General Discussion

el_bryanto

(11,804 posts)

15. You need to define what you mean by racism before you quote Dave Marsh

Fri May 9, 2014, 11:53 AM

May 2014

If it just means antipathy for another person because of their race than it's sort of nonsensical - but if it is more about how whites can impose their racism because they have societal privilege, than it's more or less accurate.

Actually it also conflates racism and white privilege which are two different things. Every white person benefits from white privilege whether they are racist or not - but when you bring up racism it's human nature to zone in on that aspect of it. People do a mental calculation in which they divide the world up into racists (like say that Bundy fellow) and non-racists, and then put themselves on the right side of the line.

As for the main question, some understand and acknowledge it and others don't.

Bryant

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

222 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Do white liberals understand the white privilege they receive daily? [View all] randys1 May 2014 OP

Every problem that anyone has on earth is my fault. Marshall III May 2014 #1

Favorite group: Gun Control & RKBA. Member since: Thu Apr 10, 2014. DanTex May 2014 #12

I don't have a "Favorite Group", although I may argue often in those forums. Marshall III May 2014 #27

Oh we understand alright.... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #40

Yeah, no pigeon holing people here. Marshall III May 2014 #44

this is DEMOCRATIC Underground...that IS the "pigeon hole" of this entire site... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #51

It's the group you have posted the most to, it's in your profile Fumesucker May 2014 #41

Like I said, I ofgten argue or comment where the news takes me. Marshall III May 2014 #59

Been Here Forever RobinA May 2014 #74

Actually, it's because you sound like a right-winger here. Scootaloo May 2014 #77

Why? RobinA May 2014 #139

As someone familiar with the way the right casts race issues yes, because I say so Scootaloo May 2014 #160

"forgive me for being white" horse shit is exactly it. bettyellen May 2014 #190

1) Why would you apologize for being white? NCTraveler May 2014 #79

Are you eating worms now? You should be. nt raccoon May 2014 #91

Mixed With RobinA May 2014 #140

Ground glass doesn't work very well. Jackpine Radical May 2014 #157

As was your original comment, too? LanternWaste May 2014 #49

And that is relevant how? Ohhhhhh that's right. Stereotyping and bias on DU The Straight Story May 2014 #64

It's almost like DU has its own self-appointed intelligence service. Comrade Grumpy May 2014 #108

Well, I suspected that Ted Nugentesque views on one issue might bleed over into Ted Nugentesque DanTex May 2014 #116

So views on issues become calling names or refering to one person The Straight Story May 2014 #117

For example, when Cliven Bundy rolls up with his militia buddies and refuses to recognize DanTex May 2014 #120

What are you talking about? Marshall III May 2014 #125

+1 NutmegYankee May 2014 #215

Hey, Dan! What's your favorite group? Eleanors38 May 2014 #182

See, here's the problem: Paladin May 2014 #68

You comment makes as much sense as the glamorizing the murder of Muslims. Marshall III May 2014 #94

Even if you claim white privilege, your responses need to make sense. Paladin May 2014 #97

Glamorization of th crusades is in now? Marshall III May 2014 #106

Nah. I'm just a big Richard Boone fan. Enjoy your stay. (nt) Paladin May 2014 #109

Bless your heart. Heidi May 2014 #103

Yep, that's exactly what the OP said arcane1 May 2014 #127

And that is what too many, hard working, blue collar, white, middle class men and women, Marshall III May 2014 #131

Don't you mean ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #166

No I don't mean that at all. Marshall III May 2014 #181

How many times will you read ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #184

How do you know what struggles I face? Marshall III May 2014 #188

I'm not telling you ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #191

He doesn't claim to. He knows the struggles you typically would not face due to racism. bettyellen May 2014 #194

Perhaps before posting anymore laundry_queen May 2014 #207

I'd file that under "no" RedCappedBandit May 2014 #186

Have you not read the race threads on the front page? gollygee May 2014 #2

that's one answer Supersedeas May 2014 #210

I guess Dave Marsh only hangs out with white people. dilby May 2014 #3

You don't understand that Racism involves having power over someone VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #43

My boss owned a business he had power over people. dilby May 2014 #48

If he didn't hire other people then THAT is racism! VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #54

My theory is anyone can be a racist and it does not require power. dilby May 2014 #67

but YOUR theory is wrong... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #69

Let me help you rephrase that in less threatening terms ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #172

Thank you....said perfectly..... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #174

if the subject matter actually interests you, then read up why it is important to POC that bigotry bettyellen May 2014 #78

In terms of *intrapersonal* racism, at least, that is *absolutely* correct. AverageJoe90 May 2014 #192

exactly, when it begins and ends with personal animus, it is bigotry. And that folks, is why the bettyellen May 2014 #73

and you are exactly right too! VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #81

and trying to change the widely accepted terminology because you'd rather not think about it- bettyellen May 2014 #90

Yes 100%! VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #130

I don't think it's because they'd rather not think about it gollygee May 2014 #133

yeah the attempts at renaming it "POC dispriviledge" demonstate this pretty well. If you have to bettyellen May 2014 #138

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #76

No there is actually a big difference VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #83

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #86

read my previous response VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #88

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #104

No back to the "definitions mean something" thing VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #129

they are redefining the word in order to Niceguy1 May 2014 #180

You think having an bigoted neighbor is the same as having a bigoted police force, workplace ... bettyellen May 2014 #193

not all white peoplehave power Niceguy1 May 2014 #196

Power is not an absolute but relative. bettyellen May 2014 #217

I Think RobinA May 2014 #87

It isn't dishonest. It's basic sociology. nt redqueen May 2014 #98

Changing the Meanings RobinA May 2014 #144

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #167

It is LITERALLY Sociology 101 material. redqueen May 2014 #175

Yes it is. Took sociology 101 last term laundry_queen May 2014 #208

some many didn't take the close and assign the material a number Supersedeas May 2014 #214

LOL, that was a wild guess stated with such assurance I have to laugh. Pick up a text book, LOL. bettyellen May 2014 #178

I had the same conversation with him and I'm just going to have to agree to disagree Revanchist May 2014 #110

"racist is now one of the worst things you can call someone" when wasn't it? LOL. Welcome to DU.... bettyellen May 2014 #111

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #124

No you again missed the point.... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #132

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #163

No if you are reading this thread... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #164

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #165

I am not redefiining.... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #170

Bullshit ismnotwasm May 2014 #171

Oh really....you are being told over and over again on this thread you are wrong...but here you go.. VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #173

im dating an Asian, too Niceguy1 May 2014 #179

Dave Marsh is wrong. Throd May 2014 #4

How so? Supersedeas May 2014 #113

What is the remedy? seveneyes May 2014 #5

I am sure the remedy is a long term issue, but I was just asking if white liberals randys1 May 2014 #9

Many White male Liberals do not recognize their privilege VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #55

Denial of something as simple and straight-forward as this Supersedeas May 2014 #211

I don't know how they call themselves Liberal with this point of view.... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #216

giving the same privileges to those that don't have it maybe? VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #46

Exactly seveneyes May 2014 #60

Many can't make that distinction ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #119

S I G H randys1 May 2014 #6

Even in countries where whites are the minority? B2G May 2014 #8

Why did I put (america) in EACH time randys1 May 2014 #11

So if someone lives in another country where they are the majority B2G May 2014 #18

racism is a function of power of the majority over the minority randys1 May 2014 #23

hatred is not racism unless that person has power over someone else VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #47

Where are you and Randys1 getting that definition from? Revanchist May 2014 #71

It is what it is.....for your edification VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #80

Thanks for the link, although I disagree with his thought process Revanchist May 2014 #84

No that would be your opinion... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #85

and they argue about the word instead of dealing with their privilege randys1 May 2014 #135

Yes because the semantics argument deflects from having to face your own.... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #141

And if the landlord was black B2G May 2014 #143

Can you prove that happens systemically? VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #145

That doesn't matter B2G May 2014 #147

Yes it DOES matter.... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #148

Then how can you claim you couldn't be a racist B2G May 2014 #149

As I said...ONE theoretical story...does not change the facts... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #150

You're making this up as you go along, aren't you? B2G May 2014 #151

No I am not....or are you ignoring others on this thread who are telling you the exact same thing VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #155

And you are changing the meaning of words B2G May 2014 #158

No that would be YOU! VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #159

You posted, and I quote B2G May 2014 #161

I'm White... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #162

If gollygee May 2014 #152

Thank you for explaining it better than I was doing... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #156

It isn't strictly tied to population numbers. Sheldon Cooper May 2014 #32

exactly ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #72

I was going to answer B2G by bringing that up redqueen May 2014 #95

SIGH.... another Mark Twain was right thread! whistler162 May 2014 #16

So a neighborhood with an Asian majority and a black minority can't have racism? dilby May 2014 #28

You're New RobinA May 2014 #82

I have read enough to see people have a very simplistic view of racism. dilby May 2014 #92

Racism and Rape both acts of power what is so hard to understand? Exposethefrauds May 2014 #31

Why can't some non-whites be racists? In this country, Asian men are the highest income group. pnwmom May 2014 #118

Actually a "non-white" person can be racist. Behind the Aegis May 2014 #128

I don't know who Dave Marsh is, and I won't speak to his comments. Sheldon Cooper May 2014 #7

I saw a live taping of Big Bang, I mainly wanted to go to see Kaley in the flesh randys1 May 2014 #17

I think that boiling a complex problem down to white privilege is a gross oversimplification. badtoworse May 2014 #10

Not ridiculous, but you need to understand what racism is first i guess randys1 May 2014 #14

If enlightened means marching and thinking in lock step, then you are correct. badtoworse May 2014 #24

Continuing to refuse to acknowledge racism and how it works is a sad position for you to take randys1 May 2014 #35

Where have I done that? badtoworse May 2014 #58

Would you agree that white supremacy ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #122

To me, the term "white supremacy" means a deliberate and concerted effort... badtoworse May 2014 #134

I knew certain people would focus on that word and be unable to actually discuss this randys1 May 2014 #137

+1000 Louisiana1976 May 2014 #142

White supremacy isn't the root of all racism, no. Spider Jerusalem May 2014 #197

Okay ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #199

Which is understandable... Spider Jerusalem May 2014 #203

Oh, I am fully aware ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #205

Anyone who thinks only whites can be racist doesn't have business commenting on racism JJChambers May 2014 #13

No, you have to use the OP's definition of racism. Throd May 2014 #19

This is something of a semantic argument. Lizzie Poppet May 2014 #61

You need to define what you mean by racism before you quote Dave Marsh el_bryanto May 2014 #15

You are right, but I think even the most liberal white guy can be racist once in a while randys1 May 2014 #20

I use my discount card everywhere! Better than AAA one The Straight Story May 2014 #21

i just got my white privilege card in the mail today. i used it to get out of a ticket (75 mph i leftyohiolib May 2014 #50

This is not as ridiculous as you think. You might get out of a ticket ... kwassa May 2014 #177

What's in YOUR wallet? Gidney N Cloyd May 2014 #96

A white card for a white man. Even the lettering is in white! The Straight Story May 2014 #99

And in Canada they have Moose Privilege: The Straight Story May 2014 #101

This is what I think. Le Taz Hot May 2014 #22

Ashamed? You must have misread me, i didnt ask you about shame randys1 May 2014 #26

The is a much-discussed topic on DU Le Taz Hot May 2014 #30

I'd love to see some links to this subtext you're claiming. Sheldon Cooper May 2014 #36

There is a difference between Le Taz Hot May 2014 #39

Nope, there really is no difference. Sheldon Cooper May 2014 #62

Le Taz Hot, I actually agree with you on this. Eleanors38 May 2014 #187

I'm honestly conflicted about the term "white privilege". DanTex May 2014 #25

^raises hand^ Le Taz Hot May 2014 #33

So it is the connotation that privleged means MORE advantaged than how you yourself feel? bettyellen May 2014 #66

I think you are unnecessarily quibbling about a specific word that has a specific meaning in this Sheldon Cooper May 2014 #65

Yes, I am quibbling over word choice. DanTex May 2014 #121

Eh. Maybe you could find a more useful word, or maybe people could Sheldon Cooper May 2014 #123

I get the "eh". And I agree that many folks are just resistant to the principle. DanTex May 2014 #126

Yes, many of us are aware of it although liberalhistorian May 2014 #29

"Acknowledge your privilege!" is a sure-fire vote-winner. Nye Bevan May 2014 #34

And let's add to that this: The Straight Story May 2014 #37

Why Is This RobinA May 2014 #93

As a white man I resent the use of the term white privilege Capt. Obvious May 2014 #38

Good Italian, is all I ask... randys1 May 2014 #42

It's like Dave used to say: Dr. Strange May 2014 #89

A friend of mine used to live in the same area I moved to a few WhiteTara May 2014 #45

I'm a white male with a mental disorder (Asperger's) Shoulders of Giants May 2014 #52

thank you for your response, i appreciate thoughtful people like yourself randys1 May 2014 #56

I recognize it exists, but I don't beat myself over the head over it, or quinnox May 2014 #53

I certainly do...but it also begs a question: Lizzie Poppet May 2014 #57

hell YES, i know i do randys1 May 2014 #63

I Think RobinA May 2014 #70

Some do some don't. I think a more interesting question is whatthehey May 2014 #75

I know exactly what white priviledge is. Marshall III May 2014 #100

I understand violations to the Rights guaranteed in the Constitution. KansDem May 2014 #102

I'm still reviewing yesterday's lecture, but do go on and explain it all to us again. Comrade Grumpy May 2014 #105

I said this before but it never matters to you upaloopa May 2014 #107

I agree with some of what you write, disagree with some uppityperson May 2014 #112

too soon, people just are not ready to deal with it yet i guess randys1 May 2014 #136

not just conservatives or liberals for that matter but most white Americans Douglas Carpenter May 2014 #114

I just learned something new. If you compare salaries, Asians are the new whites. pnwmom May 2014 #115

As a gay Jew, I know I am so incredibly privileged. Kurska May 2014 #146

Well white privilege is just one kind of privilege. gollygee May 2014 #153

Don't agree with M. Marsh... Mike Nelson May 2014 #154

Yeah, I think about how privileged I am every day while I'm knee deep in garbage. Skeeter Barnes May 2014 #168

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #169

Missing the point beyond the macro, societal level and an individual. uppityperson May 2014 #176

Been hearing thus for nearly 50 yrs. Anything changed? Eleanors38 May 2014 #183

I certainly understand it steve2470 May 2014 #185

TBH, I don't believe in "white privilege".....not as a literal concept, anyway. AverageJoe90 May 2014 #189

saying there is no white privilege is like saying there are no clouds on a cloudy day randys1 May 2014 #195

No such thing as "white privilege", eh? Spider Jerusalem May 2014 #198

I think you raise a good point about the semantics... Hippo_Tron May 2014 #204

White privilege hasn't failed as a teaching tool. kwassa May 2014 #222

No. Iggo May 2014 #200

that's too bad...thought we had accomplished something, guess not randys1 May 2014 #213

Accomplished what, by doing what? Iggo May 2014 #218

By what magic do black, native american or hispanic liberals grok the nature of being white? lumberjack_jeff May 2014 #201

I don't doubt that whites are privileged in many ways senseandsensibility May 2014 #202

Oh for fuck sake, here we go again! CANDO May 2014 #206

You are spot on Puzzledtraveller May 2014 #209

want some cheese with that whine? amazing randys1 May 2014 #212

What do I think? I think your friend Dave Marsh is an idiot. Zavulon May 2014 #219

sigh randys1 May 2014 #220

Well, it is official, answer is for the most part, NO randys1 May 2014 #221