General Discussion

Chathamization

(1,638 posts)

148. The party consists of party members (us); the state of the party is the result of our actions.

Tue Aug 12, 2014, 09:34 AM

Aug 2014

We can complain about how bad people are running things, but the they are doing so because most people let them. The majority of people don’t pay attention to candidates, don’t vote in primaries, don’t bother voting for state committee representatives (or have no idea who they’re voting for if they do). I don’t see how the Greens solve these issues, which seem to be the root of the problem.

That’s not to say that there isn’t any use for third party candidates. Bernie Sanders does a good job; if I campaign for anyone this fall, it will be an independent (usually this happens when there’s not a traditional DvR race). But even then, I think a candidate would be better off running as an independent than a Green, since Greens have developed a reputation for not really running to win.

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Had An Interesting Conversation Late Last Night ... About The Democratic Party... [View all] WillyT Aug 2014 OP

Sounds like a fascinating conversation. zappaman Aug 2014 #1

Fascinating enough for you to take the trouble to join in, even to go find a video. I hate searching sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #16

Yes, it took me all of 5 seconds to find. zappaman Aug 2014 #22

It's an interesting thread, isn't it? I mean you're here. I never go into threads I don't find sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #25

As I said zappaman Aug 2014 #29

So, instead of condescension, why don't you name those reasons? Octafish Aug 2014 #45

Did you know...? zappaman Aug 2014 #67

So, you don't have reasons to support cutting down the OP. Octafish Aug 2014 #84

Why wouldn't sabrina 1 understand? Does she not have the mental aqcuity to ChisolmTrailDem Aug 2014 #51

I agree with most of her posts--probably all, really. I am just usually cautious about merrily Aug 2014 #152

Thank you. I used to spend a lot more time constructing posts here. But now not so much, sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #225

You're welcome, Sabrina1. DU can be an odd place, sometimes. nt merrily Aug 2014 #226

self-awareness can be extremely difficult Bobbie Jo Aug 2014 #175

Ok I admit it ...I have been a zombie Dem voter. Doesn't seem to help much. L0oniX Aug 2014 #223

Why does it sound like a "fascinating conversation"? Please, spell it out for ChisolmTrailDem Aug 2014 #53

Read the OP zappaman Aug 2014 #63

Why is it "fascinating". Try answering the question rather than being condenscending. nt ChisolmTrailDem Aug 2014 #65

Read the OP zappaman Aug 2014 #66

I read the OP. It's not "extremely fascinating" at all. It's an anecdote about ChisolmTrailDem Aug 2014 #68

"Extremely interesting" zappaman Aug 2014 #90

So, you're not going to explain why you think it is "Extremely interesting", or ChisolmTrailDem Aug 2014 #95

�. MrMickeysMom Aug 2014 #123

People post to discussion forums like it's twitter these days Blue_Adept Aug 2014 #145

Or, they think they may get a hide if they flat out say what they mean. merrily Aug 2014 #174

That too Blue_Adept Aug 2014 #177

I could be way off base, of course, but I have been reading the comments about the merrily Aug 2014 #182

I couldn't agree more! Stellar Aug 2014 #72

Did he happen to mention any Greens he's voted for getting elected? Loudly Aug 2014 #2

Boy do you miss the point. It's about principles, not getting elected. rhett o rick Aug 2014 #5

It's good to have principles, but sometimes when you vote them you get TexasProgresive Aug 2014 #39

But my principles remained unsullied. Ikonoklast Aug 2014 #47

I am glad your conscience is clear. Rationalization does wonders. nm rhett o rick Aug 2014 #71

Interesting that you blame the "dead people" on those that voted their principles. rhett o rick Aug 2014 #52

And when you keep voting against your principles, what do you get? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #54

Blind allegiance to an ideology is demonic. vlyons Aug 2014 #56

But if you win you don't get to covet the struggle LordGlenconner Aug 2014 #70

What struggle? Is getting to the polls really that hard? merrily Aug 2014 #168

That is probably the norm here LordGlenconner Aug 2014 #183

Bush getting into office is the fault of the people that voted for Bush. Sirveri Aug 2014 #102

Gore was not the best candidate, either and Brazile and his other campaign advisors were merrily Aug 2014 #171

Yes! 840high Aug 2014 #61

Principles don't put food on the table ... frazzled Aug 2014 #121

I think you are all confused. My principles are Democratic principles that provide health care toall rhett o rick Aug 2014 #125

I think you are even more confused frazzled Aug 2014 #141

God forbid you disrupt the big "they're all the same" rally going on here with facts, LOL. bettyellen Aug 2014 #151

I guess I haven't gotten to all the posts that say Democrats are the same as Republicans yet. merrily Aug 2014 #179

Damn... You Are Correct... Principles DO NOT Make The Trains Run On Time !!! WillyT Aug 2014 #128

. rhett o rick Aug 2014 #144

No wonder your thinking is so confused and warped frazzled Aug 2014 #162

when fixing infrastructure is likened to Nazi Germany instead of recognized as sorely needed... bettyellen Aug 2014 #170

Seriously? An OP about a drunk neighbor's rant is followed up with a reference to Nazi Germany? bettyellen Aug 2014 #167

good post treestar Aug 2014 #160

People who vote to the left of Dems (or to the right of Republicans) have nothing to lose? merrily Aug 2014 #176

Nevermind the Democratic Party Platform resembles the Green Party... joshcryer Aug 2014 #228

They will, if more and more and more join this guy. Because he sure isn't alone in his sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #17

It's also why I'm an idependant. n/t deafskeptic Aug 2014 #32

Independents are the largest growing voting bloc. A lot of people are thinking about it. The Dems sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #109

Amen! I became an independant when Bill Clinton went pro-business. I regret my support for NAFTA. deafskeptic Aug 2014 #139

He was progressive, as some use that word. But he wasn't liberal. merrily Aug 2014 #181

No offense, but have you read the Terms of Service of this board? merrily Aug 2014 #178

What do you mean? I don't recall endorsing any party or candidates in this thread. deafskeptic Aug 2014 #184

I didn't say you had violated the TOS. I just wanted to be sure you merrily Aug 2014 #186

Ah. I see. A lot do seem to be centrists here. deafskeptic Aug 2014 #187

I feel your pain. merrily Aug 2014 #188

All the Democrats I have voted for did not get elected either. merrily Aug 2014 #163

Hard to argue with someone who's heartbroken. Ken Burch Aug 2014 #3

Yep... And So Many Here, Have The Notion, That We Have Not Other Choice... WillyT Aug 2014 #4

But this time is different. This time we are only killing the bad guys. nm rhett o rick Aug 2014 #6

Gee, I thought we always kill only the bad guys. merrily Aug 2014 #164

It's hard to admit you've been played, over and over again, by the Party that claims Maedhros Aug 2014 #7

It is hard, but it can be done and is done, daily, merrily Aug 2014 #166

Yup. Either that, or the paycheck doesn't come. woo me with science Aug 2014 #231

The tears may be a sign that he knows that his vote for another Party is not making anymore jwirr Aug 2014 #8

Or... He's Just Given Up... And Moved On... WillyT Aug 2014 #9

The "Given Up Party" RobertEarl Aug 2014 #23

Dan Burton is the Indiana Republican member of Congress. He probably meant John, alp227 Aug 2014 #10

Sorry... John Burton... WillyT Aug 2014 #12

Haha. Remember "Watermelon Dan"? alp227 Aug 2014 #14

Current chair and he's given up? panader0 Aug 2014 #48

Idealogically, I identify more with LuvNewcastle Aug 2014 #11

Yep and that's how Republicans get elected sunnystarr Aug 2014 #13

That's not going to work anymore. When you elect a Democrat to the WH and that Democrat sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #18

So Obama= Mc Cain. You really can't find any difference? Interesting. bettyellen Aug 2014 #78

Here, let me try to make it simpler for you. The reason being given to vote for Democrats rather sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #108

so, you are unable to imagine how a Mc Cain presidency would be much worse for the USA? bettyellen Aug 2014 #110

See post #108. Read it and your answer is there. sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #111

Maybe read my question again? You did imply electingr Obama ended up no better than electing Mc Cain bettyellen Aug 2014 #112

'So', you support Republicans in power? That's what you implied isn't it? sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #114

Well, I pretty much expected you to walk back from that statement, and you did. Thanks! bettyellen Aug 2014 #115

Why did you dismiss putting Republicans back in power as something that should NOT overly concern sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #116

I took issue only with this Obama= Mc Cain bullshit. That was all I asked about - the "no bettyellen Aug 2014 #117

No, that's not all you said. Please link to where I said anything about McCain. Stop lying about me sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #118

You are talked about voting for Obama versus which mystery Republican when you said this: bettyellen Aug 2014 #119

You must like zappaman Aug 2014 #122

just a little bored with folks who use stories of "other people" disgusted with the Dem party.... bettyellen Aug 2014 #124

Would you care to explain that comment? I don't like people lying about me and will not allow sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #134

I wasn't talking to you. zappaman Aug 2014 #136

No, you were using the now familiar 'third party' tactic of talking ABOUT someone rather than speak sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #137

uh huh. zappaman Aug 2014 #169

No, you were using the now familiar 'third party' tactic of talking ABOUT someone rather than speak sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #137

All this whining about wanting to be honeslty represented Sheepshank Aug 2014 #197

you "proved" nothing, in fact you never once answered the question posed to you. bettyellen Aug 2014 #165

When you make stuff up about people's words and cannot provide proof of what you made up sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #192

Look- I merely quoted you. And asked you to clarify. bettyellen Aug 2014 #202

You did not quote me in your initial response to me, you attempted to put words in my mouth. sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #205

in case anyone is confused, the quote: bettyellen Aug 2014 #207

That is NOT what you started this with, and you know it. You have failed to post a quote from me sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #208

I quoted you saying "what's the difference". And this is a bald faced lie "The poster above also bettyellen Aug 2014 #209

??? 'What's the difference between voting for Republicans and/or having them RETURNED TO POWER sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #210

Then which Republican were you talking about voting for? I'd think Mc Cain/ Palin would be top of bettyellen Aug 2014 #211

So you don't have a link to back up your false statement? Thank you, that's all I wanted. An sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #133

What you actually said was quoted a few times- if you didn't mean Mc Cain,you had ample opportunity bettyellen Aug 2014 #149

I see you are changing it now to 'I was reading your mind' sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #194

Quoting you is not reading your mind, lol.... bettyellen Aug 2014 #201

"I look forward to your link showing me comparing Obama to McCain."... MrMickeysMom Aug 2014 #127

I quoted her and asked for clarification- which republican nominee was she speaking of... bettyellen Aug 2014 #172

No you didn't do that ... MrMickeysMom Aug 2014 #203

the quote: bettyellen Aug 2014 #206

That was NOT what I asked you for. I asked you to provide PROOF of the words YOU attributed to ME sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #212

Where did I say it was "No big deal" That is a lie. bettyellen Aug 2014 #213

That quote has nothing to do with what you made up and tried to attribute to ME. sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #215

LOL. Now Bernie is the Repbulican you say we might as well voted for, HILARIOUS. bettyellen Aug 2014 #216

Link to that please, 'the Republican you say'. For those reading, the person I was referring to sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #217

You've made my point of my post to you all over again� Thanks... MrMickeysMom Aug 2014 #220

She can't because it isn't there. The conversation, so YOU understand was about Bernie Sanders. sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #214

"more Republicans in his cabinet, what exactly would the difference be if you had actually voted for bettyellen Aug 2014 #219

Here, let's try this again. Since clearly you do not wish to go back and read the thread, let's try sabrina 1 Aug 2014 #222

That's right, sabrina� sorry I didn't track it all the way back... MrMickeysMom Aug 2014 #221

Re-igniting a war isn't "small stuff." LuvNewcastle Aug 2014 #21

You can't just demand that voters vote DEM no matter what. Ken Burch Aug 2014 #34

Maybe, but they can't expect any progress treestar Aug 2014 #161

It's not about expecting a party to "cater" to anyone. Ken Burch Aug 2014 #227

I don't see how any one member of a party can expect it to do anything in particular treestar Aug 2014 #229

It's not just "any one member"...especially if you're seeing it all over DU. Ken Burch Aug 2014 #230

No, THAT'S how Republicans get elected-- on the DEM ticket. Marr Aug 2014 #38

You proved my point right on cue lol sunnystarr Aug 2014 #49

But what happens when your party is overrun by corporate backed rightwingers? Generic Other Aug 2014 #69

Then support those people sunnystarr Aug 2014 #73

The people who support these policies are not encouraged Generic Other Aug 2014 #76

I hope it's not offensive to say I find your post offensive. (nt) sunnystarr Aug 2014 #77

21,900 posts Generic Other Aug 2014 #81

Actually I was a big fan of V for Vendetta sunnystarr Aug 2014 #82

The Democratic party pretty much ignored the Occupiers Generic Other Aug 2014 #89

So now getting masks for my grandchildren sunnystarr Aug 2014 #97

Occupy movement was treated as terrorists by Obama admin who spied on and targeted Generic Other Aug 2014 #101

I get it. merrily Aug 2014 #185

What have I said that is alertworthy? Generic Other Aug 2014 #190

Please see Reply 86. merrily Aug 2014 #191

Sorry not meant to imply Generic Other Aug 2014 #193

At this stage, you can say you won't for HC. merrily Aug 2014 #195

DNC doesn't want to represent millions of us, we are politically inconvenient. whereisjustice Aug 2014 #15

Looks like you have figured it out. zeemike Aug 2014 #24

2 here whogave up on the DEMS. Unprincipled hacks who pay faint lip service to the Party Plank, then blkmusclmachine Aug 2014 #19

What are you doing on DEMOCRATICunderground then?? sunnystarr Aug 2014 #50

Or maybe the party should stop being the GOP of the 80s and get back to something cui bono Aug 2014 #104

Same reason Catholics use birth control. Orsino Aug 2014 #143

+100 Funny, truthful and a crying shame...all at one time n/t Sheepshank Aug 2014 #198

I'm a Democrat who has no trouble voting Green when the (D) candidate strary too far right. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #20

thomas jefferson and sally hemmings jonjensen Aug 2014 #27

Which has what to do with the quote? Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #30

It's de rigeur these days to denigrate Jefferson Maedhros Aug 2014 #85

clinton not warren jonjensen Aug 2014 #26

Well, she won't get my vote. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #31

Thanks for such a GREAT historical example. Pholus Aug 2014 #57

Your ideas are...uninteresting. [n/t] Maedhros Aug 2014 #86

hitler was never elected to anything. KG Aug 2014 #224

Did you tell him Karl Rove thanks him? aikoaiko Aug 2014 #28

If you want people to believe that, you to work to make sure that Dem presidents don't do GOP things Ken Burch Aug 2014 #33

Not really. If you help another republican get back into office... aikoaiko Aug 2014 #40

he had tears streaming down his face ? JI7 Aug 2014 #35

So did I. zappaman Aug 2014 #36

LOL bettyellen Aug 2014 #79

overdone part of the story treestar Aug 2014 #155

did seem a little over done...right? Sheepshank Aug 2014 #199

Yes, that certainly is interesting. Jeff Rosenzweig Aug 2014 #37

I wish everyone would refuse to vote Dem if the Dem candidate is crap. Vattel Aug 2014 #41

Most sensible response on the thread. nt woo me with science Aug 2014 #44

That's it, right there. The only thing that will work. Autumn Aug 2014 #55

+1 840high Aug 2014 #62

INDEED! Maedhros Aug 2014 #87

Exactly. 99Forever Aug 2014 #146

In North Carolina, he could be a Green Party member mmonk Aug 2014 #42

Cool story bro. eom MohRokTah Aug 2014 #43

20 years is a big chunk of life. Octafish Aug 2014 #46

Ya Know It's Funny Oct... He Was Obviously Drunk... And Visibly Upset... WillyT Aug 2014 #113

Well,this is a clever way to get around the "no advocating for a sufrommich Aug 2014 #58

This. Bobbie Jo Aug 2014 #59

Ain't it though? zappaman Aug 2014 #64

Indeed Indeed ... this has me LIVID! (nt) sunnystarr Aug 2014 #74

but would hosts actually lock something advocating voting third party these days? musing @ slavery bettyellen Aug 2014 #80

Well.... zappaman Aug 2014 #94

It's interesting how frequently people start anti- Dem or liberal OPs expressing other's ideas..... bettyellen Aug 2014 #98

It's fascinating, ain't it? n/t zappaman Aug 2014 #99

it's interesting to see who gives them the "benefit of the doubt" because we should coddle the RW bettyellen Aug 2014 #100

If you listened to the statement and description of the neighbor described in the OP... MrMickeysMom Aug 2014 #129

The OP is more about what's happened to the Democratic Party. Octafish Aug 2014 #83

Exactly. n/t cui bono Aug 2014 #105

^^THIS^^ [n/t] stranger81 Aug 2014 #106

Exactly. People wouldnt be looking for alternatives if the Dem party maintained a real platform Katashi_itto Aug 2014 #142

+1000000000 woo me with science Aug 2014 #173

+1 uponit7771 Aug 2014 #92

I;m very close 840high Aug 2014 #60

Never give up sunnystarr Aug 2014 #75

Don't see much to fight for - they 840high Aug 2014 #107

I hope he learns that since Green isn't registered in 50 states, he'll just be wasting his vote. ancianita Aug 2014 #88

Shhhhh! zappaman Aug 2014 #91

We should want all Green voters' votes! Even crybabies! ancianita Aug 2014 #96

We failed him treestar Aug 2014 #158

You have made a head-scratching and nonsensical OP an absolutely hilarious thread Number23 Aug 2014 #204

The party left him - and a lot of us too. It's sad alright. polichick Aug 2014 #93

What were you smoking? GeorgeGist Aug 2014 #103

Really, tears? frazzled Aug 2014 #120

Oh Yeah... He Was Pretty Drunk... And Melancholy... His Eyes Were Already Swollen... WillyT Aug 2014 #126

Well ... frazzled Aug 2014 #150

And Thanks For Assigning Motives... It's Funny Who One meets In A Company Town... WillyT Aug 2014 #157

This reminds me of 1968 locks Aug 2014 #130

Absolutely right, locks... MrMickeysMom Aug 2014 #132

So your thinking led to ... frazzled Aug 2014 #154

This reminds me of the character in Primary Colors, WillyT... MrMickeysMom Aug 2014 #131

Yeah... It Was A Snippet Post... That Apparently Exposed The Soft Belly Of The Democratic Party... WillyT Aug 2014 #135

sold their souls to wall street. campaign $$$. pansypoo53219 Aug 2014 #140

"Not in my name" is as valid a sentiment as "I have chosen to stay and fight." Orsino Aug 2014 #147

I like this. merrily Aug 2014 #189

The party consists of party members (us); the state of the party is the result of our actions. Chathamization Aug 2014 #148

No surprise there treestar Aug 2014 #153

I'm a registered Green who votes the Democratic ticket. antiquie Aug 2014 #156

your neighbor is not alone RedstDem Aug 2014 #159

So did I. NCTraveler Aug 2014 #180

A fable: Lydia Leftcoast Aug 2014 #196

Exactly Right... Thank You For That... WillyT Aug 2014 #200

Should be an OP. Octafish Aug 2014 #218