General Discussion

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)

64. OK, understood, but the facts related seem to be accurate, it is an account worth telling, based on

Reply to Jefferson23 (Reply #37)

Mon Jul 28, 2014, 05:28 PM

Jul 2014

the facts, no matter the reputation.

Like Rand Paul, at times.

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If Americans Knew - What Every American needs to know about Israel/Palestine [View all] Fred Sanders Jul 2014 OP

So what borders should Israel be restricted to? hack89 Jul 2014 #1

As per the original UN borders. Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #3

The UN says the 1967 borders are the starting point for negotiations hack89 Jul 2014 #6

I agree. But why reinvent the wheel? There is already a comprehensive plan...adopt it. No further Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #7

The original plan got blown up in a couple of wars hack89 Jul 2014 #9

Not so fast, sir: Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #14

I think you need to read my post, just above, and restate your position. Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #16

What comprehensive plan are you referring to? hack89 Jul 2014 #44

See, I can tell by your phrasing you're clueless Scootaloo Jul 2014 #23

Post removed Post removed Jul 2014 #42

Oh my lord. Scootaloo Jul 2014 #49

dear scootaloo Voice for Peace Jul 2014 #96

Some are uneducatable. But they can be burned. Comrade Grumpy Jul 2014 #114

No, Netanyahu and Likud do not want a peace treaty Hippo_Tron Jul 2014 #115

negotiations ... ? Tuesday Afternoon Jul 2014 #12

I am only pointing out the UN's position on Israel's borders. nt hack89 Jul 2014 #13

The poster would probably restrict them to an island in the Mediterranean. HERVEPA Jul 2014 #4

The borders Israel declared to the world in 1948, perhaps? Scootaloo Jul 2014 #11

Those negotiations already took place. Calista241 Jul 2014 #15

No in fact they haven't Scootaloo Jul 2014 #18

Since the beginning of human civilization, the winner of a war either gets territory Calista241 Jul 2014 #27

"Might Makes Right" is a barbarism that has been rightly abandoned in the civilized world Scootaloo Jul 2014 #30

Hear. Hear. This post deserve its own thread because snagglepuss Jul 2014 #46

There ARE treaties. Calista241 Jul 2014 #51

Wow, really? Putting Israel in the same basket as ISIS and Russia, huh? As DEFENSE of Israel? Scootaloo Jul 2014 #53

There has NEVER been a state of Palestine. Calista241 Jul 2014 #57

You cannot take land like that through warfare anymore. bravenak Jul 2014 #55

Unless you are Russia and want the Crimea? EX500rider Jul 2014 #59

Yes, I see that's working out splendidly. bravenak Jul 2014 #62

And pointing this out Aerows Jul 2014 #92

It's getting so crazy. bravenak Jul 2014 #94

Russia isn't a democracy Hippo_Tron Jul 2014 #109

Nope, World War II changed that Hippo_Tron Jul 2014 #71

China, the USA, Russia. Calista241 Jul 2014 #86

We've left Iraq and we're leaving Afghanistan (not that those were shining examples of morality) Hippo_Tron Jul 2014 #110

Not since WWII. Spider Jerusalem Jul 2014 #111

Big problem RedFury Jul 2014 #108

Sharon forced settlers out of Gaza, he may well have done the same in the West Bank Hippo_Tron Jul 2014 #112

Texas! grahamhgreen Jul 2014 #100

If Americans Knew web site is an excellent resource Larkspur Jul 2014 #2

Absolutely. Used as a source on such wonderful websites as this one: HERVEPA Jul 2014 #10

Do we really have to repeat this whole charade? stranger81 Jul 2014 #17

Does that make it any less true? atreides1 Jul 2014 #21

Great site... Rhinodawg Jul 2014 #28

So you want to play the smear game? Can you refute any of the maps? Or anything said by me or Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #31

Poster is pointing out leftynyc Jul 2014 #32

Lot of gems on this site too, some are good some are bad, I get the point, it means nothing, and Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #33

Did you know they leftynyc Jul 2014 #40

That's not a secret to anyone. Rhinodawg Jul 2014 #41

You'e just shooting the messenger. The fact remains is that maps speak snagglepuss Jul 2014 #48

I'm still waiting for an answer leftynyc Jul 2014 #54

If you have information that the maps are snagglepuss Jul 2014 #58

Regarding the maps oberliner Jul 2014 #85

The UN maps are propaganda, you don't say? No source will please you or disturb your set in concrete Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #88

I guess next I can expect leftynyc Jul 2014 #98

Fellow apologists, huh ? Rhinodawg Jul 2014 #36

"Too evil or too stupid.....", I could not have said it better myself. Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #69

that second map has been debunked hundreds of times Mosby Jul 2014 #72

The ADL, being a propaganda site, attacks another accused propaganda site, the circle is closed. Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #89

The ADL has been fighting bigotry for 101 years. Mosby Jul 2014 #95

Typical guilt by association smear used by the "Israel can do no wrong" mob Larkspur Jul 2014 #35

Why do you go to that despicable hate site? I would not click on it if you paid me. Shameful to sabrina 1 Jul 2014 #39

Take it easy... Rhinodawg Jul 2014 #47

Linking to stormfront.org? Seriously? ColesCountyDem Jul 2014 #82

Be my guest, if making stuff up does that to you. Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #90

So, you're saying that stormfront.org is NOT a neo-Nazi, 'white power' website? ColesCountyDem Jul 2014 #91

That's a new low Aerows Jul 2014 #93

Are you serious? Have you even read their homepage? ColesCountyDem Jul 2014 #97

And yet all we hear is rhetoric about how the very existence of Israel is threatened Maedhros Jul 2014 #5

Palestine is being driven into the sea, maps don't lie. Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #8

But AIPAC does. [n/t] Maedhros Jul 2014 #19

And it is that simple malaise Jul 2014 #22

Pardon my ignorance, sadoldgirl Jul 2014 #20

If you mean the loss of land map, that was the 1947 UN plan borders, Israel was borne........it Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #25

agreed La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2014 #34

after the holocaust i can understand why they would have preferred to go some other place JI7 Jul 2014 #52

in terms of race, europeans committed the genocide of the jewish people La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2014 #24

They never knew what hit them, until the missiles and bombs hit them and drove them away. Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #26

Checkpoint - Israel Defence Forces Documentary RandiFan1290 Jul 2014 #29

Hi Fred, this website is tainted goods. There are so many legitimate ones. Let me put it this way, Jefferson23 Jul 2014 #37

OK, understood, but the facts related seem to be accurate, it is an account worth telling, based on Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #64

Fred...ifamricansknew is a hate site. Rhinodawg Jul 2014 #67

I would delete the thread, that is how off base Alison Weir is to me..she carries ugly intent. Jefferson23 Jul 2014 #73

My knowledge of her is only the article I linked to....I stand by the article. It was a top Google Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #75

Ok, that is your call. n/t Jefferson23 Jul 2014 #77

OK, thanks. I really do get where you are coming from, but I do not have the patience to go down Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #79

I understand that, and why I posted about the website..we really do not want to lend Jefferson23 Jul 2014 #81

Also found this piece on her, since you piqued my curiosity, any insight? Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #80

I have no explanation why he endorsed it but keep in mind, he is not an academic Jefferson23 Jul 2014 #83

I just went back to the white/ green/ gray map, and sadoldgirl Jul 2014 #38

Don't forget what started this round of violence. The world had the audacity to recognize the palest AtheistCrusader Jul 2014 #43

Thanks for this information KansDem Jul 2014 #45

k and r snagglepuss Jul 2014 #50

We need to immediately terminate all military assistance to Israel including the "shields".... Swede Atlanta Jul 2014 #56

Great map, Fred. I knew they were losing land, but not on that scale. toby jo Jul 2014 #60

The Chosen People wanted that land real bad, it is religion that dictated this madness, as usual. Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #65

I don't mean to sound like an a$$hole....but why should we care? cbdo2007 Jul 2014 #61

Genocide? ProgressiveJarhead Jul 2014 #63

Let's argue semantics all day everyday while the land theft and murder of civilians continues. bravenak Jul 2014 #68

Anyone studying these maps and still not getting the consequence of forced seizure of land and holy Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #74

Infuriating. bravenak Jul 2014 #76

Wheweeeee! I'll never forget what one certain... ReRe Jul 2014 #66

Lets just clear something up... Hippo_Tron Jul 2014 #70

Cause and effect. The effect of the UN mandate was or caused war, I understand that. Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #78

No, Egypt, Jordan, and Syria caused war Hippo_Tron Jul 2014 #113

The missing maps and the missing facts RRumpole Jul 2014 #84

Honoured to be the recipient of your very first post, which, unfortunately, is nothing more than Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #87

Wow, how rude and how wrong. elias7 Jul 2014 #99

Skewed and incomplete facts econoclast Jul 2014 #101

All your points ignore Israel was a country dropped into the middle of another country/land Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #102

No "other country" econoclast Jul 2014 #103

And so all the layers come off the onion and the real objection comes into the light TheKentuckian Jul 2014 #104

The "anti-Semite response" ones are excruciatingly boring, yet all too common. Fred Sanders Jul 2014 #105

And sadly all too accurate it would seem econoclast Jul 2014 #106

I'd find it "boring" if I didn't have an acceptable response too, I reckon. TheKentuckian Jul 2014 #107

Your earlier "chosen people" snark kinda gives you away. onenote Jul 2014 #116