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sendero

(28,552 posts)

135. I have "hated" the libertarian philosophy for 15 years..

Reply to woo me with science (Reply #63)

Sun Aug 24, 2014, 06:47 PM

Aug 2014

.... but I'm getting to the point to where I'm not so sure the "bad" (economic policy) really outweighs the "good" (anti war, no foreign entanglements, no pointless laws against victimless crimes, etc). The Democrats have managed to make their economic policy so close to the libertarians (free trade agreements, deregulate everything, never saw a bankster initiative they didn't like) that what do we get for our vote? Not bloody much I will tell you that.

I just don't know if I can vote for HRC, a Democrat in name only, regardless of who she's running against. My memories of her past and maybe unfairly what Bill did to the country (free trade with China with no quid pro quo, NAFTA, the repeal of Glass-Stegall (an action right on par with the second Iraq war in its cost to Americans), the Commodity Futures Modernization Act, the end of "welfare as we know it" (if this is a friend to Dems who needs enemies?).

Even though it might not be fair to blame her for Bill's errors, she seems to the right of him so how could she be any better?

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Regardless of your opinion of HRC, anyone here actually want to see Rand Paul win in a head to head? [View all] wyldwolf Aug 2014 OP

This should be interesting, waiting to see the posts. Thinkingabout Aug 2014 #1

The Straight Question, Sir, Is Unlikely To Get A Straight Answer.... The Magistrate Aug 2014 #2

That's a strange comment. I'll give you a straight answer: NO! BillZBubb Aug 2014 #21

Such laziness in your callout! leftstreet Aug 2014 #3

Who in that thread thinks that Rand Paul would be better for this country? Link to the post please. Autumn Aug 2014 #4

I don't want to see either of them win. Which is why I won't vote for either of them. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #5

Hello Independent....thanks for identifying yourself..... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #13

I'm a Democrat who regards my vote as my own...not Hillary's or the Party's. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #19

The only voice we have is our vote, and our voices are being ignored. Autumn Aug 2014 #44

Our voices are ignored only before the election. After, it's blame-the-left if it's lost. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #64

We need to help extremist Republicans win emulatorloo Aug 2014 #69

If you're convinced of that, then you should vote Republican. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #71

No I will never vote Republican. emulatorloo Aug 2014 #82

Well, we have something in common. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #84

I hope someone will challenge and defeat HRC in the Primary emulatorloo Aug 2014 #86

I can only say that is an ignorant reply. Our job as Democrats is to keep the Autumn Aug 2014 #78

I don't believe Paul can stand up to intense national scrutiny emulatorloo Aug 2014 #90

Our party leaders sit in their little mansions and send we, the Democratic base out to battle. Autumn Aug 2014 #96

Just look at how well Paul handled the civil rights act issue Gothmog Aug 2014 #100

Funny how that works isn't it? But hey GOTV Autumn Aug 2014 #72

They have to have a convenient scapegoat when they fail to convince voters to vote for them. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #77

This place just gets all "mavericky" sometimes. Autumn Aug 2014 #89

You can say that again. Puglover Aug 2014 #141

A whole lot of little mavericks . Except for at home, Autumn Aug 2014 #154

Yes, and we can send a message by helping elect Paul Ryan emulatorloo Aug 2014 #66

The centrists hijack the party and then say you're not welcome here. Broward Aug 2014 #85

PLUS ONE, a whole bunch! Enthusiast Aug 2014 #151

I've known that for a LONG time. BlueCaliDem Aug 2014 #101

"I won't vote for either one" = "I'm voting for Paul." 6000eliot Aug 2014 #104

No it doesn't. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2014 #108

don't forget her wall street ties and trade deals. nt magical thyme Aug 2014 #124

Hell no. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2014 #6

Shhh. Savannahmann Aug 2014 #9

First, thanks for the link to my post. I'd link back but I doubt anyone would see it. Savannahmann Aug 2014 #7

Those who will vote for rand are single issue voters. They will tell you they are not... Tikki Aug 2014 #8

Young people vote for Rand Paul because they think he will legalize pot... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #16

Oh, Rand has a huge fanclub on DU Blue_Tires Aug 2014 #10

I agree Andy823 Aug 2014 #111

No. JaydenD Aug 2014 #11

there are members of DU that admit to that? VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #12

No, I didn't see any of that in that thread. JaydenD Aug 2014 #20

that is the stupidest thing I have heard on the Internet so far today! VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #23

there is time for much more stupidty... I won't comment further on that but JaydenD Aug 2014 #24

ain't nobody got time for that much stupidity.... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #30

I see you neglected taking advice from yesterday on Debating Skills 101 JaydenD Aug 2014 #31

I don't take advice from Rand Paul supporters.... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #32

Then you replied to the wrong post, because I am not a Paul supporter JaydenD Aug 2014 #33

Oh yes you are...IF you support HIM over ANY Democrat.... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #35

+ 1000 BlueCaliDem Aug 2014 #102

Hahahaha! zappaman Aug 2014 #105

OOOOOH the Humanity!!!!! VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #110

I think a lot of folks here (and elsewhere) War Horse Aug 2014 #116

they don't care...they think suddenly the Libertarians like they are welcome in the Democratic Party VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #117

No. TwilightGardener Aug 2014 #14

Of course not, but I'm not voting for the lesser of 2 evils again tularetom Aug 2014 #15

Hello Independent Voter..... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #17

Wrong. The poster said s/he wouldn't vote leftstreet Aug 2014 #18

Yes it is..... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #37

No. That would be a 'non voter' leftstreet Aug 2014 #40

If you support a Republican like Rand Paul over ANY Democrat..... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #45

You are smearing the poster above leftstreet Aug 2014 #48

I don't care....if you spend your time on a Democratic Political Forum and don't vote... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #51

You 'don't care' that you're violating TOS leftstreet Aug 2014 #53

No I am accusing them of violating TOS... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #57

Did you alert on the poster? leftstreet Aug 2014 #59

why am I under obligation to do so? VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #61

Does TOS require voting? leftstreet Aug 2014 #68

It REQUIRES electing more Democrats....so yeah I think so.... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #74

You lied leftstreet Aug 2014 #79

No I haven't called anyone that.....I said IF they claim they would vote for Paul over Hillary VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #80

LOL n/t leftstreet Aug 2014 #81

Oooooh, scary, my posts will be discounted accordingly tularetom Aug 2014 #121

Yeah.....I have no interest in talking to Independent voters.....their opinions mean nuts to me.... VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #125

Ohh come on Alittleliberal Aug 2014 #134

It is? VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #136

We are at a tipping point. More of the same will no longer work. Autumn Aug 2014 #26

Got a candidate that can beat ANY Republican....got polls to prove it? VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #126

We don't have ANY candidate yet, so no need to prove a damn thing to you. Autumn Aug 2014 #128

All I can say is someone...... Puglover Aug 2014 #142

Puglover! How goes it? Autumn Aug 2014 #153

Of course, I do not want to see him win! This is not either/or. CaliforniaPeggy Aug 2014 #22

Would you rather burn in hell for eternity or have a strawberry ice cream cone? JaydenD Aug 2014 #27

I think the Third Way does. woo me with science Aug 2014 #25

I just want to be sure I understand what you're saying here wyldwolf Aug 2014 #28

Yes, can't you understand the obvious? emulatorloo Aug 2014 #36

It is obvious if you just think a moment. woo me with science Aug 2014 #107

hahahahahaha OMG we are infiltrated by some "brightness" today! VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #38

I imagine the Third Way could live fairly happily with either outcome. Jackpine Radical Aug 2014 #70

Hmm leftstreet Aug 2014 #29

Or perhaps some DU'ers are detached from reality, or are conspiracy theorists, or are emulatorloo Aug 2014 #39

It's always the conservative fringe here that accuses others QC Aug 2014 #41

true enough n/t leftstreet Aug 2014 #46

That's a thought. woo me with science Aug 2014 #67

rand Paul would be the third way dream president Doctor_J Aug 2014 #58

Yup. He would run on the "libertarian" promise of scaling back wars and the police state. woo me with science Aug 2014 #63

I have "hated" the libertarian philosophy for 15 years.. sendero Aug 2014 #135

No. Just no. BlueMTexpat Aug 2014 #34

Exactly...IF they cannot commit to voting for ANY Dem over ANY Republican....they are no VanillaRhapsody Aug 2014 #42

In my experience, BlueMTexpat Aug 2014 #138

Amen Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Aug 2014 #43

Not a Hillary fan, and Rand Paul will destroy the US emulatorloo Aug 2014 #47

No. I hope to collect Social Security one day. Dems to Win Aug 2014 #49

Message auto-removed Name removed Aug 2014 #50

FRP. eom uppityperson Aug 2014 #54

Another FRP! greatauntoftriplets Aug 2014 #73

I'm concerned about the effect Clinton would have on the other races aint_no_life_nowhere Aug 2014 #52

I would never vote for Rand Paul Gothmog Aug 2014 #55

Hell no.... daleanime Aug 2014 #56

Of course not, but sadoldgirl Aug 2014 #60

"Who the #%^* else ya gonna vote for, chumps?!" MannyGoldstein Aug 2014 #62

Post removed Post removed Aug 2014 #75

"Romney/Ryan would be a Hell unlike anything we've known in the history of our country." MannyGoldstein Aug 2014 #91

+1 Marr Aug 2014 #95

+1 woo me with science Aug 2014 #99

Eeyup. hifiguy Aug 2014 #118

No, in a game of good cop versus bad cop, I guess I'll have to choose the good cop Douglas Carpenter Aug 2014 #65

I used to think that... woo me with science Aug 2014 #88

Seems like a straw man argument./nt DemocratSinceBirth Aug 2014 #76

As well as a very lame call out. n/t QC Aug 2014 #137

Of course not. LWolf Aug 2014 #83

Their silence on a host of issues tells us all we need to know about them. conservaphobe Aug 2014 #87

+1 XRubicon Aug 2014 #93

Who is "they"? Marr Aug 2014 #94

It's an imaginary "they" used against those who want better than Hillary. Autumn Aug 2014 #97

I'm not a Clinton supporter. I will support whomever has the backing of OFA. conservaphobe Aug 2014 #113

I've noticed that same thing, conservaphobe. BlueCaliDem Aug 2014 #112

Right-wing Democrats are what has ALLOWED the GOP to go so far right. Marr Aug 2014 #92

+1 The goal is the corporatism, money into the pockets of the oligarchs. woo me with science Aug 2014 #98

Exactly. hifiguy Aug 2014 #119

A Democratic president is only as "left" as their Party members in Congress. BlueCaliDem Aug 2014 #109

If the president is so ineffectual, what are you worried about? Marr Aug 2014 #129

Never claimed that the president is "ineffectual". That's all you. BlueCaliDem Aug 2014 #130

Who's ranting? Marr Aug 2014 #131

I want to vote for dem. Repuke extreme and DLC republican lite isn't a dem on point Aug 2014 #103

No tazkcmo Aug 2014 #106

There's a school of thought among the delusional left... SidDithers Aug 2014 #114

This ^ ^ ^ Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Aug 2014 #132

NO. But I have no love for Wall Street lovin' neocon lite Hillary whatsoever. hifiguy Aug 2014 #115

To those who decide they just can't vote for either one, or Hillary isn't perfect or whatever - calimary Aug 2014 #120

running paul against clinton is the easiest way for RedstDem Aug 2014 #122

no samsingh Aug 2014 #123

I would rather see HRC as President than Rand Paul. ZombieHorde Aug 2014 #127

I'd think about it if I believed Rand would be libertarian on crime and national security in office Hippo_Tron Aug 2014 #133

Booga booga! Le Taz Hot Aug 2014 #139

there are 'progressives' here claiming Rand Paul is more 'progressive' than Hillary... wyldwolf Aug 2014 #140

No, a few progressives Le Taz Hot Aug 2014 #143

So, your contention is that no progressives here have said Paul is more progressive than Hillary? wyldwolf Aug 2014 #144

So, you didn't actually read Le Taz Hot Aug 2014 #145

sure, so let's review our conversation wyldwolf Aug 2014 #147

The key word here is Le Taz Hot Aug 2014 #148

the only key word is the one you used - 'no.' wyldwolf Aug 2014 #149

It's not a question of wanting it, but of activists feeling so defeated yurbud Aug 2014 #146

I hope neither of them are the nominees davidpdx Aug 2014 #150

1981 views and 4 recommendations. Enthusiast Aug 2014 #152