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Fool Count

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227. I don't know about "never, ever". Imagine a situation when terrorists set up a powerful bomb

Sat Apr 7, 2012, 07:12 AM

Apr 2012

to go off in a crowded football stadium and the only way to disarm it is to say that word.
And let's say there are only white people around. I posit that it would be quite appropriate
then for a white person to say it. So there goes the "never, ever" imperative.
If that situation seems too improbable to you, consider another less outlandish hypothetical.
Let's say you are a white person and you are doing subtitles for HBO's Def Comedy Jam,
so that deaf people may enjoy its humor too. And let's say you lost your arms in a childhood
circular saw accident or were born without them. Anyhow, you cannot type and must use
voice recognition software to do those subtitles. Obviously software couldn't process the
comedians' speech directly, so it is up to you to repeat all words of the routine in a clear
voice with a neutral accent. I'd say in this situation it is not only appropriate but obligatory
for you to say that word. So here we have two counterexamples, and it only takes one to
debunk any absolute claim.

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my friend said, "it is never, ever okay for white people to say (n-word)." [View all] nofurylike Apr 2012 OP

oh horseshit. words are just letters arranged in a certain order. Schema Thing Apr 2012 #1

Are you black, SCHEMA? Just curious based on your comment. Ecumenist Apr 2012 #3

I don't like anyone using that word. Some words need to die. That one needs to die. roguevalley Apr 2012 #29

No, but just like my Black friends I've been using words since I was a toddler. Schema Thing Apr 2012 #50

that's a cheeky thing to say to someone like me. I'm a BLACK WOMAN MARRIED to a SOUTHERN Ecumenist Apr 2012 #62

Where did you get this idea? Schema Thing Apr 2012 #75

Where did I get that idea? Are you serious? What about this: Ecumenist Apr 2012 #78

yeah, I still don't get where you took something I didn't say from something I did say. Schema Thing Apr 2012 #89

hoping for better from others is not "authoritarian." nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #92

Sorry Schema, but just because you feel entitled to use hate speech DOES NOT MAKE YOU BLACK or just Ecumenist Apr 2012 #94

Again, you are refusing to read or reply to my actual words. Schema Thing Apr 2012 #99

Lecturing people? I'm not the only one who are READING YOUR WORDS AND GETTING THE SAME Ecumenist Apr 2012 #125

Sorry, but no you don't tkmorris Apr 2012 #137

You got that right! Tell it like it is! goclark Apr 2012 #117

i inferred the same from "I've been using words since i was a toddler." since most have, nofurylike Apr 2012 #107

Thank you, Ecumenist. I too am a black woman married to a white man Number23 Apr 2012 #115

White here with a sister married to a black man. It bothers me also so you can imagine how it feels jwirr Apr 2012 #165

Some moron came up with the fundamentally flawed idea that using it everyday would reduce it's Ecumenist Apr 2012 #181

I agree. And it doesn't help my sister, her husband or their children. jwirr Apr 2012 #187

Geez Louise Number23 Apr 2012 #114

Why is that deserving of a face palm? EOTE Apr 2012 #162

So your significant other is okay with people calling her the n word? Number23 Apr 2012 #213

She uses it herself. EOTE Apr 2012 #218

I'm Not Black RobinA Apr 2012 #177

Well, the chance of becoming queen of anything other than a turnip or pumpkin festival Ecumenist Apr 2012 #183

Way To Miss the Point n/m RobinA Apr 2012 #208

Understood completely and realiser you're naive to think that you could become queen of anything Ecumenist Apr 2012 #209

gawd-damned straight! (edited) Cerridwen Apr 2012 #6

Well said, but I think you're misinformed about Godwin. EOTE Apr 2012 #163

I'm relieved to see another has the same interpretation. Cerridwen Apr 2012 #232

i see that to you they are. nofurylike Apr 2012 #24

It's not your fault that you're profoundly ignorant of the historical context this word came from, sudopod Apr 2012 #43

I'm every bit as aware as you are of the historical context of the word. Schema Thing Apr 2012 #52

That's nice in theory. sudopod Apr 2012 #54

whoa there Schema Thing Apr 2012 #63

Talking like a damn fool. sudopod Apr 2012 #67

Brilliant!! thank you for that, sudopod!! heartbreakingly spot on Truth. nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #90

;) sudopod Apr 2012 #113

thank you so very much, sudopod. nofurylike Apr 2012 #120

I used to completely agree with your claim, but I have learned words are ZombieHorde Apr 2012 #119

In addition to the meaning of the person who hears them, also... LanternWaste Apr 2012 #156

I just wanted to say "Thank You" for saying what I've been feeling for so long now. EnviroBat Apr 2012 #166

Amen, NoFuryLIke!.. Iam a black woman MARRIED to a white man and HE HAS NEVER USED THAT WORD Ecumenist Apr 2012 #2

thank you so very much, Ecumenist!! nofurylike Apr 2012 #7

I taught my kid the reason the word is wrong, beyond being crude and disrespectful, is that where freshwest Apr 2012 #28

Amen, FreshWest. It seems that the Trayvon Martin case is bringing out of the woodwork Ecumenist Apr 2012 #70

a crucially important aspect, "an 'action' word," thank you so much, freshwest!! and nofurylike Apr 2012 #97

I never used that word with my husband who was black man notadmblnd Apr 2012 #35

What about Eminem? nt Snake Alchemist Apr 2012 #4

i would say the same to him, though i doubt he'd listen any more nofurylike Apr 2012 #9

Actually Eminem never said the N-word in ANY of his songs. FarLeftFist Apr 2012 #15

thank you for correcting that, FarLeftFist. i apologize to Eminem for nofurylike Apr 2012 #22

You need to listen to his underground stuff. Snake Alchemist Apr 2012 #23

So if my daugher asks what the "n-word" is and why she should never say it, hughee99 Apr 2012 #5

i ask that other parents please reply to that. nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #8

I think, Hughee99, that you need to tell your sweet little girl what the word is, why she shouldn't Ecumenist Apr 2012 #13

very beautifully said. thank you so much for that, Ecumenist. nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #27

That approach worked well with my daughter. Mariana Apr 2012 #49

Adults don't like to admit to being retroactively wrong loyalsister Apr 2012 #88

that is insightful!!! yes! "being retroactively wrong ... they feel the need to defend"!! nofurylike Apr 2012 #98

awesome loyalsister Apr 2012 #104

thank you for bringing it to this thread, loyalsister. nofurylike Apr 2012 #121

Any and all, I guess loyalsister Apr 2012 #144

o my, that is an entire discussion, in itself! much to think about ! nofurylike Apr 2012 #193

As far as your original post... loyalsister Apr 2012 #196

great!! i reply tonight, but briefly: "when you say it quoting someone else ... " y'know? nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #198

That's kind of tricky loyalsister Apr 2012 #200

If she's old enough to ask and wonder dems_rightnow Apr 2012 #14

clarifying. thank you so much for replying to that, dems_rightnow. nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #31

Of course you should guitar man Apr 2012 #46

we have this thing called the first amendment quinnox Apr 2012 #10

You are free to say it Aerows Apr 2012 #12

correct, and that is why I agree quinnox Apr 2012 #17

maybe even the consequences of our own consciences. nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #38

How are you then free to say it? NutmegYankee Apr 2012 #145

having a *legal right* to say it is not a question raised by my post (though good question). nofurylike Apr 2012 #37

It's never okay for heterosexuals to Aerows Apr 2012 #11

i agree. thank you for adding that, Aerows. nofurylike Apr 2012 #40

I agree NFL. I get embarrassed when I hear OTHER people say it. It's 100% wrong. FarLeftFist Apr 2012 #16

thank you, again, more, FarLeftFist. i get embarrassed too!! 100%,YES! nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #41

When we were kids and would pile up on each other playing, we'd call it "n***** pile." Archae Apr 2012 #18

I had a friend that asked me what you call Brazil nuts Aerows Apr 2012 #19

We never used the racist term for them. Archae Apr 2012 #26

We played that game, but we called it Jam Pile. notadmblnd Apr 2012 #25

Nowadays kids call it "dog pile." Archae Apr 2012 #33

And we called it a pig pile. I never heard the n-word until we were much older. I saw the first jwirr Apr 2012 #167

It changed, for us, to "pig pile". uppityperson Apr 2012 #36

us too. one of the deepest, most intensely shame-filled lessons i ever learned was nofurylike Apr 2012 #103

This PC horseshit is getting old derby378 Apr 2012 #20

So, because we're democrats/progressives, we should just go around caling browns and blacks "n*****s Ecumenist Apr 2012 #45

I am a Polack, thank you very much derby378 Apr 2012 #48

HAHAHAHA sudopod Apr 2012 #55

Do YOU intend to use any of those words? derby378 Apr 2012 #58

For ANYONE to suggest that ANY group of people shouldn't say a word LaydeeBug Apr 2012 #71

oh lord sudopod Apr 2012 #83

Please LaydeeBug Apr 2012 #153

LaydeeBud, Frankly, I don't think that ANYONE should use this language because it's only Ecumenist Apr 2012 #127

That's Laydeebug, thankyouverymuch, and I agree with you, which is why that racist "friend" should LaydeeBug Apr 2012 #154

:clap: nofurylike Apr 2012 #123

Don't twist what I was saying because you know damn well what my point was. Your attempt Ecumenist Apr 2012 #66

I don't know where you're getting all these ideas from... derby378 Apr 2012 #72

I'm not saying that nobody use them but there is a history behind certain words that prevent them Ecumenist Apr 2012 #81

yes! "there is a history behind certain words that prevent them nofurylike Apr 2012 #126

There is a difference between making certain words part of a benign language... derby378 Apr 2012 #158

no, i didn't write out the c-word. nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #203

yes!! "they would have been (obsolete) at least one hundred years ago." nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #124

To me PC is a rw term - in our family we do not use derogatory words to describe other races jwirr Apr 2012 #170

very well said, thank you so very much, jwirr! nofurylike Apr 2012 #224

"the words that were designed to hurt and degrade" nofurylike Apr 2012 #122

Wow, you must be great fun at parties. nt sudopod Apr 2012 #47

sanitary? how about compassionate, at least? nofurylike Apr 2012 #109

If you don't want me to use the word, don't use it yourself derby378 Apr 2012 #159

i sit in awe at the challenge for people to actually not be purposely offensive to others. seabeyond Apr 2012 #21

yes!! that is really what the argument seems to come down to: nofurylike Apr 2012 #128

Do you really think that it is appropriate gvstn Apr 2012 #30

+100 derby378 Apr 2012 #44

i protested people's using swastikas in avatars here nofurylike Apr 2012 #131

My children were instructed from birth to NEVER use this word w8liftinglady Apr 2012 #32

i explained to my daughter never to use this word as well orleans Apr 2012 #108

beautifully said, orleans, thank you so very much!! nofurylike Apr 2012 #138

VERY well put, w8liftinglady!! "It is foul,obscene-because of its intent. nofurylike Apr 2012 #135

George Carlins and Richard Pryors take on it... -..__... Apr 2012 #34

... and I say - "it is never, ever okay for ME to say (n-word)". stlsaxman Apr 2012 #39

good points, stlsaxman! thank you! nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #225

great discussion, and thank you so for recs!! must run, back later to reply more nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #42

It's certainly never appropriate for people to call each other that word fujiyama Apr 2012 #51

Bingo! derby378 Apr 2012 #56

first, i am not advocating censorship. that should not be necessary with principled nofurylike Apr 2012 #204

I just view the use of dashes and other symbols as silly and pointless fujiyama Apr 2012 #216

Freedom of speech felix_numinous Apr 2012 #53

Tell your friend that it is no ok to refer to caucasian European Americans as "whire". vr94rx7 Apr 2012 #57

"Whire?" derby378 Apr 2012 #59

I hate to be called white so much i forgot how to spell it lol. vr94rx7 Apr 2012 #60

Except when reading Twain. alphafemale Apr 2012 #61

Stings is correct gvstn Apr 2012 #77

that's what an exacto knife is for Schema Thing Apr 2012 #79

I'm white. I would never use the N word. But I don't like the 'tude of your friend. Honeycombe8 Apr 2012 #64

"...at least according to a white's perspective." sudopod Apr 2012 #69

GOD BLESS YOU HONEYCOMB, I am kinda shocked no one called out the friend. LaydeeBug Apr 2012 #73

Well put. nt Union Scribe Apr 2012 #86

As a minority, I call BULLSHIT, and the fact that "your friend" says WHITE PEOPLE can't say it... LaydeeBug Apr 2012 #65

You know LayDeeBug, I have never understood people who claimed that blacks can't be racist. Ecumenist Apr 2012 #129

and it seems the OP's "friend" is an example of someone who wants to BE racist LaydeeBug Apr 2012 #146

Unless you're quoting a line from "Blazing Saddles" AnnieBW Apr 2012 #68

I think it's undeniable that that movie, using humor, helped people Schema Thing Apr 2012 #82

"the social prudishness that has crept into society" sudopod Apr 2012 #84

well, certainly the enlightened attitudes of the movie Blazing Saddles Schema Thing Apr 2012 #91

AW COME ON, IT'S A JOKE! sudopod Apr 2012 #95

somehow you still seem humorless Schema Thing Apr 2012 #100

Post removed Post removed Apr 2012 #102

Post removed Post removed Apr 2012 #105

You have the right to say whatever you want. sudopod Apr 2012 #106

but I don't have any "backwards-ass" opinions. Schema Thing Apr 2012 #110

Bullied? Do you even know what "authortarian" means? sudopod Apr 2012 #111

Amen, Sudopod! There are just some that cannot or WILL NOT understand... Ecumenist Apr 2012 #130

Mein kampfy chair Oilwellian Apr 2012 #199

Right. Archie Bunker was a racist, and they should have NEVER made that show. Romulox Apr 2012 #176

No it is not ok wendylaroux Apr 2012 #74

I so agree and to even use debasements arthritisR_US Apr 2012 #76

+1 freshwest Apr 2012 #80

+ 100 loyalsister Apr 2012 #96

Ain't it the truth! Just because SOME black folks use self-denigrating language DOES NOT Ecumenist Apr 2012 #133

All groups do it, it's just not something I arthritisR_US Apr 2012 #192

Thank you WendyLaRoux, for pointing out what SHOULD be obvious! Ecumenist Apr 2012 #132

Thanks! wendylaroux Apr 2012 #169

absolutely!! thank you very much wendylaroux! welcome! nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #205

Context is everything guitar man Apr 2012 #85

Neither of my 21 year olds pipoman Apr 2012 #87

what blacks are using it? I'VE NEVER HEARD ANYONE BLACK USE THAT WORD! Ecumenist Apr 2012 #134

I think you're doing it again tkmorris Apr 2012 #140

I had two other people read this post and they both started laughing and saying that Ecumenist Apr 2012 #142

Most people who read the post as a response to the OP pipoman Apr 2012 #148

Maybe the context of my post is lost if you don't first read the post pipoman Apr 2012 #147

Spam deleted by PassingFair (MIR Team) dont h8--appreciate Apr 2012 #207

are you a black person? hfojvt Apr 2012 #93

I repeat. Geez Louise... Number23 Apr 2012 #116

thank you, Number23. nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #223

A-Okay. yewberry Apr 2012 #101

In my opinion white people should never use that word to refer to black people. Vattel Apr 2012 #112

Yes, Vattel, EVERYTHING you said is completely correct. Ecumenist Apr 2012 #136

I have a question nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #118

NadinBrzezinski, I have no earthly idea why that student was offended by your research Ecumenist Apr 2012 #139

It made sense, if you think about it nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #178

thank you, all, for this oustanding discussion! much to reply to all! nofurylike Apr 2012 #141

A specific example for discussion (warning: the word is spelled out) Jim Lane Apr 2012 #143

My mother LOVES that word. YellowRubberDuckie Apr 2012 #149

growing up in segregated Texas in the 50s I never remember hearing my white parents say it. CTyankee Apr 2012 #150

'Plenty of racists don't say it but I'll bet they think it... ' bart95 Apr 2012 #161

aw, come on, you know what I mean. CTyankee Apr 2012 #168

i did stretch it a bit bart95 Apr 2012 #172

In many ways, I agree with you. I'm talking about people who are only mildly hiding CTyankee Apr 2012 #180

It was EASY to discern what you meant, CTYankee. Ecumenist Apr 2012 #188

Should Harper Lee have used asterisks in "To Kill a Mockingbird"? (nt) Nye Bevan Apr 2012 #151

No. She revealed, through dialog, what the problem was. Everybody reading her book knew CTyankee Apr 2012 #194

Can i still sing along to DJ Fletch in the car? nt Snake Alchemist Apr 2012 #152

It's a horrible word that I never, ever, ever use. HappyMe Apr 2012 #155

I agree 100% duhneece Apr 2012 #157

it's not ok for anyone to use it, if you really want it to go away bart95 Apr 2012 #160

I do hope that you and your friend would make allowances for artistic expression slackmaster Apr 2012 #164

Yep. Spike Lee is right. Taverner Apr 2012 #171

so he's advocating 'qualified equality' bart95 Apr 2012 #173

Belated +bazillion derby378 Apr 2012 #231

Spike Lee is a proven idiot. dont h8--appreciate Apr 2012 #206

Opinion noted, Mr 11 posts... Taverner Apr 2012 #210

I can call my brother a dumb bastard and get away with it. He's my brother. Ikonoklast Apr 2012 #174

but if you were to consistently and publicly call him that bart95 Apr 2012 #175

Nope. Doesn't work that way. You are not allowed to call him anything. Ikonoklast Apr 2012 #179

no, here's how it works bart95 Apr 2012 #182

You try it first. I'll watch. Ikonoklast Apr 2012 #185

no, i dont have a chip on my shoulder bart95 Apr 2012 #186

Used to spend a lot of time in courtrooms. Ikonoklast Apr 2012 #190

'I've been insulted by experts before.' bart95 Apr 2012 #195

Right....cause white people are the only ones who are verbally racist.... cbdo2007 Apr 2012 #184

And I say it's never okay for anyone to say it....black, white, or other. Iggo Apr 2012 #189

Oh yeah, I say n***** all the time. Quantess Apr 2012 #191

great comments! thank you!! i apologize i couldn't reply yesterday, or till tonight. nt nofurylike Apr 2012 #197

Nope. Fail. turn off your mind Apr 2012 #201

Your friend seems narrowminded and bigoted... MellowDem Apr 2012 #202

a-MEN. nt LaydeeBug Apr 2012 #217

Here's an interesting idea theaocp Apr 2012 #211

I'm a historian, and the word comes up in documents often... a la izquierda Apr 2012 #212

How am I to sing along with N.W.A. without it? MrSlayer Apr 2012 #214

this is about the responsibility of white people who want to be nofurylike Apr 2012 #215

There is only one situation when you can use the word "Nigger" grantcart Apr 2012 #219

see? exactly the point! said it with relish, didn't you? nofurylike Apr 2012 #220

i always talk about Dick Gregory with great relish. grantcart Apr 2012 #221

i can understand that, absolutely! and an evening with Dick Gregory?! i would too!! nofurylike Apr 2012 #222

I figured it would be provocative enough that it would attract some unsuspecting folks grantcart Apr 2012 #229

great thought, grantcart! i hope it will! nofurylike Apr 2012 #233

i'm sorry my thread has outgrown my dial-up. i can reply to one or two posts nofurylike Apr 2012 #226

I don't know about "never, ever". Imagine a situation when terrorists set up a powerful bomb Fool Count Apr 2012 #227

oh noes!1 my absolute claim is irrefutably rebutted!!1! nofurylike Apr 2012 #228

OK, I see you were not impressed with my counterexamples. Fool Count Apr 2012 #230

i was impressed! superb parody!! nofurylike Apr 2012 #234