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In reply to the discussion: Democrats Who Move Right Lose Elections – There Is No “Center” [View all]markpkessinger
(8,909 posts)78. Here's a blogpost I wrore in December 2010 on this subject . . .
. . . on OpenSalon.com:
The Mythical Independent Middle
Marist College has released the results of a poll conducted from Dec. 2 through Wed. Dec. 8, the day the President announced his initial deal with the GOP on the Bush tax cuts, indicating that the President's approval rating has slipped still further. The deal with the GOP was, of course, exactly what most of the Beltway political pundits had been saying he needed to do following the results of the mid-term elections: move more to the right (the pundits calling moving to the center more on that in a moment). This, they said, was how he could win back independent voters.
Well, folks, guess which group's approval of the President remained virtually unchanged as a result of his rightward capitulation: that's right, INDEPENDENTS. The ratings among independents were 39% favorable and 52% unfavorable. A month ago, the same group's ratings of the President were 38% and 54%, respectively. On the other hand, his favorable rating among Democrats dropped nine percentage points, from 83% to 74%, and among liberals from 78% to 69%, while his unfavorable rating among Democrats nearly doubled from 11% to 21%, and among liberals from 14% to 22%.
The fact that the President has realized no sudden boost of support among independents following his move to the center on the tax cut deal ought to (but probably won't) permanently put to rest the the notion being perpetuated by the D.C. punditry that the midterms were a vote against the President's liberal policies. Independents are not a cohesive political group; they are all over the map, with some of them more liberal than most democrats and some more conservative than some of the hardest right GOP legislators. Many of them are not even consistently left-leaning or right-leaning, but in fact lean different ways on different issues. Independents are simply unaffiliated with either of the two parties, for reasons which vary from person to person. Some are independent simply because they've never registered as members of a party. Others are unaffiliated because they lack confidence in either party. Thus, the suggestion that the President will win over disaffected independents simply by aiming for the midpoint between the current Democratic and Republican party positions on any given issue is absurd on its face. Senate and House Democrats now occupy what has historically been the center position in the American political spectrum, and the GOP has gone off a rightward cliff. So the President, by aiming for a mythical midpoint, succeeds no only in offending his core constituency, but by arriving at a place that is, in fact, pretty far to the right, he likewise fails to gain credibility with many independents.
Nevertheless, so much of the media continues to speak of independents as if they are a cohesive constituency whose preferences lie between Democrats and the GOP. Part of this, I think, may be a function of the one-dimensional, left-right visual metaphor we use to describe the range of political ideas in this country. In reality, political ideas are probably better plotted in three-dimensional space rather than along a uni-dimensional left-right axis. So I think we too often allow the left-right visual metaphor drive our thinking about the relationships of various ideological positions relative to one another, and thus find ourselves with no place left along our one-dimensional line in which to place independent voters except in the middle, between the two parties. But it simply is not a reflection of reality.
The message for the President in all this should be that if he were to actually feed, water, give adequate sunshine and talk nicely to the progressive constituency, and fight for progressive values, he would, in fact, bring a long a good number of those independents (not all of them certainly, but I bet it would be enough).
Read more: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/12/10/105105/poll-obama...
Marist College has released the results of a poll conducted from Dec. 2 through Wed. Dec. 8, the day the President announced his initial deal with the GOP on the Bush tax cuts, indicating that the President's approval rating has slipped still further. The deal with the GOP was, of course, exactly what most of the Beltway political pundits had been saying he needed to do following the results of the mid-term elections: move more to the right (the pundits calling moving to the center more on that in a moment). This, they said, was how he could win back independent voters.
Well, folks, guess which group's approval of the President remained virtually unchanged as a result of his rightward capitulation: that's right, INDEPENDENTS. The ratings among independents were 39% favorable and 52% unfavorable. A month ago, the same group's ratings of the President were 38% and 54%, respectively. On the other hand, his favorable rating among Democrats dropped nine percentage points, from 83% to 74%, and among liberals from 78% to 69%, while his unfavorable rating among Democrats nearly doubled from 11% to 21%, and among liberals from 14% to 22%.
The fact that the President has realized no sudden boost of support among independents following his move to the center on the tax cut deal ought to (but probably won't) permanently put to rest the the notion being perpetuated by the D.C. punditry that the midterms were a vote against the President's liberal policies. Independents are not a cohesive political group; they are all over the map, with some of them more liberal than most democrats and some more conservative than some of the hardest right GOP legislators. Many of them are not even consistently left-leaning or right-leaning, but in fact lean different ways on different issues. Independents are simply unaffiliated with either of the two parties, for reasons which vary from person to person. Some are independent simply because they've never registered as members of a party. Others are unaffiliated because they lack confidence in either party. Thus, the suggestion that the President will win over disaffected independents simply by aiming for the midpoint between the current Democratic and Republican party positions on any given issue is absurd on its face. Senate and House Democrats now occupy what has historically been the center position in the American political spectrum, and the GOP has gone off a rightward cliff. So the President, by aiming for a mythical midpoint, succeeds no only in offending his core constituency, but by arriving at a place that is, in fact, pretty far to the right, he likewise fails to gain credibility with many independents.
Nevertheless, so much of the media continues to speak of independents as if they are a cohesive constituency whose preferences lie between Democrats and the GOP. Part of this, I think, may be a function of the one-dimensional, left-right visual metaphor we use to describe the range of political ideas in this country. In reality, political ideas are probably better plotted in three-dimensional space rather than along a uni-dimensional left-right axis. So I think we too often allow the left-right visual metaphor drive our thinking about the relationships of various ideological positions relative to one another, and thus find ourselves with no place left along our one-dimensional line in which to place independent voters except in the middle, between the two parties. But it simply is not a reflection of reality.
The message for the President in all this should be that if he were to actually feed, water, give adequate sunshine and talk nicely to the progressive constituency, and fight for progressive values, he would, in fact, bring a long a good number of those independents (not all of them certainly, but I bet it would be enough).
Read more: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/12/10/105105/poll-obama...
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Even worse - 40 years ago they would have been Republicans, but they've been thrown out
corkhead
Apr 2014
#31
Couldn't agree more. Those who argue for moving right to capture the mythical middle ...
Scuba
Apr 2014
#2
and what evidence do you have of that. All the poll numbers seem to disagree with your assessment
lostincalifornia
Apr 2014
#128
Great example Scuba! Our NY Gov is yet another fine example of placating to Wall St and the 1%
adirondacker
Apr 2014
#58
Too many democrats don't have the guts to stand up for their base, but rather cave in with
RKP5637
Apr 2014
#3
Funny how it's okay to vote for or at least tacitly support certain Republicans, see Christie
sabrina 1
Apr 2014
#13
It's not just that they won't vote for you -- they're less likely to work for you, too,
winter is coming
Apr 2014
#16
Yep. After we fund the coprorations to figure out who we are allowed to vote for.
raouldukelives
Apr 2014
#25
Obama understood this and campaigned far to the left of his actual positions in 08.
NorthCarolina
Apr 2014
#26
Karl Rove succeeded in getting a man with a brain the size of a goldfish elected. His METHODS
TrollBuster9090
Apr 2014
#91
"Not as bad" rings up a lot of No Sales who want to vote for something.
Tierra_y_Libertad
Apr 2014
#30
The opposite is certainly true of presidential elections - centrists have won, leftists have lost.
Donald Ian Rankin
Apr 2014
#32
The problem for Kerry (assuming he really lost Ohio), Gore and Dukakis was that all three
JDPriestly
Apr 2014
#38
Which is why Bush never became President, and the Iraq war never happened.
Donald Ian Rankin
Apr 2014
#71
People voted for Obama believing him to be far more liberal than he actually was.
Enthusiast
Apr 2014
#75
Karl Rove LOST his 2 most recent campaigns. Remember how shocked he was in Ohio?
pnwmom
Apr 2014
#34
Karl Rove put a chimpanzee in the White House TWICE by convincing a narrow slice of 3 million
TrollBuster9090
Apr 2014
#88
Independents and swing voters also voted for Bush, not just far right Republicans.
pnwmom
Apr 2014
#92
Indeed ...the more centrist they are the more likely they could vote for a centrist repuke.
L0oniX
Apr 2014
#118
In fact, far less than 50% of eligible voters ever turn out to vote. In my experience, they usually
TrollBuster9090
Apr 2014
#86
Democrats who run in red states are blue dogs for a reason. Howard Dean understood this with his 50
lostincalifornia
Apr 2014
#127
especially in midterms & national Dems having been kicking most loyal foot soldiers, teachers
yurbud
Apr 2014
#51
If two politicians agree, you don't need one of 'em. If the Democrats can't come up
jtuck004
Apr 2014
#53
Spying, TPP, no Wall Street prosecutions, death of net neutrality, fracking, drill baby drill
pragmatic_dem
Apr 2014
#96
Do you believe that a base voter in a red state is different then a base voter in blue state?
lostincalifornia
Apr 2014
#126