If you don't believe in (recognize) white privilege why the fuck are you on a Democratic Forum?

[Rilgin]

301. Something to think about

Well,

I was born in this country. My parents were born in this country but my grandparents were not. They were born in russia/poland and are lucky to be alive. My family have not been in the United States for lots of generations nor were they here during the periods during the "entire history" you probably are using as the basis of a definition of privilege in the United States. In fact, during this period (the last century), over 50% of my extended family was killed in a racial genocide.

My background is not unique. The demographics of this country and immigration and interracial marriage mean that not every white person has any substantial connection to any historical period of American history which had specific racial problems. Even those white people who you could trace back, it was their grandparents and great grandparents not them who were alive during those times.

Continuing my story, growing up I was not told how to behave in front of police. I will give you that. I was messaged other things by my family and by society. I was told that society might change and kill you and to be wary of societal genocide by my older relatives. I was also told how to behave with authorities and I was told by society how to survive safely on the streets of a city by personal experiences with crime. As a racial matter, my father blames the whole German race and hates every german regardless of their age and regardless of how they live their lives. I have relatives that are poor, rich, gay, disabled, dead, suicides, and extremely successful as they have faced life and society. Individuals born into my family bear other scars then police interactions. Do you really want to judge the significance of these scars versus the scars of other races and individuals experiences.

You acknowledge that there are "downtrodden whites" but the acknowledgment seems to only be window dressing. Ultimately, you judge other problems as not important in defining societal privilege by asserting that what matters in defining privilege is that black parents have to tell black youths how not to be killed by police as the single factor that defines whether someone is privileged. As a personal note, I have had a police gun in my face for something somewhat innocent (an innocent trespass). I assume that I could have been shot as well if things had gone sour. Instead I was handcuffed and booked and ultimately released by a judge. I have many arab friends and their police interactions are horrendous. However, I mention these facts and my families history as victims of genocide because black experiences are not totally unique. All of our experiences in life (regardless of race, sexual preference and gender) have differences and similarities. Ignoring the similarities leads to emphasizing the race and de-emphasizing the individual factors that apply to every individual.

In my life I have been fortunate to live mostly in fairly liberal environments -- NYC and San Francisco. Even in these places, I have seen both overt and covert racism. However, it is not reserved to only the "white race". I have encountered public comments about black and brown and gay people in public gatherings from white people (including to my shame some relatives) but I have also heard racist public statements from black people. In New York, some of the worst racism I have witnessed was against Puerto Ricans by black people. In fact, the most recent racist public comment I heard was from a black guy about jews not knowing I was jewish.

What I have taken from these experiences is the opposite of your point and other points mentioned by others in this thread. Every individual has their own strengths, privileges, impediments and blockages in dealing with society. Arguments that only white people can be racist are bull as are arguments that white people are privileged regardless of what their individual factors are. Other things that matter in society are appearance, sexual preference, gender, height, weight, disability, economic class, dress, athleticism, geographic location and countless other factors equally important to determining ones status in society. I am sure there are plenty of other such factors including just luck.

The use of the term white privilege to apply to all white people is an attempt to ignore or lessen the fact that we are all individuals with our own experiences and factors. As an argument, it is used to elevate one form of societal problem and one individual characteristic over every other one as the only one that really matters. I am not even sure what posts trying to get everyone to use the term rather than the term "racism" to define some societal problems are even attempting to accomplish. In this post, it seems to be that if you don't "accept" the term, you are not a democrat or progressive but does not actually seem to define acceptance or define what you are to do with that acceptance.

Personally, I think the word "racism" is a much better term than "white privilege" and would be more effective in building common ground. An assertion of racism or a racist interaction is usually an assertion about a specific event or interaction and how they affected specific individuals. Further, it is a description an event you witnessed or which occurred to you or someone you know. White Privilege as a "term is not used as a term to discuss your own life or even some event that actually occurred, it is an assertion about someone who is not you and is about bad interactions that did not occur and also points fingers only one direction. If you say, "I encountered racism", I can understand that it affected you or described an event that happened that was wrong. Three people walk into a store (2 black and 1 white). One of the black guys is followed by a store clerk as he shops, the other two aren't. In these white privilege posts, this is described as white privilege of the white guy for an event that did not occur. The description ignores the fact that the racial event also did not occur to the one black guy who was also not followed on that day and in that store. It ignores the fact that racial bias does not occur to every black guy walking into every store or manifest in every interaction. The use of the term does not actually identify the real problematic event and interaction which was the store clerk following the one black guy because of inherent racial bias. Instead it is a term that describes an event that did occur. The paradigm example is trying to describe the shooting of a black man by the police as an example of white privilege because some other non-existent person did not get shot.

In addition, every use of the term seems to be tied to a demand for something personal. Acknowledging that racism can and does exist in the world does not seem good enough. It requires some other type of acknowledgment tied to division between people. The use of the word 'privilege" further implies some type of personal responsibility without actually saying it or providing guidance as to exactly what needs to be addressed or done by the "privileged" person. Last, it does not unify. It is not a nuanced term but is one that cements the relationship between black and white in permanent division and turns the word privilege on its head. A white homeless guy is privileged but a black guy in a penthouse apartment is not.

Turning to personal feelings when I read these threads. When I read the term, I know it is directed at me by the poster without the poster knowing anything about me. I know it is not being used by the poster to discuss himself. As noted above, my family history over the last century might not be described as "privileged" unless you consider having half your family killed to be privileged. Further, my ancestors did not have any connection with slavery or jim crow or any other facet of society usually identified as institutional racism. My family would be better described as suffering from institutional racism for much (although not all) of the last century.

Moving to my personal privileges, I do not need to discuss my individual struggles nor do I need to set out my problems that have interfered with my life. They are there and I have had significant struggles in the last 20 years. Rather than having to read on a progressive site that I am somehow part of a privileged class of people by posters that do not know my circumstances and rather than having to encounter multiple threads castigating me because I do not accept a label of "privilege", I would suggest that the truly progressive outlook is not to label others but to discuss yourself. Defining me by problems I do not have rather than my actual individual characteristics is just sloppy and creates divisions within people who should be fighting the same issues. For some reason, I thought finding common ground and our common humanity was the goal of a truly progressive politics.

If you are black and encounter racism (covert or overt), it is a significant problem and should be an issue for all progressives. If you just want to ignore individual factors and tell or imply to white others that their individual problems in life are not important because they have white privilege, it might make you as a poster feel good but I do not consider it progressive. Moreover, not only do I not consider it progressive but I also believe it is not an effective strategy in reducing racial tensions in the world and working us toward a race and gender neutral society where individuals are seen as individuals.

You ended your post in line with the original post by questioning the relation of any one who does not accept the original post to the democrat party. Personally, I thought that the progressive wing of the democrats favored fighting racism but also recognizing our common humanity and the ties that bind us together so we can have a society without any racial, gender, or sexual prejudices from all sides. That is why I am here and why I even responded rather than ignored this thread.