I was never crazy about Greenwald, and don't care for Snowden. But some of you make me a fanboy

[woo me with science]

68. The difference is that propaganda is based in loyalty, not policies and principles.

Propaganda defends the party and the politician regardless of the policies or principles involved, or how they shift and change over time. That's why you get barrages of blue links in propaganda that contradict one another, or go nowhere, or actually say the opposite of what they are claimed to. Propaganda must be able to say with conviction on Monday that "We have always been at war with Eurasia," and then on Tuesday proclaim, "We have always been at war with Eastasia" just as confidently.

You post an average of 30-40 posts per day of such uncritical support of the Obama administration, including weekends and holidays, and regardless of the administration's actual policy or positions.

For example, in 2006, when Democrats were united against the revelations of spying under Bush, you were vehement that such spying was unacceptable and could never be made legal:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x2461323

Prosense: "Spying on Americans was, is and will still be illegal."

ProSense (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 08:53 AM
Original message
Edited on Wed Feb-15-06 08:53 AM by ProSense

Bush is spying on Americans: opponents and activist groups. The law can't
be changed to make that legal. The Republicans are trying to pull a fast one with this "law change" tactic by framing the illegal spying as warrantless spying on terrorists; therefore, the law is being changed to give Bush the authority to spy on terrorist. Spying on Americans was, is and will still be illegal. Bush committed crimes by illegal spying on Americans and breaking existing FISA laws.

I'm sure all criminals would love to have a law passed that retroactively absolves them of their crimes.

Since Democrats took the White House and adopted the spying policies, however, you have engaged in a relentless campaign of daily posting to divert the conversation from the spying to the whistleblower:

ProSense: "I don't give a shit about Snowden"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4641649

This list of your Snowden OPs is a bit short, I know-- but it only covers about a month and half's worth of time last summer. I'm sure you must have made hundreds more posts about this subject you don't care about since, but I can't be bothered to compile an updated list.

OP Beyond his Moscow airport limbo, indignities await Edward Snowden ProSense Yesterday General Discussion
OP Greenwald To Appear At Town Hall For N.J. Senate Candidate Rush Holt ProSense Yesterday General Discussion
OP When It Comes To Extraditions, Russia Often Cooperates ProSense Saturday General Discussion
OP Glenn Greenwald To Testify Before Congress ProSense Friday General Discussion
OP ERIC HOLDER TO RUSSIA: We Will Not Torture Or Seek The Death Penalty For Edward Snowden ProSense Friday General Discussion
OP Senate pushes sanctions on nations aiding Snowden ProSense Thursday General Discussion
OP Bolivia forgives European countries for air space incident ProSense Wednesday General Discussion
OP Updated: Fugitive Snowden to stay for now at Moscow airport: Russian lawyer ProSense Wednesday General Discussion
OP Attitudes Shift Against Snowden; Fewer than Half Say NSA is Unjustified ProSense Wednesday General Discussion
OP Senator Slams Domestic Spying: ‘Secret Law Has No Place In America’ ProSense Tuesday General Discussion
OP Snowden plans to settle and work in Russia – lawyer to RT ProSense Tuesday General Discussion
OP Leaker Snowden hopes to be able to leave airport by Wednesday: lawyer ProSense Jul 22 General Discussion
OP Pew poll: Many Venezuelans want better relations with the U.S. ProSense Jul 20 General Discussion
OP Biden calls Brazil's Rousseff over NSA spying tensions ProSense Jul 19 General Discussion
OP U.S. court renews surveillance program exposed by Snowden ProSense Jul 19 General Discussion
OP Two U.S. senators suggest moving G20 from Russia over Snowden ProSense Jul 19 General Discussion
OP Kerry talked to Venezuela about Snowden: US ProSense Jul 19 General Discussion
OP Oath Keepers Heart Edward Snowden! ProSense Jul 19 General Discussion
OP Russia says knows of no plan for Snowden to seek citizenship ProSense Jul 19 General Discussion
OP Snowden has no crediblity, and deserves no thanks. ProSense Jul 18 General Discussion
OP Guardian Journalist to Write Book on Surveillance ProSense Jul 17 General Discussion
OP What did Jimmy Carter mean by this ProSense Jul 17 General Discussion
OP Sen. Tester Calls On Snowden To Return To America To ‘Face The Music’ ProSense Jul 17 General Discussion
OP "PHOTO: Application for temporary asylum in Russia written by #NSA leaker Edward #Snowden" (WTF?) ProSense Jul 16 General Discussion
OP Edward Snowden Declares Himself Torture-Proof ProSense Jul 16 General Discussion
OP Fugitive Edward Snowden applies for asylum in Russia ProSense Jul 16 General Discussion
OP Carl Bernstein: Greenwald 'out of line' (updated) ProSense Jul 15 General Discussion
OP Greenwald: Snowden Docs Contain NSA 'Blueprint' ProSense Jul 14 General Discussion
OP N.S.A. Leaks Stir Plans in Russia to Control Net ProSense Jul 14 General Discussion
OP Greenwald tries to do damage control ProSense Jul 13 General Discussion
OP Snowden documents could be 'worst nightmare' for U.S.: journalist ProSense Jul 13 General Discussion
OP Russia 'has not received' Snowden asylum bid ProSense Jul 13 General Discussion
OP Carney responds to question about Snowden meeting with human rights groups. ProSense Jul 12 General Discussion
OP Obama Spoke With Putin On Snowden, ‘Cooperation On Counter-Terrorism’ ProSense Jul 12 General Discussion
OP Greenwald: Snowden asylum 'unlikely' to stop me from publishing leaks ProSense Jul 12 General Discussion
OP If Snowden's case as a whistleblower is so strong, why is he afraid to face the consequences? ProSense Jul 12 General Discussion
OP How the Snowden Affair Became a Freak Show ProSense Jul 12 General Discussion
OP Edward Snowden caught in asylum catch-22 ProSense Jul 12 General Discussion
OP Updated: US ambassador to Russia disputes claim sent message to Snowden ProSense Jul 12 General Discussion
OP Russia says Snowden could stay if he stops harming US ProSense Jul 12 General Discussion
OP "Big news is that #Snowden is applying for political asylum in Russia" (updated) ProSense Jul 12 General Discussion
OP Purported E-Mail From Snowden Asks for Meeting With Rights Groups ProSense Jul 12 General Discussion
OP The ACLU's own text contradicts its case for Snowden's asylum bid. ProSense Jul 12 General Discussion
OP Brazil May Seek to Speak With Snowden as Spy Allegations Spread ProSense Jul 10 General Discussion
OP Which Other Countries Are ‘In Bed’ With The NSA? ProSense Jul 10 General Discussion
OP Brazil lawmaker: US spying won't hurt relations ProSense Jul 10 General Discussion
OP Snowden: I never gave any information to Chinese or Russian governments ProSense Jul 10 General Discussion
OP Fugitive Snowden likely Venezuela bound, says U.S. journalist (Greenwald) ProSense Jul 9 General Discussion
OP Wikileaks: Snowden Has Not Formally Accepted Asylum Anywhere Yet ProSense Jul 9 General Discussion
OP North Korea uses Snowden in propaganda video ProSense Jul 9 General Discussion
OP Snowden Mentioned ‘Direct Access’ In Interview With The Guardian ProSense Jul 8 General Discussion
OP Irony ProSense Jul 8 General Discussion
OP Here's what the Snowden videos did ProSense Jul 8 General Discussion
OP Glenn Greenwald: Edward Snowden "Satisfied" by Global Outrage over U.S. Surveillance Operations ProSense Jul 8 General Discussion
OP Snowden affair clouds U.S. attempts to press China to curb cyber theft ProSense Jul 8 General Discussion
OP Snowden Anticipated Being Accused Of Violating Espionage Act ProSense Jul 8 General Discussion
OP Josh Marshall: Kinda Curious What That Means (Ellsberg's claim) ProSense Jul 8 General Discussion
OP Der Spiegel: Do private companies help the NSA? Snowden: Yes. But it's hard to prove that. ProSense Jul 7 General Discussion
OP Snowden: Other nations use NSA surveillance info ProSense Jul 7 General Discussion
OP Snowden isn't a whistleblower because...the law. ProSense Jul 6 General Discussion
OP Glenn Greenwald: Edward Snowden Confirmed WikiLeaks Statement Was Written By Him ProSense Jul 6 General Discussion
OP A big "FU" to the United States by other countries? ProSense Jul 6 General Discussion
OP More on Venezuela's offer (Is everyone sure this isn't rhetoric?) ProSense Jul 5 General Discussion
OP Will Venezuela follow through on Snowden offer? ProSense Jul 5 General Discussion
OP White House: no comment on Venezuela's asylum offer to Snowden ProSense Jul 5 General Discussion
OP Icelandic Lawmaker Claims Snowden Expressed ‘Gratitude’ For Citizenship Vote ProSense Jul 5 General Discussion
OP Wikileaks: Snowden Has Requested Asylum From Six More Countries ProSense Jul 5 General Discussion
OP Who started the rumor about Snowden being on President Morales' plane? ProSense Jul 5 General Discussion
OP South American leftist leaders rally to Bolivia's side in Snowden saga ProSense Jul 4 General Discussion
OP Snowden’s asylum request rejected (Norway) ProSense Jul 4 General Discussion
OP What Kind Of Coward Is Edward Snowden? ProSense Jul 4 General Discussion
OP Obama, Merkel agree to talks on U.S. spying ProSense Jul 4 General Discussion
OP Russia shows growing impatience over Snowden's airport stay ProSense Jul 4 General Discussion
OP Updated: France, Italy reject Snowden asylum request ProSense Jul 4 General Discussion
OP The hyperbole is getting thick. ProSense Jul 3 General Discussion
OP Why Won’t Anyone Take Edward Snowden? ProSense Jul 3 General Discussion
OP Wikileaks Spokesman: U.S. ‘Obviously’ Responsible For ‘Outrageous’ Incident With Bolivian President’ ProSense Jul 3 General Discussion
OP Audio purportedly from inside the cockpit of Bolivian President Evo Morales’s flight ProSense Jul 3 General Discussion
OP Wikileaks Spokesman Insists Snowden Statement Is Genuine ProSense Jul 3 General Discussion
OP The Guardian: Snowden Is A Whistleblower, Not A Spy ProSense Jul 3 General Discussion
OP Why are countries still cooperating with the United States on Snowden? ProSense Jul 3 General Discussion
OP Why didn't Bolivia's President give Snowden a lift? ProSense Jul 2 General Discussion
OP Bolivia: Presidential plane forced to land after false rumors of Snowden onboard ProSense Jul 2 General Discussion
OP There Are 12 Million Stateless People Around The World, But Edward Snowden Isn’t One Of Them ProSense Jul 2 General Discussion
OP Updated: India, Brazil reject Snowden’s asylum request; Snowden withdraws request to Russia ProSense Jul 2 General Discussion
OP Rafael Correa: we helped Snowden by mistake ProSense Jul 1 General Discussion
OP Josh Marshall: "Snowden’s pretty screwed." ProSense Jul 1 General Discussion
OP Report: Edward Snowden Breaks Silence (updated) ProSense Jul 1 General Discussion
OP Who should Edward Snowden be compared to? ProSense Jun 30 General Discussion
OP Assange stands by Edward Snowden as Ecuador's Correa reprimands consul ProSense Jun 30 General Discussion
OP With Julian Assange Taking the Spotlight, Edward Snowden's Future Looks Grim ProSense Jun 30 General Discussion
OP Ecuadoran President Correa Gives VP Biden An Earful ProSense Jun 29 General Discussion
OP Am I missing something about the latest revelations regarding the EU? ProSense Jun 29 General Discussion
OP Analysis: Snowden's options appear to narrow in bid to evade U.S. arrest ProSense Jun 28 General Discussion
OP Jimmy Carter on Snowden: "He's obviously violated the laws of America, for which he's responsible." ProSense Jun 28 General Discussion
OP Ecuador cools on Edward Snowden asylum as Assange frustration grows ProSense Jun 28 General Discussion
OP Ecuador has no plans to halt commerce ties over Snowden: Correa ProSense Jun 27 General Discussion
OP Exclusive: Documents Illuminate Ecuador’s Spying Practices ProSense Jun 27 General Discussion
OP The Errors of Edward Snowden and His Global Hypocrisy Tour ProSense Jun 27 General Discussion
OP Ecuador Says Snowden Asylum Document Unauthorized ProSense Jun 27 General Discussion
OP Ecuador denies giving Snowden a travel document: report ProSense Jun 26 General Discussion
OP Spanish judge Baltasar Garzon says his legal team won’t represent NSA leaker Edward Snowden ProSense Jun 26 General Discussion
OP Russia spies may be chatting with "tasty morsel" Snowden ProSense Jun 25 General Discussion
OP Putin Says Dealing With Snowden Issue ‘Like Shearing A Pig’ ProSense Jun 25 General Discussion
OP Edward Snowden never crossed border into Russia, says foreign minister ProSense Jun 25 General Discussion
OP Op-Ed In Chinese Communist Party Newspaper Blasts Washington Over Snowden, Hacking ProSense Jun 25 General Discussion
OP Hayes Challenges Greenwald: Snowden Undermines Defenders If He Goes To Nations That Hate Free Press ProSense Jun 24 General Discussion
OP Greenwald: I Didn’t Even Know Snowden’s Name Until He Was In Hong Kong ProSense Jun 24 General Discussion
OP Snowden plans more leaks...will let foreign press decide if leaks endanger Americans ProSense Jun 24 General Discussion
OP Snowden’s Attorney: ‘He Never Anticipated This Would Be Such A Big Matter’ ProSense Jun 24 General Discussion
OP The problem with defending Snowden. ProSense Jun 24 General Discussion
OP Snowden is one issue and NSA oversight is another. ProSense Jun 24 General Discussion
OP Julian Assange Won’t Say When Wikileaks Began Working With Ed Snowden ProSense Jun 24 General Discussion
OP Report: Kremlin Says Russia Didn’t Know Snowden Was Coming To Moscow ProSense Jun 24 General Discussion
OP Why Ecuador? ProSense Jun 24 General Discussion
OP Which word best describes Snowden ProSense Jun 23 General Discussion
OP China Said to Have Made Call to Let Leaker Depart ProSense Jun 23 General Discussion
OP Maybe Hong Kong is simply relieved to be rid of Snowden ProSense Jun 23 General Discussion
OP Schumer: ‘Putin Always Seems Eager To Put A Finger In the Eye Of The U.S.’ ProSense Jun 23 General Discussion
OP Sen. Paul To Snowden: Don’t ‘Cozy Up’ To Russian Government ProSense Jun 23 General Discussion
OP Greenwald Thinks Snowden’s Final Destination Is Still ‘Up In The Air’ ProSense Jun 23 General Discussion
OP NYT: Snowden "staying in an apartment... controlled by the Hong Kong government’s security branch" ProSense Jun 22 General Discussion
OP The ACLU message isn't going to help Snowden. ProSense Jun 22 General Discussion
OP Snowden spy row grows as US is accused of hacking China ProSense Jun 22 General Discussion
OP Snowden is going to be prosecuted. ProSense Jun 22 General Discussion
OP Greenwald: Snowden Charges Show Obama’s ‘Vindictive Mentality’... ProSense Jun 22 General Discussion
OP Is it OK to criticize Edward Snowden? ProSense Jun 21 General Discussion
OP NYT: Documents Detail N.S.A. Surveillance Rules ProSense Jun 20 General Discussion
OP Analysis: Why Edward Snowden isn't a whistle-blower, legally speaking ProSense Jun 18 General Discussion
OP What if Snowden didn't have authorized access? ProSense Jun 18 General Discussion
OP Greenwald is accusing President Obama of making "false" claims, but hasn't backed up his claims ProSense Jun 18 General Discussion
OP Where is the additional information Snowden says he's going to release? ProSense Jun 18 General Discussion
OP Iceland received informal approach over Snowden seeking asylum ProSense Jun 18 General Discussion
OP Excerpt: Obama talks NSA in Charlie Rose interview. ProSense Jun 18 General Discussion
OP Pew poll: Public Split over Impact of NSA Leak, But Most Want Snowden Prosecuted ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP NSA veteran: "So he is transitioning from whistle-blower to a traitor." ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP Glenn Greenwald Justifies Snowden’s Fear He Will Be Killed: U.S. ‘Targeted’ Americans In The Past ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP NYT editor's blog: Snowden’s Questionable New Turn ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP Edward Snowden Says More Info About "Direct Access" Is In the Works ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP Snowden: Obama Should Call For Special Committee To Review NSA Programs ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP Snowden: I Didn’t Reveal Any Operations Against ‘Legitimate’ Military Targets ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP Snowden basically admits the "direct access" claim was bullshit. ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP "the biggest intelligence leak in NSA history is answering your questions " ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP Fleeing the country to avoid prosecution makes Snowden a coward. ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP Edward Snowden To Participate In Online Q&A Today ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP Edward Snowden 'not a Chinese spy' - Beijing ProSense Jun 17 General Discussion
OP DNI denies NSA analysts can tap calls without a warrant ProSense Jun 16 General Discussion
OP Jerrold Nadler Does Not Think the NSA Can Listen to U.S. Phone Calls ProSense Jun 16 General Discussion
OP Schieffer Destroys Snowden: ‘I Don’t Remember Martin Luther King Jr. Or Rosa Parks Hiding In China’ ProSense Jun 16 General Discussion
OP Hong Kong rallies in the rain for Edward Snowden ProSense Jun 15 General Discussion
OP Snowden’s Leaks on China Could Affect Its Role in His Fate ProSense Jun 14 General Discussion
OP While working for spies, Snowden was secretly prolific online ProSense Jun 14 General Discussion
OP Kevin Drum: ProSense Jun 14 General Discussion
OP Greenwald: Edward Snowden's worst fear has not been realised – thankfully (cites polls) ProSense Jun 14 General Discussion
OP Snowden Is Using 'Specific' Evidence of the U.S. Hacking China to Stay Out of Jail ProSense Jun 14 General Discussion
OP Snowden Is Not Welcome In The U.K. ProSense Jun 14 General Discussion
OP Leaker's Ties to China Probed ProSense Jun 13 General Discussion
OP Guardian "walked back the 'direct access' claim made in Greenwald’s original article" ProSense Jun 13 General Discussion
OP Report: Snowden Stored Documents On Thumb Drive ProSense Jun 13 General Discussion
OP Poll: Majority Says Snowden Did A Good Thing, But He Should Be Prosecuted ProSense Jun 13 General Discussion
OP Finding the right balance between security and liberty ProSense Jun 13 General Discussion
OP NSA Director Says Leaker’s Wiretapping Ability Claims Are ‘False’ ProSense Jun 13 General Discussion
OP Report: Feds Hunted For Snowden Before He Went Public ProSense Jun 13 General Discussion
OP Guardian issues statement in reply to Rep. Peter King ProSense Jun 12 General Discussion
OP Glenn Greenwald to Pete King: Bring it on ProSense Jun 12 General Discussion
OP Josh Marshall: Curious ProSense Jun 12 General Discussion
OP Greenwald: “We Did Not Want To Just Go And Arbitrarily Disclose Things’ ProSense Jun 12 General Discussion
OP ...Showed Hong Kong Newspaper Documents Revealing US Hacking Attacks On China (updated 2x) ProSense Jun 12 General Discussion
OP Edward Snowden Reportedly Gives Interview To Chinese News Outlet ProSense Jun 12 General Discussion
OP NYT editorial: Surveillance: Snowden Doesn’t Rise to Traitor ProSense Jun 11 General Discussion
OP Eugene Robinson: Edward Snowden’s NSA leaks show we need a debate ProSense Jun 11 General Discussion
OP Bush broke the law. President Obama followed it. ProSense Jun 11 General Discussion
OP AP Editor: Do Not Describe Edward Snowden As A 'Whistleblower' ProSense Jun 10 General Discussion
OP A Very Real Issue (private contractors) ProSense Jun 10 General Discussion
OP "Most significant" leak in history, and likely one of the dumbest. ProSense Jun 10 General Discussion
OP Glenn Greenwald: I Know Where Snowden Is ‘Generally’ ProSense Jun 10 General Discussion
OP Snowden Helped Guardian Reporter With Secure Communication System ProSense Jun 10 General Discussion
OP Ron Paul: ‘We Should Be Thankful’ For Edward Snowden ProSense Jun 10 General Discussion
OP The "biggest leak in US political history" ProSense Jun 10 General Discussion
OP DOJ: No Comment On Snowden ProSense Jun 9 General Discussion
OP What happens if you don't take the loyalty oath to Edward Snowden? ProSense Jun 9 General Discussion
OP What’s the Deal with Hong Kong? ProSense Jun 9 General Discussion
OP Josh Marshall on Edward Snowden ProSense Jun 9 General Discussion