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woo me with science

(32,139 posts)
124. You say, "fair point," yet your next sentence accuses me of "hurling personal insults at Democrats."
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 08:03 PM
Jun 2014

It's a baseless accusation that reflects on your own conduct here rather than mine. You are the only one in this conversation who has repeatedly tried to make it personal, and you continue to do so. It is revelatory as to your lack of argument.

Your comments about Haiti here are similarly nonresponsive. More to the point, they are weirdly and dishonestly avoidant of the longstanding and continuing history of US corporate and military domination and exploitation of Haiti. You opine about poverty in Haiti "even before the earthquake," as though the earthquake, rather than decades of military and political manipulation, prevention of any development of independence through denial of sovereignty, installation of corporate goals rather than goals for Haitians, and coup/installation of government to enable theft and stripping by corporations of the country's own resources were not at fault. You ignore the more recent massive privatization forced on Haiti by the US and its allies after the 2004 coup and the neoliberal "restructuring programs" that have deepened poverty for Haitians through familiar Shock Doctrine measures like making IMF loans conditional on the implementation of vicious neoliberal wage and social policies.

In short, you deal with the accusation of US corporate exploitation of Haiti by utterly ignoring it and adding baseless personal attacks to distract from the fact you are ignoring it.

Corporate exploitation of Haiti, resulting in the deaths of countless Haitians and unfathomable misery over the decades, has been and remains a national shame for the US. More importantly, it serves as a deadly warning of what happens to countries and human beings when governments are subverted for corporate interests rather than human interests.

Decades and decades ago, the US took control of Haiti by force and changed its Constitution to allow corporations to seize the land of the Haitian people. Now we're facing relentless attempts by corporate-bought politicians to dismantle our own Constitutional protections and grow the power of corporations over our lives through predatory "trade agreements" that will overrule the will of the people on issues ranging from environmental regulation to worker protections.

Americans have largely been insulated from the effects of US corporate policy all over the world. We mostly grew up believing that hunger and privation just happen, usually over there somewhere, to people who don't look like us and for reasons that are never quite clear. But there are reasons. Corporations don't operate on morality. For them, there is no currency in a government, "of, by, and for the people." The only consideration is profit.

The global corporatists are just getting started here. But they have already impoverished and killed masses of human beings all over the world, for profit. We are not special to them.

We cannot afford four more years of allowing corporatists to grow their power in Washington. We can't afford continued assaults on our Constitutional protections and the growth of this surveillance state. We can't afford more austerity and privatization and protection of banks over people. And we can't afford Hillary's TPP.







Blood money? hrmjustin Jun 2014 #1
NAFTA/Glass Steagal Repeal? 4Q2u2 Jun 2014 #4
Blood money is too stroong a word. I disliked NAFTA but I loved Clinton. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #5
I save blood money for the Bush Cheney crew- this is more "they're all exactly the same" bettyellen Jun 2014 #11
Agreed! I hope we all can support the nominee. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #14
I don't recall writing that they're exactly the same. MannyGoldstein Jun 2014 #17
It's a meme going around here- saw Hil compared to Romney- then Malia and Sasha to Bush's kids on bettyellen Jun 2014 #22
I believe that you wrote that my post was more of "exactly the same" MannyGoldstein Jun 2014 #23
the "blood money" is OTT. just as comping Clinton wealth with Romney wealth is..... bettyellen Jun 2014 #26
^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^ (But alas, it will doubtless fall on deaf ears.) 11 Bravo Jun 2014 #32
yep, if speaking fees are blood money, bad trade agreements murder..... bettyellen Jun 2014 #37
You have no idea the affects Nafta had on the poor and homeless. Phlem Jun 2014 #49
I actually do. It is still overheated rhetoric. And a naive line of thinking. bettyellen Jun 2014 #50
Oh I'm sure you do. Phlem Jun 2014 #56
You have absolutely no idea what I have experienced- but thanks anyway for the snark bettyellen Jun 2014 #60
Same here, and your welcome for the snark. Phlem Jun 2014 #64
Did someone actually compare Clinton wealth with Romney wealth? Dawgs Jun 2014 #45
Yep, I have seen the comparison 5-6 times in the last two days. bettyellen Jun 2014 #48
The last line of this OP is: bvar22 Jun 2014 #121
it's the "blood money" rhetoric that I- and many here- find OTT bettyellen Jun 2014 #129
First of all, all this talk about blood money is nothing but a straw man. hueymahl Jun 2014 #143
It renders the term blood money meaningless. bettyellen Jun 2014 #145
Congrats - Two logical falacies at once hueymahl Jun 2014 #148
With respect... davidthegnome Jun 2014 #150
I completely agree, but at this moment- discussing these candidates- it is what we are stuck with bettyellen Jun 2014 #154
I consider "we're stuck with it" to be a Third Way talking point woo me with science Jun 2014 #156
I'm pragmatic about where we are at the present moment bettyellen Jun 2014 #166
Merely saying that supporting a neoliberal candidate is "pragmatic" does not make it so. woo me with science Jun 2014 #168
again, you are making unfounded assumptions - where did I say I support Hillary? NOWHERE. bettyellen Jun 2014 #170
You're implying the OP is written by an "uninformed" citizen. 2banon Jun 2014 #152
No, I am saying it is hyperbole that the uninformed will take and run with. bettyellen Jun 2014 #155
If it comes from 4Q2u2 Jun 2014 #20
Koch bros funded the DLC... HooptieWagon Jun 2014 #144
Important point. woo me with science Jun 2014 #158
I love you too nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #27
I understand the Nafta and tpp opposition. believe me I do. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #29
Given what the economic policies have done nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #31
Technically I guess it is not. zeemike Jun 2014 #92
Glass-steagall was rendered impotent during the Reagan administration AgingAmerican Jun 2014 #125
She has blood on her hands Michigander_Life Jun 2014 #7
I am sorry but I don't agree. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #9
she does not samsingh Jun 2014 #15
Yes she does. Michigander_Life Jun 2014 #21
Yeah, whatever........ Beacool Jun 2014 #54
and her husband has the blood of Iraqi children on his hands: Whisp Jun 2014 #115
How would you define "blood money"? nt MannyGoldstein Jun 2014 #8
Not the Clinton speaking fees. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #10
this is not blood money. The Clinton's are fantastic. samsingh Jun 2014 #16
I don't get it either. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #18
Blood Money PowerToThePeople Jun 2014 #136
"It ain't the money: it's the bull@#$%." Dawgs Jun 2014 #2
^ truth Boom Sound 416 Jun 2014 #30
I don't mind that Hillary is rich. I mind that she's a warmongering, TPP-backing neo-con. Scuba Jun 2014 #3
Other than H.Clinton's Iraq war vote, why is she called a warmonger? lumpy Jun 2014 #77
read where she said DonCoquixote Jun 2014 #85
Wow. What else? lumpy Jun 2014 #98
There is this little clip about Gaddafi and Libya: bvar22 Jun 2014 #122
That's not enough? Scuba Jun 2014 #113
What is her position on Syria? lumpy Jun 2014 #160
Maybe by "targeted response" she meant we'd buy Syrian refugees some food and clothing at Target. Scuba Jun 2014 #161
But she's a warmongering, TPP-backing neo-con with a "D" after her name, Maedhros Jun 2014 #102
Its all knee-jerk, Romney money - good. Clinton money - baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad. marble falls Jun 2014 #6
Actually Romney is seen increasingly in the same club nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #28
Increasingly? Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jun 2014 #39
Let me clarify, the 1% is seen as a mass nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #43
I think many of them are. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jun 2014 #46
I am deep in reading economic policy right now nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #51
I would consider Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jun 2014 #58
To your last point nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #62
I'm thinking more infrastructure Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jun 2014 #72
And that creates jobs , hopefully triggering nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #74
Again, hopefully so. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jun 2014 #75
PUMAEWMHPCSPUOE! onehandle Jun 2014 #12
Well you better inform some others here JaneyVee Jun 2014 #13
sigh. you persist in trying to falsely make this about people here hating rich people cali Jun 2014 #35
Sticking her foot in her mouth......uh uh... lumpy Jun 2014 #84
brilliant response! such depth. such meaning. cali Jun 2014 #88
You brilliance is noted, but Baby, you forgot to complete your sentences in a couple of your lines. lumpy Jun 2014 #97
What about the rich 3rd way. Phlem Jun 2014 #52
Hillary is fantastic! samsingh Jun 2014 #19
They made money the old fashioned way - by exploiting minorities. OnyxCollie Jun 2014 #70
Thank you for this post. woo me with science Jun 2014 #104
isn't this more about the factory owners? samsingh Jun 2014 #108
The factory owners OnyxCollie Jun 2014 #111
To rich folks, when "earning" money, slave labor is something of which one never thinks. Maedhros Jun 2014 #130
Haiti is Open for Business... Whisp Jun 2014 #141
I don't think it's about the money. MoonchildCA Jun 2014 #24
blood money? bigtree Jun 2014 #25
Can you say the Carlyle Group is not Blood Money 4Q2u2 Jun 2014 #33
Thank you. These protestations are lame and absurd. woo me with science Jun 2014 #36
I hear Crickets 4Q2u2 Jun 2014 #61
K&R Of course it's blood money, both literally and figuratively. woo me with science Jun 2014 #34
+1 deutsey Jun 2014 #41
She worse that a fucking Republican, am I right? Jeff In Milwaukee Jun 2014 #47
It's the policies, Jeff. I think *you* need to calm down, woo me with science Jun 2014 #55
You're one, what am I? Jeff In Milwaukee Jun 2014 #105
Can you please stop making it personal for a moment and respond to the policies? woo me with science Jun 2014 #107
A fair point... Jeff In Milwaukee Jun 2014 #110
You say, "fair point," yet your next sentence accuses me of "hurling personal insults at Democrats." woo me with science Jun 2014 #124
Baseless? Jeff In Milwaukee Jun 2014 #128
You are remarkably incapable of making, or refuting, effective arguments. [n/t] Maedhros Jun 2014 #131
The constant denial of the link between predatory policies and economic and human despair woo me with science Jun 2014 #132
And all of this... Jeff In Milwaukee Jun 2014 #139
An excellent way to end this exchange. Thank you. woo me with science Jun 2014 #153
Well said and exactly right. Number23 Jun 2014 #134
Wow you silver tongue devil remind me not to get in a policy debate with you. Nice retort woo n/t Drew Richards Jun 2014 #171
OMG Phlem Jun 2014 #66
You are right. 'A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing'. It is amazing to hear that Hillary is lumpy Jun 2014 #82
Hillary is not my favorite Democrat. JEB Jun 2014 #149
Sadly, anything connected with Wall St and bankers today is in essence blood money. raouldukelives Jun 2014 #38
Nicely said deutsey Jun 2014 #42
Wut, wut, wut? Phlem Jun 2014 #59
Now that you have discovered the cause of all the ills of mankind, what is your solution to lumpy Jun 2014 #83
The only solutions I can control are my own. raouldukelives Jun 2014 #142
Your pipe dreams are the pipe dreams of most of us, including me. lumpy Jun 2014 #163
BITCOINS!....snark... Drew Richards Jun 2014 #172
Well said. woo me with science Jun 2014 #135
Excellent points. Thank you for the thoughtful post. JEB Jun 2014 #151
much of their money came from book sales dsc Jun 2014 #40
Wow Manny. You SO nailed it here. I'd been worried about you, but closeupready Jun 2014 #44
The overwrought wild exaggerations that one has come to expect here. Beacool Jun 2014 #53
Given that is the exact language I heard nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #65
I won't need any smelling salts. Beacool Jun 2014 #67
And we hear WHOOOSHHHH!!!!!! nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #68
What I'm trying to say is that this is all white noise, that it doesn't matter. Beacool Jun 2014 #71
You are right, at the individual level they do not matter nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #73
Except it's not. Elizabeth Warren is touted as the anti Hillary and she's very wealthy Bluenorthwest Jun 2014 #157
Nice OP Manny. Phlem Jun 2014 #57
It ain't the money: it's the bull@#$%. 840high Jun 2014 #63
all great wealth is from blood money. unblock Jun 2014 #69
" i'm much more interested in senator warrens' amazing talents and plans than i am about hearing... bettyellen Jun 2014 #79
Oh please. Why not just compare the Clintons to Pol Pot or Stalin? NYC Liberal Jun 2014 #76
In the real world NAFTA, a product of Bill's economic policy, nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #78
My job got shipped overseas, overnight, because of NAFTA. Phlem Jun 2014 #94
You will love the column I am working on for I guess tomorrow nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #95
Totally looking forward to it. Phlem Jun 2014 #96
Thanks for the mail! Phlem Jun 2014 #99
Need to go to county for the vote on budget nadinbrzezinski Jun 2014 #100
I know right? Phlem Jun 2014 #80
You want progress? You want higher living standards? NYC Liberal Jun 2014 #101
riiiiiigggggghhhhhhhttt. Phlem Jun 2014 #103
Nope. You definitely can be a liberal and not support Hillary. NYC Liberal Jun 2014 #109
Says you. Phlem Jun 2014 #112
i thought liberals abandoned the party noiretextatique Jun 2014 #114
Sure, that's what it is. Phlem Jun 2014 #116
i totally agree with you noiretextatique Jun 2014 #117
I had a feeling we were in accord, sorry for coming off pissed. Phlem Jun 2014 #119
you too, Phelm noiretextatique Jun 2014 #120
The term "Liberal" has been coopted by moderate Republicans Maedhros Jun 2014 #133
This is what I'm trying to say. Phlem Jun 2014 #137
This is a very lame response woo me with science Jun 2014 #81
The OP actually compared them to beloved figures leftstreet Jun 2014 #90
They ARE comparing the Clintons with Pol Pot and Stalin. That is not the way to influence lumpy Jun 2014 #91
So did a lot of people. Which doesn't mean they'd make a decent president. Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2014 #86
By the time Bill Clinton left the WH there was only one reason I could still tolerate him tularetom Jun 2014 #87
DURec leftstreet Jun 2014 #89
Speaking of blood, there are too damn many people on this site who are willing to draw blood. lumpy Jun 2014 #93
I swear.... Jeff In Milwaukee Jun 2014 #106
I agree that the Clintons earned their money. Chuck Finley Jun 2014 #118
They weren't paid because they just walked in off the street AgingAmerican Jun 2014 #127
You realize you are posting a rational statement in this thread? BootinUp Jun 2014 #165
It ain't the money: it's the bull@#$%. bvar22 Jun 2014 #123
Yes, they did AgingAmerican Jun 2014 #126
"It ain't the money, it's the bullshit." Perfectly stated. nomorenomore08 Jun 2014 #138
Draft Senator Warren for President, 2016 (nt) NYC_SKP Jun 2014 #140
Do you think she 'earned' her 15 Million Dollars running a shelter for homeless bunny rabbits? Bluenorthwest Jun 2014 #146
Why are you in favor of the Iraq and Afghanistan wars? MannyGoldstein Jun 2014 #159
Everybody seems to have missed the last line: "It ain't the money: it's the bull@#$%." Says it all. marble falls Jun 2014 #147
Terms are very relative. NCTraveler Jun 2014 #162
Someone actually suggested to 1SBM that women, LGBTs and POC have some differences in priorities bettyellen Jun 2014 #167
Hey look. If you want to post fantasy about the Clintons BootinUp Jun 2014 #164
kick woo me with science Jun 2014 #169
kick woo me with science Jun 2014 #173
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