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In reply to the discussion: Riddle me this NRA... [View all]

sir pball

(5,341 posts)
64. Here's New York's relevant statues - please note we are NOT an "SYG" state.
Fri Jun 20, 2014, 12:48 PM
Jun 2014
§ 35.15 Justification; use of physical force in defense of a person.
1. A person may, subject to the provisions of subdivision two, use
physical force upon another person when and to the extent he or she
reasonably believes such to be necessary to defend himself, herself or a
third person from what he or she reasonably believes to be the use or
imminent use of unlawful physical force
by such other person, unless:
(a) The latter's conduct was provoked by the actor with intent to
cause physical injury to another person; or
(b) The actor was the initial aggressor; except that in such case the
use of physical force is nevertheless justifiable if the actor has
withdrawn from the encounter and effectively communicated such
withdrawal to such other person but the latter persists in continuing
the incident by the use or threatened imminent use of unlawful physical
force; or
(c) The physical force involved is the product of a combat by
agreement not specifically authorized by law.
2. A person may not use deadly physical force upon another person
under circumstances specified in subdivision one unless:
(a) The actor reasonably believes that such other person is using or
about to use deadly physical force.
Even in such case, however, the
actor may not use deadly physical force if he or she knows that with
complete personal safety, to oneself and others he or she may avoid the
necessity of so doing by retreating; except that the actor is under no
duty to retreat if he or she is:
(i) in his or her dwelling and not the initial aggressor; or
(ii) a police officer or peace officer or a person assisting a police
officer or a peace officer at the latter's direction, acting pursuant to
section 35.30; or
(b) He or she reasonably believes that such other person is committing
or attempting to commit a kidnapping, forcible rape, forcible criminal
sexual act or robbery; or
(c) He or she reasonably believes that such other person is committing
or attempting to commit a burglary, and the circumstances are such that
the use of deadly physical force is authorized by subdivision three of
section 35.20.


http://law.onecle.com/new-york/penal/PEN035.15_35.15.html

The bar for using force is exactly the same as in Michigan, or for that matter, any other jurisdiction where forcible self-defense is legal. Yes, there is a codified "duty to retreat", but in my first CCW class many moons ago in CT, which also has DTR on the books, we were explicitly told, in the event of facing an armed assailant at least, to not give it the slightest thought. There is no such thing as retreating in "complete safety" from bullets. Bluntly, your theoretical scenario would be just as legal in a non-SYG state.

Out of curiosity, what would you consider acceptable legal guidelines for the use of lethal force, given that the reference above is one of the stricter sets in the country?

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Riddle me this NRA... [View all] Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 OP
NRA's response... SummerSnow Jun 2014 #1
In war, combatants MUST wear uniforms dickthegrouch Jun 2014 #2
NRA types always care what multinational foreign governments have agreed to. IronLionZion Jun 2014 #4
So, my question to those people Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #9
Speaking of police states IronLionZion Jun 2014 #13
They seem REALLY "gung ho" Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #20
You're missing the point dickthegrouch Jun 2014 #44
The mere thought that they may be deprived of their liberty for any reason IronLionZion Jun 2014 #52
If only the waitress and waffle boy and toddler had guns IronLionZion Jun 2014 #3
You assumed "he was there to rob the place" NM_Birder Jun 2014 #5
Stand your ground is not " I'm allowed to kill anybody" Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #10
Add to your scenario, the idiot, I mean Patriot, with the rifle has it in a ready position.... Hassin Bin Sober Jun 2014 #12
Well, to me, Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #19
Not quite, a jury has to agree with your belief that you felt you were Lurks Often Jun 2014 #14
Jury verdicts are overturned all the time Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #16
Your entire premise is absurd Lurks Often Jun 2014 #17
The facts are: Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #18
your senario is not "absurd" NM_Birder Jun 2014 #63
Actually, you only have to convince one yahoo. Hoyt Jun 2014 #27
What was the law before 2006? hack89 Jun 2014 #58
"Gee" ...I'm always in awe of that, both argumentative, and childish at the same time. NM_Birder Jun 2014 #62
The NRA considers these peoples loss as a small price to pay for the gun nuts to carry and shoot liberal N proud Jun 2014 #6
NRA Science Department response underpants Jun 2014 #7
Hey! Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #11
NRA Science Department response underpants Jun 2014 #15
Jon Stewart ... napkinz Jun 2014 #8
The NRA's real response jmowreader Jun 2014 #21
I stand in awe... Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #22
Oh this needs a big fat kick! riderinthestorm Jun 2014 #23
Yeah, not getting much love Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #24
Wait just a minute, you asked what should the NRA do, I will tell you. randys1 Jun 2014 #26
Well, the Freedom Drone Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #33
This is the kind of comedic writing that DU needs more of! ManiacJoe Jun 2014 #25
Everybody who goes out in public Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #38
Potential situation, yes. Playout, no. ManiacJoe Jun 2014 #55
A yahoo Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #60
Had that been the scenario, you might have be right. ManiacJoe Jun 2014 #66
Sell more guns! shenmue Jun 2014 #28
So clever... aikoaiko Jun 2014 #29
Uh, I see photos all over the place of people Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #36
And yet these shoutout don't happen except in the minds of anti gunners aikoaiko Jun 2014 #39
It is not my "wish" Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #50
Luckily most gun owners and CCWers have better judgement than you Lee-Lee Jun 2014 #42
Again Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #49
Au contraire. Man's pistol goes off in the checkout line at Walmart riderinthestorm Jun 2014 #37
Not sure what that scenario has to do with OP or my reply aikoaiko Jun 2014 #40
This thread has made me realize... Llewlladdwr Jun 2014 #30
Yeah, but we never commit the violence Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #35
Maybe not with guns aikoaiko Jun 2014 #41
Right, since we are discussion gun laws Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #47
Barbara Lipscomb comes to mind. beevul Jun 2014 #45
You are correct Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #46
Yes, but shes a special case, she was Million Mom March organizer. beevul Jun 2014 #56
Again, make a list of "left wing anti-gun advocates who commit murder with a firearm" Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #59
Who said that? beevul Jun 2014 #65
Write to you in prison? hack89 Jun 2014 #31
As I pointed out in another post Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #34
Except courts have been adjudicating "reasonable" hack89 Jun 2014 #43
Yes, but the rules changed Kelvin Mace Jun 2014 #48
This message was self-deleted by its author hack89 Jun 2014 #51
This message was self-deleted by its author hack89 Jun 2014 #57
Nonsense hack89 Jun 2014 #61
Here's New York's relevant statues - please note we are NOT an "SYG" state. sir pball Jun 2014 #64
toon ... napkinz Jun 2014 #32
MOAR GUNZ! SwankyXomb Jun 2014 #53
Thankfully you don't own a firearm. dilby Jun 2014 #54
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