General Discussion

tblue37

(68,086 posts)

215. Every now and then my teaching gene presses me into explaining

Wed May 14, 2014, 10:29 AM

May 2014

things, but as a teacher, I am all too aware that many people are simply not willing to accept information they don't want, no matter how carefully it is explained.

Truth is, BainesBain's recent post explaining that "privilege" doesn't mean that one has it easy, but that one does not have to deal with *extra* obstacles that others from different groups must constantly deal with (or as BB put it, "Privilege = s**t you don't have to deal with&quot should have been clear enough to anyone arguing in good faith. But even that perfectly clear explanation was (deliberately??) misunderstood by the usual suspects.

I have no real hope that this post of mine will move the argument one millimeter further in the direction of reason. I just couldn't let the post I was responding to go unanswered, since the poster so obviously thought s/he had struck the final blow to the argument.

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As a white male I am blamed for all the ills of society [View all] Harmony Blue May 2014 OP

I feel so sorry for you. ret5hd May 2014 #1

Growing up a white male in a poor family... Buddyblazon May 2014 #170

Did you ever have to kill your own food? Scootaloo May 2014 #198

The ol' "One Upper"... Buddyblazon May 2014 #204

Nobody here hates you for being white Scootaloo May 2014 #219

+1000000 Jamastiene May 2014 #272

GASP! You had to pay rent while going to college? Jamastiene May 2014 #276

lol Whisp May 2014 #2

Hold on. I've got something here BainsBane May 2014 #3

+ infinity nomorenomore08 May 2014 #143

I get the impression that he doesn't aid or care for others and wonders why others forsake him. TheBlackAdder May 2014 #250

Yeah, but this one is a change of pace BainsBane May 2014 #252

That reply said quite a lot in so few words. nt TheBlackAdder May 2014 #255

Redefining "the white man's burden"? mulsh May 2014 #4

He who can, must. Sheepshank May 2014 #5

Well speaking a a white man, we seem to have caused all the ills of society. William769 May 2014 #6

Yeah, I suppose we did cause this Boka Haram kidnapping didn't we? CANDO May 2014 #33

Well we damn sure didn't stop it now did we? William769 May 2014 #34

No... but we damn sure did use it to reinforce and validate our petulance LanternWaste May 2014 #38

Post removed Post removed May 2014 #46

Extremist groups, including Islamist groups, in impoverished tblue37 May 2014 #95

EXACTLY laundry_queen May 2014 #155

Every now and then my teaching gene presses me into explaining tblue37 May 2014 #215

I was going to point that out; but, ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #265

I used to enjoy a bit of melodramatic self-martyrdom too. LanternWaste May 2014 #7

I suppose we all might feel "petulant and under-appreciated" from time to time. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #145

Awwww..... Sheldon Cooper May 2014 #8

+1 nomorenomore08 May 2014 #146

I guess you don't know the Irish weren't considered white BainsBane May 2014 #9

"I guess you don't know the Irish weren't considered white" TBH, I think that was actually part..... AverageJoe90 May 2014 #26

No, Feral Child May 2014 #40

That's the opposite of the point he was trying to make. cyberswede May 2014 #49

It's performance art, right? redqueen May 2014 #50

Why else do you think he posted the link on Irish Americans? AverageJoe90 May 2014 #54

He was trying to point out that white people have been discriminated against cyberswede May 2014 #56

Dude below, I'm half Irish BainsBane May 2014 #59

And that actually has happened. The treatment of the Irish was a great example of that. AverageJoe90 May 2014 #60

They weren't discriminated against because they were white... cyberswede May 2014 #63

"They weren't discriminated against because they were white..." That's not what I said, though. AverageJoe90 May 2014 #70

I didn't say you said it... cyberswede May 2014 #76

Well, okay then. AverageJoe90 May 2014 #79

At most, it's white people being discriminated against *by white people*. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #148

many help wanted Niceguy1 May 2014 #64

...because they weren't perceived as "white." nt cyberswede May 2014 #65

No, they were discriminated against BainsBane May 2014 #134

the irish were considered Niceguy1 May 2014 #201

You want unity, listen to those who live the experiences instead of boston bean May 2014 #210

Your version of unity is one that ignores an already existing divide BainsBane May 2014 #212

white people wrote those signs. or should I say whiter people, because that is what the belief was. bettyellen May 2014 #217

It's damn. Just damn. BainsBane May 2014 #133

LOL ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #266

How so? He's trying to downplay the history of racism in America by going "See? White people have nomorenomore08 May 2014 #147

Post removed Post removed May 2014 #39

What a steaming load of bollocks. riqster May 2014 #10

I have to take issue with a part of what you wrote ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #269

We are, among white people. riqster May 2014 #281

Please take this as educational ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #284

I'd say none of these distinctions are based on race. riqster May 2014 #285

While I appreciate your opinion ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #286

I hear you. I am not advocating some sort of dehumanizing loss of uniqueness. riqster May 2014 #287

Okay ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #291

Thanks to you as well for tolerating my unorthodox POV. riqster May 2014 #292

It's called ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #296

Indeed. And all too rare in these times. riqster May 2014 #297

I neglected to mention, I am a big proponent of the third option. riqster May 2014 #298

Absolutely ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #299

^THIS. Jamastiene May 2014 #273

Wow, if only white men could be in charge of something Lex May 2014 #11

Brilliant! riqster May 2014 #30

I might have to embroider this on a pillow TorchTheWitch May 2014 #68

Posting in adoration! Starry Messenger May 2014 #71

OK you just made this thread worth reading gollygee May 2014 #72

You win the internet :) Marrah_G May 2014 #77

+1 uponit7771 May 2014 #101

well, some do think everything was great until the black guy got there and now things are the worst JI7 May 2014 #119

I love how people purposefully miss the point adigal May 2014 #124

So let me get this right. Lex May 2014 #135

You are so very welcome! adigal May 2014 #267

So at best, you could say they've (partially) cleaned up their own messes... n/t nomorenomore08 May 2014 #149

I don't agree that white men solve most of the problems Harmony Blue May 2014 #205

Not sure to what you are referring adigal May 2014 #268

This is the point at which somebody inevitably says... Hippo_Tron May 2014 #138

Yeah! Make it so! Oh, wait....... Nay May 2014 #140

Or, if white men could just .... 1StrongBlackMan May 2014 #270

LoL. myrna minx May 2014 #12

hmm... a little cheez to go with your whine: chervilant May 2014 #13

Historically, and presently in some circles, white men are the cause of a lot of problems. NuclearDem May 2014 #14

^^^^^ Iggo May 2014 #24

Well stated. Thanks wavesofeuphoria May 2014 #100

But what you wrote here hfojvt May 2014 #106

How about what some white people do in the present? Donald Sterling, sadly, is likely not nomorenomore08 May 2014 #150

I feel like I'm watching Fox News. Ed Suspicious May 2014 #15

+1 redqueen May 2014 #20

The OP made me LOL, but your comment has me ROFLMAO! boston bean May 2014 #22

I'm hoping this is one of those "last gasp" things I have heard about.... bettyellen May 2014 #16

I don't think anyone expects you to solve all the problems of this society, stage left May 2014 #17

This message was self-deleted by its author Demo_Chris May 2014 #18

No, you're not. Iggo May 2014 #19

this white man has no power to cause any ills leftyohiolib May 2014 #21

You're neither blamed as an individual nor charged with solving the problems. Gormy Cuss May 2014 #23

Thanks for trying, once again. boston bean May 2014 #27

I have a couple of questions: Eleanors38 May 2014 #48

In many cases, it's the angry refusal to believe. PeaceNikki May 2014 #52

1) It's the message. Gormy Cuss May 2014 #61

This has gone on for decades. Any improvement? Eleanors38 May 2014 #62

Not with those who would like to deny it. boston bean May 2014 #66

Maybe the methodology needs to change. Eleanors38 May 2014 #90

Yeah, I am when people are hurting others. I want to deny them from hurting others any longer. boston bean May 2014 #91

We can certainly keep them away from progressive discussion boards. If we really want to. n/t nomorenomore08 May 2014 #151

Well we don't have separate bathrooms anymore....so there is that! VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #69

Sounds like you don't see much improvement. Maybe Eleanors38 May 2014 #92

I have seen alot of improvement... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #93

And women certainly didn't keep their mouths shut to effect change. boston bean May 2014 #94

Why, yes! The president women first voted for: Harding. Eleanors38 May 2014 #136

How long did it take for women's suffrage to be accepted? To end poll taxes? Gormy Cuss May 2014 #98

It is indeed. Eleanors38 May 2014 #121

Would you believe white people if they conceded WP? Eleanors38 May 2014 #209

I will answer your questions honestly: Harmony Blue May 2014 #207

The questions I have asked often go unanswered: Eleanors38 May 2014 #208

I wish we could recommend individual posts. Thank you. uppityperson May 2014 #73

I wasn't born with advantages Harmony Blue May 2014 #126

Your vested interest is in ending hate. Gormy Cuss May 2014 #130

Can't end hate if there is no communication or open dialogue Harmony Blue May 2014 #206

There is an open dialogue here on this topic. Gormy Cuss May 2014 #211

Snark and belittlement of opposing view points Harmony Blue May 2014 #220

Have I snarked on you? Belittled your viewpoint? Gormy Cuss May 2014 #242

So what do you think explains the relative lack of African-American wealth and achievement? nomorenomore08 May 2014 #153

To be blunt prvilege has nothing to do with the fact Harmony Blue May 2014 #224

This made me feel sick to my stomach. bravenak May 2014 #228

I didn't even know how to reply to his post. myrna minx May 2014 #230

This just means i need to log out. bravenak May 2014 #232

You're a wonderful person, bravenak. myrna minx May 2014 #235

I'm good. bravenak May 2014 #236

+1 nomorenomore08 May 2014 #243

If it's any small comfort, I got my first-ever hidden post in relation to that poster. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #245

Thats messed up. bravenak May 2014 #247

I'm sorry. I'm kind of in disbelief myself. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #248

Used to it. bravenak May 2014 #251

I agree. Enthusiast May 2014 #278

Kinda gross. bravenak May 2014 #288

What an absolutely ignorant and sickening post. myrna minx May 2014 #229

You should do me a solid and self delete this post. bravenak May 2014 #233

"more and more men (especially black men) are incarcerated" disproportionately indeed due to that pr uppityperson May 2014 #238

Like the freakin' Duggars? Oh, but they are white so. . . . nt tblue37 Aug 2014 #305

Holy crap. gollygee May 2014 #239

One benefit of juries leaving your awful posts to stand is that you're getting braver. redqueen May 2014 #240

Scratch a misogynist, find a racist. Starry Messenger May 2014 #241

+10000000000 nt redqueen May 2014 #259

So it's not the legacy of centuries of racism, they're just deadbeats and have too many kids? nomorenomore08 May 2014 #244

What about all the other reasons black men are incarcerated? JustAnotherGen May 2014 #260

Notice he hasn't replied to any actual black people on this thread... nomorenomore08 May 2014 #261

Just catching up this morning JustAnotherGen May 2014 #283

Those are offensive and hurtful remarks BainsBane May 2014 #263

WOW. bettyellen May 2014 #271

WTF? Jamastiene May 2014 #274

Your's are precisely the same talking points that we hear from Fox "News". Enthusiast May 2014 #279

LOL. Ever since you joined DU and began to spout libertarian talking points Cali_Democrat May 2014 #289

This is actually WRONG!!! The rate of out of wedlock births among ALL races has Liberal_Stalwart71 May 2014 #293

disgusting rubbish. Whisp May 2014 #295

I feel your heaven05 Jun 2014 #300

You should have seen his thread about the isla vista shooter. bravenak Jun 2014 #303

of course you agree with Cosby's bullshit noiretextatique Jun 2014 #304

It is the absolute height of irony for you to invoke the empathy card. nt laundry_queen May 2014 #162

Some good stuff here. AverageJoe90 May 2014 #25

. Tuesday Afternoon May 2014 #28

Stealing. bravenak May 2014 #152

! Tuesday Afternoon May 2014 #186

Yea, we need WHITE MAN'S ANONYMOUS ! steve2470 May 2014 #29

This is just like MRA bullshit, but from a racial angle. boston bean May 2014 #31

+1 nomorenomore08 May 2014 #158

lol. poor poor white men. Who will stand up and protect the poor persecuted white men???? PeaceNikki May 2014 #32

For reals! Being a white male kicks ass! FrodosPet May 2014 #163

Mirror: Feral Child May 2014 #35

LOL! bravenak May 2014 #36

Ha! JustAnotherGen May 2014 #82

This is why the majority of white men aren't democrats. McDiggy May 2014 #37

wut? PeaceNikki May 2014 #41

Must be hard not feeling like #1 anymore, eh? Uppity women going to college, bettyellen May 2014 #43

College? Men haven't gone to college en masse for a while now. McDiggy May 2014 #67

Or Feral Child May 2014 #45

... NuclearDem May 2014 #53

I've never heard a REAL liberal ever say or imply a white man's problems are meaningless steve2470 May 2014 #55

I've seen it on this forum. McDiggy May 2014 #74

you don't get it. PeaceNikki May 2014 #84

It's okay laundry_queen May 2014 #165

No, liberals tell them their problems aren't superior to others' problems. Lex May 2014 #78

Where'd you pick up that shit? Over at the daily paul? This is not the DU I came to love. Tarheel_Dem May 2014 #85

Is that why YOU aren't a Democrat? PeaceNikki May 2014 #87

wow.. are you even paying half way attention to the issues brought up here? uponit7771 May 2014 #102

Some truth to that, but we can't allow the far right to escape blame, either. AverageJoe90 May 2014 #103

You are strawman city here gollygee May 2014 #110

I didn't mention either of these two things, gollygee. Not at all. AverageJoe90 May 2014 #112

Here's what you wrote gollygee May 2014 #113

I didn't mention either of those two things. AverageJoe90 May 2014 #116

Even assuming that a few folks here and there subscribe to these extreme views, so what? nomorenomore08 May 2014 #173

Who are the extremists you think you need to correct here? nt redqueen May 2014 #118

Random people on Tumblr/blogs who have no real power or influence over anything? nomorenomore08 May 2014 #168

Of course being poor sucks, but it doesn't mean you get to trash minorities/gays/women. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #160

+1 YoungDemCA May 2014 #223

Fuck a bunch of CEOs. Enthusiast May 2014 #280

No... you Dorian Gray May 2014 #42

open racism... Ohio Joe May 2014 #44

Oh, give me a break. Honestly. AverageJoe90 May 2014 #51

Downplaying the issues faced by racial minorities while claiming to be persecuted as a white man? nomorenomore08 May 2014 #175

The points about white privilege are factual, why does that bother you? uponit7771 May 2014 #104

Since you like links and reading, I have some for you. PeaceNikki May 2014 #47

Thank you for posting those. nt redqueen May 2014 #58

+1 nt laundry_queen May 2014 #167

+2 nomorenomore08 May 2014 #176

Harmony is part of your name? really? HERVEPA May 2014 #57

and don't forget the Blue..... bettyellen May 2014 #218

You are right about one thing Puzzledtraveller May 2014 #75

... TDale313 May 2014 #80

One comment about your post. BULLSHIT lostincalifornia May 2014 #81

"No one knows what it's like to be the sad maaaaan..." Starry Messenger May 2014 #83

Oh, now I'm gonna have that song in my head all day. TDale313 May 2014 #86

Good thing I was on my phone, I was going to post video too. :) Starry Messenger May 2014 #117

Funny, I have blue eyes. And I've been known to suffer from chronic depression. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #177

... Enthusiast May 2014 #282

No one thinks you, personally, are responsible. TeacherB87 May 2014 #88

The image that should accompany this thread: YoungDemCA May 2014 #89

As a relatively privileged white woman, I'm open to any and all honest awareness, and honest effort ancianita May 2014 #96

"...create space which allows the privileged to be their best selves." nomorenomore08 May 2014 #178

Agreed. ancianita May 2014 #213

This whole debate reminds me of an episode of 30 Rock. Initech May 2014 #97

+1 uponit7771 May 2014 #105

Start eating worms right now, if you aren't already. nt raccoon May 2014 #99

Good news: You can take a breather and stop worrying. Zenlitened May 2014 #107

"Other folks... ask only that you avoid interrupting their work." nomorenomore08 May 2014 #187

In my opinion SaltyBro May 2014 #108

IKR!? IT is as if white men had some kind of negative history with other races or something! Rex May 2014 #109

Bravo! SaltyBro May 2014 #111

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #156

Empathy is a two way street, and both sides seem to lack it. Shandris May 2014 #114

I can't really blame you, TBH. AverageJoe90 May 2014 #120

So what makes you (or any individual) a "voice of reason" over and above others? nomorenomore08 May 2014 #188

TBH..... bravenak May 2014 #190

If you are part of the problem, then you deserve the blame. DrewFlorida May 2014 #115

I'm so white I'm not guilted by the white guilt trips. joshcryer May 2014 #122

I feel no particular "white guilt" either. Funny that. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #189

I find it silly to get worked up over something I have no control over. joshcryer May 2014 #191

I rarely come here, because there isn't really serious discussion here adigal May 2014 #123

So your point is that people dont post anything serious. I hope you see the irony. nm rhett o rick May 2014 #125

so of the mulitude of topics up for discussion Skittles May 2014 #144

I gather this thread was created for sympathy which you did not receive. Gravitycollapse May 2014 #127

A) Yes, Harmony Blue, I blame you for all the ills of society. Because it's all about you. Squinch May 2014 #128

Good point cyberswede May 2014 #139

+1 nt laundry_queen May 2014 #169

Oh there is a tiny handful of women supporting the handful redqueen May 2014 #225

I was going to say before I read your last paragraph, "But it's just the usual suspects." Squinch May 2014 #237

But I thought everything was Obama's fault? Oh just the white side of him SummerSnow May 2014 #129

You perpetuate "white privilege" every day... wittingly OR unwittingly. cherokeeprogressive May 2014 #131

What is a perpuator? n/t Jamastiene May 2014 #275

Time for a sad violin kwassa May 2014 #132

It's ironic that these pathetic posts perpetuate the issue of whites being seen as the ones who.. RedCappedBandit May 2014 #137

It is eye opening is it not? Harmony Blue May 2014 #226

Please do not fall under the impression that I am in agreement with your OP RedCappedBandit May 2014 #227

I hope the OP sees that hardly anyone on the thread agrees with him. That's important if we want to nomorenomore08 May 2014 #262

You're so clueless that you can't even tell when someone is being sarcastic... Liberal_Stalwart71 May 2014 #294

And black/Latino males aren't? *Constantly*??? nomorenomore08 May 2014 #141

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #159

"Historical advantages" are only one part of it. The mere fact that you're a white person nomorenomore08 May 2014 #161

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #164

So when have you been, say, hassled by cops for being white? nomorenomore08 May 2014 #166

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #172

Then why are the millions of people in prison so disproportionately black? nomorenomore08 May 2014 #179

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #192

Damn, wish I could've seen his reply... But thanks, MIRT! nomorenomore08 May 2014 #195

In some neighborhoods in Detroit, the police have been known to pull over whites FrodosPet May 2014 #174

True. No one said (or implied) that all individual white folks have it easy. n/t nomorenomore08 May 2014 #180

Why we all should have a vested interest FrodosPet May 2014 #171

As a white guy, I can tell you...white folks HATE talk of white privilege. U4ikLefty May 2014 #142

Frankly, I'm almost glad the majority of my friends aren't white (even though I am). nomorenomore08 May 2014 #181

ahh, jeez. SheilaT May 2014 #154

Great post. You seem like the sort of conscientious, empathetic person I try my best to be. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #183

We all have our limitations. SheilaT May 2014 #194

We should all feel great shame for merely drawing breath, evidently. Skip Intro May 2014 #157

And the award for Strawman of the Century goes to... nomorenomore08 May 2014 #184

How so? Skip Intro May 2014 #185

Because you're greatly exaggerating people's animus towards you. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #196

You replied to me, "strawman." Again - how so? Skip Intro May 2014 #197

Because no one (or virtually no one) on here literally hates straight white males. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #199

Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #182

So the gist that I'm getting from the majority of these posts... Buddyblazon May 2014 #193

And here I thought defacto7 May 2014 #200

Rudyard Kipling, is that you? merrily May 2014 #202

white men are expected to solve all the problems? Skittles May 2014 #203

No one blames me for the ills of society. I feel very little guilt, and even so, only for ... dawg May 2014 #214

Should have thought this out a little more before hitting post. NCTraveler May 2014 #216

No Harmony Blue May 2014 #221

What does Snowden have to do with discussions of privilege? YoungDemCA May 2014 #222

An excuse to change the subject, I suppose. n/t nomorenomore08 May 2014 #246

Just an excuse not to listen to people BainsBane May 2014 #253

Huh? Aren't you the op? nt. NCTraveler May 2014 #290

Very disgusting op. bravenak May 2014 #231

While white supremacists like Rick Scott and Scott Walker and Ohio ALL con governors are actively randys1 May 2014 #254

I should have remembered to wait my turn. bravenak May 2014 #256

I am there with you randys1 May 2014 #257

understanding zach.magee May 2014 #234

Do you even realize the irony, of complaining about being broadbrushed as a white person nomorenomore08 May 2014 #249

By the way what you said was bad. bravenak May 2014 #258

I agree BainsBane May 2014 #264

No one bats an eye at that BainsBane Jun 2014 #301

Yes it does. bravenak Jun 2014 #302

"elitist" "arrogant" Jamastiene May 2014 #277