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hunter

(38,582 posts)
43. It's not difficult to imagine an economic system that works...
Sun Apr 1, 2012, 06:04 PM
Apr 2012

... and many "first world" nations have achieved something close to that.

The U.S.A. is not a "first world nation."

To build an economy that works you first need a generous social safety net. You pay for this safety net by taxing the wealthy.

We might divide the population into five groups:

The "low income people" would be full time college and trade students of all ages, the chronically unemployable, people who can only work part time, people who have retired from lower middle class jobs, etc.. ALL OF THEM, like every other citizen, would be entitled to to excellent food, public health care, free education, and safe, secure places to live, places that they can call their own, places where they can paint the walls whatever color they want, places where they can settle down for years if they want to.

The lower middle class would begin at full time minimum wage employment. This would be a much greater minimum wage than now exists in the U.S.A.. Education and health care would still be free, as with all the other groups. Housing options might be public or private. This lower middle class would pay no income tax.

The middle class would pay income taxes sufficient to support their own aggregate use of public services, mostly health care and education with some small surplus. This would be the largest group of workers, and might graciously consider themselves unsubsidized and "self-supporting."

The upper middle class would pay progressively greater taxes, but not so much as the wealthy class, maybe 40-50% on everything exceeding what a full time minimum wage job pays.

The wealthy class would be taxed to such an extent that their share of the national wealth would never exceed 20%, by a combination of income and wealth taxes. The "one percenters" as we now know them would simply be taxed out of existence. The shares of giant mega-corporations would be spread across a much larger base of shareholders, and these corporations might even be nationalized to some extent.

The only truly just economies are "trickle up," where money is created for the benefit of the poor and middle classes, where money is taxed off the top, from the wealthy classes, and recirculated before it has a chance to stagnate and become a source of political and economic corruption.

Perhaps a gratuity should be added to the bill. Cleita Apr 2012 #1
I don't believe tips will make up for the disparity Cirque du So-What Apr 2012 #4
No, but they sure would help. Cleita Apr 2012 #5
Still a pittance Cirque du So-What Apr 2012 #14
What are you basing the 120% on, his salary? Cleita Apr 2012 #17
Not sure what your point is Cirque du So-What Apr 2012 #22
Yes, but the 20% gratuity comes from the receipts, not the wages he earns Cleita Apr 2012 #26
Sorry for missing the point about restaurant receipts Cirque du So-What Apr 2012 #48
It's not really anything to do with meals. it's to do with the assumption of tips. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #70
Those laws should be struck down. Apparently, they have become worse since I did restaurant p/r. Cleita Apr 2012 #107
regarding docking for meals. unapatriciated Apr 2012 #76
Which ONLY makes sense if all his tables' tabs total $7.25 every hour dmallind Apr 2012 #45
You're right Cirque du So-What Apr 2012 #47
The real problem is the attitude of the millionaire farmers...who probably aren't growing a damn nanabugg Apr 2012 #69
Let me tell you about farmers. Boudica the Lyoness Apr 2012 #96
Some states DO require restaurants to pay minimum wage, but Lydia Leftcoast Apr 2012 #56
True and California is one of them. unapatriciated Apr 2012 #77
The difference is between $8 an hour and $20 an hour, for a good manufacturing job. pnwmom Apr 2012 #24
I didn't say that but it's still better than getting a nickel. Cleita Apr 2012 #27
depends on the manufacturing job hfojvt Apr 2012 #15
All the good manufacturing jobs that paid well were union jobs. Cleita Apr 2012 #28
That is not true. bvar22 Apr 2012 #109
You are very right. However, it was because of the union competition that Cleita Apr 2012 #110
Sadly, these days even manufacturing jobs usually pay crap wages dotymed Apr 2012 #32
a server's salary Maine-ah Apr 2012 #54
I confess to being clueless about what servers earn Cirque du So-What Apr 2012 #58
that`s why my wife leaves cash if at all possible madrchsod Apr 2012 #16
Or we should just let the minimum wage be the minimum wage quakerboy Apr 2012 #49
My point of view is that since the IRS taxes tips TransitJohn Apr 2012 #50
I would agree with that quakerboy Apr 2012 #53
I'd rather take tips than minimum wage. Maine-ah Apr 2012 #55
This is where the thinking is wrong. Cleita Apr 2012 #60
Yes that is still the law but not quite as you say. unapatriciated Apr 2012 #75
Social Security and Medicare are in deep trouble. former9thward Apr 2012 #2
Because they are. Cleita Apr 2012 #7
Despite your well known and feeble attempts to slander posters by using terms former9thward Apr 2012 #13
Because you phrase those memes exactly like they do. It makes me think that this is where Cleita Apr 2012 #25
Sorry, but not all of us have the confidence you have. The Trustees Report also says... sad sally Apr 2012 #39
It's not broken yet, unless you allow them to break it. Cleita Apr 2012 #59
I think there'll be a civil war before the right-wing breaks and gives in, in the grand scheme. Selatius Apr 2012 #71
Are you aware that the projections change every year? HiPointDem Apr 2012 #72
"Legislative modifications" = rate increase, as has been done many times in the past. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #74
They were in trouble the MOMENT our manufacturing went offshore. nt Pholus Apr 2012 #62
No one who actually delves into the history and the numbers for themself can actually believe that. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #73
without a middle class wendylaroux Apr 2012 #3
Oh it's good for some things Hawkowl Apr 2012 #6
I have said that same thing for over eighteen months. truedelphi Apr 2012 #21
Steinbeck said that when property is gathered in too few hands it is taken away. leeroysphitz Apr 2012 #33
I don't know if that can happen quite that way anymore. quakerboy Apr 2012 #51
Occupy Wall Street is currently occupying the truedelphi Apr 2012 #111
It's amazing to me that people ever fell for LuvNewcastle Apr 2012 #8
The minute we stopped being a country that created and made things BB_Troll Apr 2012 #78
Everyone sees that the employment figures as getting better, but that's not the whole story. Arkansas Granny Apr 2012 #9
I once read a story about Calcutta, India. Cleita Apr 2012 #11
Yes, Madame DeFarge is certainly knitting. Denninmi Apr 2012 #10
my wife works with and for mentally and physicality challenged adults madrchsod Apr 2012 #12
reaganomics reached its full maturity. KG Apr 2012 #18
My son is a cook at a chain restaurant. He has been there since it openned. He has done southernyankeebelle Apr 2012 #19
The middle class workers who built the American economy in the early 20th century baldguy Apr 2012 #20
There is another thing to consider: truedelphi Apr 2012 #23
And you know what the bestest thing of all of that is? Ikonoklast Apr 2012 #29
That's what I think too Yo_Mama Apr 2012 #30
The solution is VOTE A STRAIGHT DEMOCRATIC BALLOT IN NOVEMBER. xtraxritical Apr 2012 #67
Don, the fruits and joys of living in a society in which most public policy is driven by a indepat Apr 2012 #31
no easy answers... handmade34 Apr 2012 #34
I was the kid of one of those "millionaire farmers" Coyote_Bandit Apr 2012 #35
There are many different opportunities to look around you and reach the same conclusion. Quantess Apr 2012 #36
We see it coming - financial issues, just like global warming, just like....but we can't think big NRaleighLiberal Apr 2012 #37
We are witnessing Disaster Capitalism at work ... Auggie Apr 2012 #38
In 1972 I started at the auto factory flipping hoods safeinOhio Apr 2012 #40
How do you know this is his only job? Maybe he works another job and this one trying to make as RB TexLa Apr 2012 #41
I can't help but wonder if the OP EmeraldCityGrl Apr 2012 #42
It's not difficult to imagine an economic system that works... hunter Apr 2012 #43
So according to you SATIRical Apr 2012 #84
Apparantly it works for you... hunter Apr 2012 #100
I'll wait for your answer SATIRical Apr 2012 #103
Yup, our systems were not designed to work based on high unemployment or shrinking wages. TheKentuckian Apr 2012 #44
The more I look around the more I think we're headed for an economic revolt in the not too distant future. Initech Apr 2012 #46
This is where, IMO, the Democrats need to focus. Egalitarian Thug Apr 2012 #52
Can't he work in the new Toyota plant. Snake Alchemist Apr 2012 #57
We need the jobs back in the U.S., not in China. We need tariffs or something Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2012 #61
We don't even value the jobs we do have Major Nikon Apr 2012 #64
The reason why the auto industry jobs paid well and had good benefits was because of unions Major Nikon Apr 2012 #63
Yup. In France, servers in restaurants earn "upper middle class" incomes. TahitiNut Apr 2012 #90
This is the direction the US needs to go Major Nikon Apr 2012 #92
I agree. In Spain, where I lived for many years, waiters are paid a living wage Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2012 #97
Exactly! Phlem Apr 2012 #65
Not all farmers are bad, but DonCoquixote Apr 2012 #66
Shithead attitude is everywhere Kennah Apr 2012 #68
Capitalism has failed. libtodeath Apr 2012 #79
To restore the manufacturing base The Wizard Apr 2012 #80
About to happen? it's been happening for 30 years. Javaman Apr 2012 #81
We need more alignment between schooling and today's jobs KurtNYC Apr 2012 #82
Cue the "post-secondary schooling should be about SATIRical Apr 2012 #86
All those I know from my graduating class who decided abelenkpe Apr 2012 #87
A nickel? davidthegnome Apr 2012 #83
? marshall gaines Apr 2012 #85
What is "loading hoods at an auto plant" FarCenter Apr 2012 #88
Pretty much the same way these workers are loading floor pans at 3:00 minutes into this video NNN0LHI Apr 2012 #89
Good jobs come and go... DaveJ Apr 2012 #91
............ Marrah_G Apr 2012 #101
Sorry you disagree, but without further input or discussion, it is hard to DaveJ Apr 2012 #105
Most people serving coffee aren't doing so because they are lazy Marrah_G Apr 2012 #108
The thing I think you may not be realizing is that for many of us who truedelphi Apr 2012 #115
Welcome to the world Glaisne Apr 2012 #93
Someone needs ProSense Apr 2012 #94
a general strike? barbtries Apr 2012 #95
It IS happening, chervilant Apr 2012 #98
K&R raouldukelives Apr 2012 #99
41 years old and living the American dream!!!!!!! Marrah_G Apr 2012 #102
My hat is off to you as truedelphi Apr 2012 #112
I do love the Occupiers Marrah_G Apr 2012 #113
I think the 1% running this country will get rid of the Social Security and then those working these midnight Apr 2012 #104
"Millionare farmers" that probably sit around complaining about Obama all day. louis-t Apr 2012 #106
Thanks Don, 99Forever Apr 2012 #114
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