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jeff47

(26,549 posts)
39. Yes. The problem is you are building a mental framework that is outside your experiences.
Tue Aug 12, 2014, 02:01 PM
Aug 2014
But I do have relatives and friends who have suffered from severe depression and suicidal thoughts... and more than one is no longer with us because of it. In far too many cases, they thought that this solves their problem and those of the people who suffer because of them.

Utterly wrong. They thought it stopped their pain. It's not a solution, it's a way for the hurt to stop.

And they are not so stupid that suicide does not occur to them unless they see a picture like the OP. I can assure you that people with clinical depression are extremely aware that suicide is an option. Long before you were aware that they were depressed.

They often think that they're being self-sacrificial easing the troubled of those they love... that the world is better off without them.

No, there isn't anything positive involved, such as self-sacrifice.

You're coming to this situation as someone who is not depressessed, attempting to create a mental framework from your guesses and what you think people with depression are feeling.

The problem is your model is very wrong. It has massive holes where you completely miss major factors in depression, such as extreme self-loathing. Or the utterly artificial construct of a person that they show to everyone.

You are then taking your model and attempting to say "if I felt like this, how would I react to that picture?". Adding another level of indirection and error on top of what is already there. And then you assert that these problems would not occur without something like that picture.

What you're doing is similar to a man saying "feminists think this". Or a suburban white person saying "inner-city blacks think this". You can't successfully build a mental framework that simulates what they are experiencing, because their reality is radically different from your experiences.

Someone with depression looks at that picture, and sees that the people have worth. They have skills. They also are loved and valued. And the hug would be utterly wonderful because it is gushing with worth, acceptance and unconditional love. It's "I'll be there with you, even when we are walking through the depths of hell." It's a hug of two people's genuine personalities.

That picture is what every depressed person desperately wants, and thinks they can not get.

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another movie I loved.......he was just exceptional in this. a kennedy Aug 2014 #1
Genius malaise Aug 2014 #2
That's nice at first, but I don't think I like it. FBaggins Aug 2014 #3
I've suffered from depression and been suicidal Shivering Jemmy Aug 2014 #5
I don't have personal experience with depression but perhaps for those Hosnon Aug 2014 #8
And that was my point FBaggins Aug 2014 #12
And that wasn't my point. Hosnon Aug 2014 #13
To a depressed & suicidal person "end suffering" and "solution" are often the same thing. n/t FBaggins Aug 2014 #14
Look, I didn't claim to have personal knowledge of depression. But the sentiment makes sense to me. Hosnon Aug 2014 #15
you are spot on, Hosnon Skittles Aug 2014 #41
You are being obtuse HangOnKids Aug 2014 #19
Why are you trolling this thread, just to wave your finger at people ? NM_Birder Aug 2014 #30
With 4 hides in 90 days I would think you might want to stop being the board nanny HangOnKids Aug 2014 #46
Good catch fascisthunter Aug 2014 #51
I'm flattered you are so interested in me, NM_Birder Aug 2014 #55
HOLY MARSH MELLOWS BATMAN ! NM_Birder Aug 2014 #57
I understand what you mean, NM_Birder Aug 2014 #17
That would be alluding not eluding HangOnKids Aug 2014 #20
The irony in your post just made my day, thanks ! NM_Birder Aug 2014 #23
Sorry no you're in my post HangOnKids Aug 2014 #24
lol ... that was terribly written. NM_Birder Aug 2014 #29
Allude means to hint at, suggest HangOnKids Aug 2014 #45
LOL, you're spelling lesson is doing the trick, NM_Birder Aug 2014 #56
Please keep going Birder HangOnKids Aug 2014 #25
I'm not a religious man, NM_Birder Aug 2014 #33
People suffering from depression are not morons. jeff47 Aug 2014 #28
It isn't an issue of intelligence FBaggins Aug 2014 #34
Then don't treat them like morons. jeff47 Aug 2014 #36
Did you even read what you replied to? FBaggins Aug 2014 #37
Yes. The problem is you are building a mental framework that is outside your experiences. jeff47 Aug 2014 #39
And what you're doing is trying to speak for every person who ever suffered from depression. MADem Aug 2014 #53
So got hidden when you were being stupid in another thread jeff47 Aug 2014 #58
Suicide contagion and social media: The dangers of sharing ‘Genie, you’re free’ Hissyspit Aug 2014 #49
Good article. MADem Aug 2014 #54
FBaggins isn't the only one who thinks depressed people are morons. jeff47 Aug 2014 #59
I think we'll take the meical professionals word over your own. FBaggins Aug 2014 #61
The medical professionals are talking about a different swath of people jeff47 Aug 2014 #62
As if that makes your claims any more valid. FBaggins Aug 2014 #63
No, what I'm trying to get you to do is understand what depression really is jeff47 Aug 2014 #64
You mean "certain kinds of depression"... right? FBaggins Aug 2014 #65
No, I'm talking about the medical condition. jeff47 Aug 2014 #66
I Suffer from Clinical Depression fascisthunter Aug 2014 #50
Do you also suffer from dysgraphia? FBaggins Aug 2014 #60
I've never been sadder over a celebrity's death. tblue Aug 2014 #4
Me too. nt snappyturtle Aug 2014 #6
Yes I am sad about this. Also was sad about Phillip Seymour Hoffman. DanTex Aug 2014 #21
This hit me really hard too and I don't even know why. I didn't particularly like his manic style, catbyte Aug 2014 #7
I agree with too much... daleanime Aug 2014 #11
"I wish this country had more compassion, period." woo me with science Aug 2014 #16
same here Enrique Aug 2014 #26
The 10 year old boy in me is absolutely devastated. Hosnon Aug 2014 #9
... Jefferson23 Aug 2014 #10
Mork has returned to Ork! polmaven Aug 2014 #18
That flat made me cry libodem Aug 2014 #22
Wonderful pic. hifiguy Aug 2014 #27
that's very powerful and brings tears to my eyes samsingh Aug 2014 #31
Damn. Ya got me. JNelson6563 Aug 2014 #32
One of the best tributes to Robin Williams so far. n/t ChazII Aug 2014 #35
That one hits home LittleBlue Aug 2014 #38
I decided to see what the Dark Side was saying.... Spitfire of ATJ Aug 2014 #40
You bet, Spitfire Iwillnevergiveup Aug 2014 #42
Especially with their heads up their asses. Spitfire of ATJ Aug 2014 #47
Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe Aug 2014 #43
k and r, with tears. niyad Aug 2014 #44
. Fearless Aug 2014 #48
Free of the crushing debt and bills he couldn't pay, at any rate. MADem Aug 2014 #52
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