General Discussion

magical thyme

(14,881 posts)

22. I think you mean if the prosecution does not make that clear....

Sun Apr 1, 2012, 01:20 PM

Apr 2012

Isn't the burden of proof on the prosecution really either that Zimmerman didn't actually feel threatened in any way or that Zimmerman stalked with intent to do bodily harm or kill?

The problem with the SYG laws is that they have been extended to include any place that Zimmerman had a right to be, he had a right to defend himself with deadly force from a perceived threat.

If the prosecution can prove that he was stalking, it seems more likely they can prove that he went after Trayvon with the intention of harming him, as opposed to feeling threatened by him.

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Mark my words... Zimmerman will walk. [View all] TBA Apr 2012 OP

This is worrying Spacedog1973 Apr 2012 #1

you do know there are more than 20 states with similar laws . . . . DrDan Apr 2012 #2

Yea... But I live in Florida TBA Apr 2012 #3

as do I DrDan Apr 2012 #14

Actually, it's more than 40 states with similar laws. TheWraith Apr 2012 #27

Isn't that highly subjective? Hugabear Apr 2012 #43

Not really in 'law' terms laundry_queen Apr 2012 #63

I never presume to think what "high educated, intelligent" people might think Hugabear Apr 2012 #65

Ooo you got my typo. laundry_queen Apr 2012 #76

Well, maybe, bit the only person who could tell the other side hifiguy Apr 2012 #69

Similar does not mean the same Major Nikon Apr 2012 #55

Iwas hoping your citation would support your claim so I could see why Florida stands out - it fails DrDan Apr 2012 #61

Read the actual laws carefully Major Nikon Apr 2012 #62

I am not a lawyer, but it seems to me to be saying the same thing - DrDan Apr 2012 #74

This... Major Nikon Apr 2012 #75

I am not trying to be difficult - but I do not think the Michigan law says that at all. DrDan Apr 2012 #83

If Zimmerman is not lying about what happened (I know, a big if), he shouldn't be arrested. Vattel Apr 2012 #4

Seein' as we're talkin' 'bout "ifs"... ret5hd Apr 2012 #11

Depends on what the details are. Vattel Apr 2012 #15

If Zimmerman touched him first then Zimmerman is guilty of murder Logical Apr 2012 #18

None of the evidence...zero percent, none...supports anything Zimmerman has said Amerigo Vespucci Apr 2012 #35

Wrong, HE was the aggressor, Trayvon is the one who, had he succeeded in disabling him even sabrina 1 Apr 2012 #57

One reason Oneka Apr 2012 #68

Except there is a witness, his girlfriend states that he was approached and may have had sabrina 1 Apr 2012 #72

I hope it gets Oneka Apr 2012 #73

very well said. i believe the cultural norms based on racial stereotypes have been arely staircase Apr 2012 #78

Yes, it's strange really. I don't understand why anyone is giving any credit at all to the lie that sabrina 1 Apr 2012 #82

"Nobody assumes the syg law was applicable to Trayvon." drm604 Apr 2012 #88

ok then virtually nobody arely staircase Apr 2012 #89

The only person who had the right to stand his ground - was Trayvon. tabatha Apr 2012 #5

I think you mean if the prosecution does not make that clear.... magical thyme Apr 2012 #22

Yep, brain frt - meant prosecution. tabatha Apr 2012 #86

I think he'll do some time. Nye Bevan Apr 2012 #6

And the investigative officer nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #10

I can be the agressor, initiate contact, and wait for you to take a swing at me. Ikonoklast Apr 2012 #7

At the state level probably nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #8

Good point, FlawDuh will allow him to go but feds don't have a "Shoot Cause You sKeered" law uponit7771 Apr 2012 #16

And murder at the federal level nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #23

Murder is not generally a federal crime, HOWEVER I found this little gem while researching this: Nye Bevan Apr 2012 #29

Yeah, usually the Feds let the locals deal with murder nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #30

Actually no, the Feds don't "let" the states do anything tkmorris Apr 2012 #44

Generally, Murder is a state law jeff47 Apr 2012 #77

Exactly and number three nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #80

If George had NOT gone after Trayvon I would agree but since he did Quixote1818 Apr 2012 #9

The "writer of the law" was the NRA and ALEC Major Nikon Apr 2012 #58

There is still the civil rights possibility. nt BootinUp Apr 2012 #12

If FL's stand your ground law is like other state's laws... OneTenthofOnePercent Apr 2012 #20

In state court. There is no federal SYG law. jeff47 Apr 2012 #79

If the state can prove that Zimm did not have reasonable cause to fear for his life or OneTenthofOnePercent Apr 2012 #13

I would agree that its a toss-up Quixote1818 Apr 2012 #19

I would prefer a duty-to-retreat law Vattel Apr 2012 #21

What about having to retreat from ones home, if for instance Johnson20 Apr 2012 #66

Because of the SYG law, he had no duty to retreat. Life Long Dem Apr 2012 #31

JADP - There was no duty to retreat under Florida law even before the SYG law was passed slackmaster Apr 2012 #37

It was only in your home where you had no duty to retreat Life Long Dem Apr 2012 #38

No, there was never a DTR anywhere, any time in FL or most other states... slackmaster Apr 2012 #47

Your right. Life Long Dem Apr 2012 #48

under this law, provis99 Apr 2012 #34

"reasonable cause" is not the standard contained in the law. Major Nikon Apr 2012 #60

His life will still be ruined. mainer Apr 2012 #17

I predict a plethora of Johnson20 Apr 2012 #67

He'd better tattoo some eyes on the back of his head. alphafemale Apr 2012 #24

Yes. People can only take so much in-your-face injustice. CakeGrrl Apr 2012 #36

Was deadly force necessary to prevent the defendants imminent death? Life Long Dem Apr 2012 #25

stand your ground? maybe... madrchsod Apr 2012 #26

another clairvoyant thread.... spanone Apr 2012 #28

I'm not Ms Cleo but HipChick Apr 2012 #42

It's not a bad guess given the erosion of the rule of law EFerrari Apr 2012 #52

I think you are right, but... immoderate Apr 2012 #32

I agree 100%, and have posted the same on DU multiple times. Amerigo Vespucci Apr 2012 #33

That would protect him at the state level, but he can still get pinched on the federal level. backscatter712 Apr 2012 #39

The coverup has been exposed too much obamanut2012 Apr 2012 #40

I think you're right, but not due to a conspiracy kudzu22 Apr 2012 #41

If he does walk, man4allcats Apr 2012 #45

Zimmerman's reputation is tarnished though Justice4allofus Apr 2012 #46

This was his lottery Cosmocat Apr 2012 #70

I don't think he is a right wing hero Quixote1818 Apr 2012 #71

Could be Cosmocat Apr 2012 #84

Even if it gets that far, at least one of 12 jurors will use SYG, bigotry, love of guns, or whatever Hoyt Apr 2012 #49

I'm seriously worried a riot will break out if he does. Initech Apr 2012 #50

I think that's highly unlikely RZM Apr 2012 #51

They said the same thing about Rodney King. Initech Apr 2012 #54

I understand the line of thinking, but I guess I just don't see similar outcomes as very likely RZM Apr 2012 #59

Imho, we're nearing a tipping point EFerrari Apr 2012 #53

I am afraid you're right shimonitanegi Apr 2012 #56

Hey may walk WeekendWarrior Apr 2012 #64

He'll be arrested and tried, but found innocent n/t Pryderi Apr 2012 #81

Now that the FBI is involved I don't think you are correct. It goes Maraya1969 Apr 2012 #85

I think you are right... it's why the left needs to seriously step up fascisthunter Apr 2012 #87