom Apr 2014 #941

I think your wrong and an interesting challenge. hrmjustin Apr 2014 #819

Why am I wrong? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #824

I do not think people should serve in the military unless they want to. hrmjustin Apr 2014 #825

You haven't said why though AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #827

I don't think people should be forced to take up arms. hrmjustin Apr 2014 #828

But that's why you disagree, not why I'm "wrong" AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #832

My views are why you are wrong. hrmjustin Apr 2014 #833

No, you're telling me why you disagree with me, not why I'm wrong. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #836

I made my points on why you are wrong. hrmjustin Apr 2014 #837

Nope, you said why you disagree personally, not why I'm objectively wrong. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #838

You can keep if you like but you just don't like my argument. hrmjustin Apr 2014 #840

You don't have an argument though, you just said you don't like it. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #842

Keep posting if you want but I gave you my thoughts. hrmjustin Apr 2014 #843

Oh well :/ AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #844

Why would a "CO" require boot camp? Live and Learn Apr 2014 #831

I think everyone should have to be trained for some level of civil defense AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #834

Easy to leave the country? Live and Learn Apr 2014 #890

I'd personally think it would be easy to make it easier for those who've fled to renounce their AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #900

I think we should bring back part of the New Deal by having able bodied people on welfare do say 10 craigmatic Apr 2014 #839

I hope you're not just being sarcastic AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #841

No I'm completely serious. FDR did not give out checks without work to get them. craigmatic Apr 2014 #845

Yeah, we're in agreement then AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #847

Yes it can all it takes is a new law and maybe an executive order. This should not be controversial. craigmatic Apr 2014 #849

I don't know, I see entitled Americans having a collective fit about it... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #851

Or we could make this a nation more worth defending... Orsino Apr 2014 #846

The problem is a professional all volunteer military like that breeds a huge amount of problems AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #848

You may be too young to remember the draft and its problems... Orsino Apr 2014 #854

I'm 19, but I'm well aware of the problems the draft had AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #855

A draft in which upper economic brackets were better represented... Orsino Apr 2014 #863

Actually, I'd want equal representation. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #864

This is circular, I'm afraid. Orsino Apr 2014 #868

I think a draft is a war killer as I said before AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #870

Not everyone that can serves in Switzerland. nt Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #886

So? What's your point? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #897

I will not draft others into service... Orsino Apr 2014 #889

I think a draft would put the brakes on the war machine AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #898

A society not run by the war pigs... Orsino Apr 2014 #1013

I don't think it's the only thing to do AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1015

Making the draft "fair" is like making TBF Apr 2014 #891

Thread is epic... Jesus Malverde Apr 2014 #850

Yup. TBF Apr 2014 #892

If it is to go off and fight someone elses wars - NO FUCKING WAY! liberal N proud Apr 2014 #852

Just curious, what do you mean by "someone else's wars"? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #853

It is wrong to be sending our kids off to fight in wars that some oligarch cooked up liberal N proud Apr 2014 #859

What about wars of necessity? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #861

It's an excellent idea that we all make our country better. "Don't ask what your country can do for Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2014 #857

Exactly. Unfortunately Americans nowadays would bemoan and fight against it AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #858

Bad attitudes and selfishness abound nowadays. Must be excessive watching of reality BS TV shows Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2014 #860

Lol, that could be it :P AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #862

Party of Choice??? onpatrol98 Apr 2014 #880

It would be strange if I were advocating people having to be in National Service for the rest of AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #881

Did you just read "Starship Troopers"? Prophet 451 Apr 2014 #884

No, but I did see the movie with my boyfriend a couple weeks ago AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #893

Not just no, LostOne4Ever Apr 2014 #885

As opposed to "voluntary conscription"? I don't follow AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #894

Voluntary conscription LostOne4Ever Apr 2014 #916

Oh? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #919

It is stripping them of their autonomy and possibly their life against their will LostOne4Ever Apr 2014 #945

Is mandatory education "stripping them of their autonomy and possibly their life against their will AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #957

Children are not adults LostOne4Ever Apr 2014 #961

18 year olds are always mature adults? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #968

Are all 18 year olds mature? No they are not. LostOne4Ever Apr 2014 #986

Well yes some old folks aren't mature AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #993

Mandatory service is a good idea fadedrose Apr 2014 #920

Why do you think it's a good idea? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #921

Because it was a way for young people to leave home fadedrose Apr 2014 #922

Interesting perspective, didn't expect to read this here on DU AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #923

If we are going to have a "standing army" no reason we shouldn't have mandatory service to fill it. Agony Apr 2014 #924

Which would you do if you were in power? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #925

Given the state that our "advanced" civilization is in there is no chance Agony Apr 2014 #926

Then what would you do exactly? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #927

eliminate poverty so there isn't anyone interested in "volunteering" to "serve" to fight their wars. Agony Apr 2014 #928

How would you eliminate poverty? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #929

There would be plenty of volunteers for the Smaller Military AndyTiedye May 2014 #1041

How do you figure? AcertainLiz May 2014 #1048

Totally agree fadedrose Apr 2014 #936

Out of curosity, what would you do about it if you had the power to change things? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #939

What the fresh hell is this nonsense? Jasana Apr 2014 #930

This argument could be used against everything from taxes to education AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #931

Hello! This is MY physical body you're talking about... Jasana Apr 2014 #933

Again, your argument could be used against education, jury duty, taxation, etc. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #938

You just don't understand the word no do you? Jasana Apr 2014 #940

So we shoudn't force people to do anything? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #942

We are two very different people and we think very differently. Jasana Apr 2014 #947

I think you're saying exemptions to the rule should invalidate the true AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #960

If you are saying all Americans should be required... Jasana May 2014 #1029

I still don't understand how you can agree with other mandatory AcertainLiz May 2014 #1044

Great answer! Jamastiene Apr 2014 #959

Not really, as it's a very selective argument... AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #976

Wow! Talk about the thread that don't end. hrmjustin Apr 2014 #932

Is that good or bad? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #937

LMAO AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #944

Forget it, she's rolling pinboy3niner Apr 2014 #948

So, Acertainliz AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #946

I believe you are on to something maddezmom Apr 2014 #951

I thought you said you were done with the thread nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #978

I thought you were ignoring me AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #981

You need to carefully read what I told you nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #985

Sorry I am kind of done with you AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #987

Have a good day putting me on ignore nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #988

Just skimmed thru this gigantic thread maddezmom Apr 2014 #949

I know one thing. This is not a 19 year old OKNancy Apr 2014 #950

What? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #954

Yep. You know.... AnalystInParadise Apr 2014 #984

Well, you see how popular the draft was. Jamastiene Apr 2014 #952

The draft is a war killer AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #955

Did you say you were from a red state? octoberlib Apr 2014 #956

Hmm? No, I'm from California, why do you ask? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #958

I agree, but more importantly, I just want to see this thread break 1000 posts. A HERETIC I AM Apr 2014 #982

So K and fuckin' arrrrrrrrrr. A HERETIC I AM Apr 2014 #983

You agree? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #990

OK, Let's take stock, shall we? (Edited) A HERETIC I AM Apr 2014 #995

I will help get to a thou nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #996

Lol, thanks :) AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1011

998! n/t A HERETIC I AM Apr 2014 #998

999! n/t A HERETIC I AM Apr 2014 #999

1000!!!!!! AHHHHH HA HAHAHAHAHAHAH1111 ELEBENS!!!!! A HERETIC I AM Apr 2014 #1000

Why is it a good idea? AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1005

I don't know you from Adam but zappaman Apr 2014 #991

ROFL - good one OKNancy Apr 2014 #1003

you R funny! cyberswede Apr 2014 #1026

What this thread needs is an enema! Rex Apr 2014 #992

Before that could even be considered the USA needs to have a mandatory service requirement from its R. Daneel Olivaw Apr 2014 #1001

That sounds like an interesting idea AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1007

At gunpoint. R. Daneel Olivaw Apr 2014 #1018

LOL okay we can agree on that. AcertainLiz Apr 2014 #1021

Your flag ain't my flag, ZombieHorde Apr 2014 #1028

We don't both have the American flag? :/ AcertainLiz May 2014 #1049

A flag is two things. ZombieHorde May 2014 #1053

So you care nothing for America? Alright AcertainLiz May 2014 #1055

I care about people regardless of they live on this planet. ZombieHorde May 2014 #1057

You de facto called me a right winger by accusing what I suggest as being "right wing" AcertainLiz May 2014 #1059

I disagree. wickerwoman May 2014 #1030

It does already though? AcertainLiz May 2014 #1050

Does DU have a mandatory posting requirement for this thread? NuclearDem May 2014 #1036

There's always some idiot who will kick it back to the top *evilgrin* pinboy3niner May 2014 #1037

Ouch, I had that one coming. NuclearDem May 2014 #1038

You and me both, lol! nt pinboy3niner May 2014 #1039

It's certainly on the way to competing with kentauros May 2014 #1040

As long as service didn't include only military service or boot camps... glowing May 2014 #1052

Yeah we pretty much agree then AcertainLiz May 2014 #1054

It's a really good way to broaden one's experience, for the most part. glowing May 2014 #1056

Wow, we are on the same wave length then AcertainLiz May 2014 #1062

Parks Service MerryBlooms May 2014 #1060

So you'd have mandatory civil service? AcertainLiz May 2014 #1063