General Discussion

YoungDemCA

(5,714 posts)

182. Ironically, its the anti-vaccination movement that refuses to have a real dialogue

Sun Sep 14, 2014, 10:00 PM

Sep 2014

And talk about the persistent name-calling, smears, and accusations of ulterior motives or being "paid shills for industry" toward their opponents!

I think a lot of people recognize the enormous amount of empirical scientific evidence that vaccination is, on balance, enormously positive for human health (both individually and on the collective level). I also think a lot of these same people would be happy to defend their position calmly and coherently with logic, evidence, facts, and real-life examples.

I don't see the same amount of critical thinking, respect for the scientific method, and objectivity (or at least, attempting to be objective) among the anti-vax crowd; in fact, just the opposite. That's why it's hard for me to respect them, in addition to the fact that their scaremongering tactics have had horrific consequences for a lot of people-people getting sick, and people dying. That's not OK.

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Anti-vax asshat RFK Jr. on Dr. Oz, promoting his anti-vax asshat book... [View all] SidDithers Sep 2014 OP

du rec. xchrom Sep 2014 #1

Daughter of PBS journalist Robert MacNeil and mother of a child with autism (can't shut her up/down) proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #69

I would self-delete.... Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2014 #82

do you know if this is accurate? Voice for Peace Sep 2014 #90

That is not accurate. Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2014 #91

from the link Voice for Peace Sep 2014 #89

You've posted that excerpt twice, do you know if it's accurate? beam me up scottie Sep 2014 #98

The article links to this CDC webpage, please read it. It's factual, nothing objectionable there. proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #112

Spare me. beam me up scottie Sep 2014 #113

A fun site-search is that poster's name and "Wakefield"... SidDithers Sep 2014 #117

You can't be serious. beam me up scottie Sep 2014 #120

That's some crazy shit, eh?... SidDithers Sep 2014 #121

So Wakefield is the victim of the story? beam me up scottie Sep 2014 #125

Wait awhile and see what happens. proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #130

Your continued support of a criminal and his agenda on DU is sickening. beam me up scottie Sep 2014 #131

Not up-to-date? No wonder, blame in-the-weeds material plus media's failure to inform the public. proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #172

Oh for the love of... NuclearDem Sep 2014 #144

...children. proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #181

no, I asked somebody if it were accurate. Heavens to mergatroid on the hyperbole. Voice for Peace Sep 2014 #133

Vaccines don't cause autism. beam me up scottie Sep 2014 #135

Quote from RFK reviewer: RobertEarl Sep 2014 #161

Fracking is also dangerous to the health of millions. Why won't any of you that rhett o rick Sep 2014 #185

The "RFK Jr can do no wrong" phanbois in 3-2-1... Archae Sep 2014 #2

And they'll claim RFK Jr. is a "great Democrat"!!... SidDithers Sep 2014 #5

What kind of Democrat does that make you, SidDithers of DU? Octafish Sep 2014 #10

Sid's someone who realizes that having full on nuttery The Green Manalishi Sep 2014 #17

Who's the asshole? Octafish Sep 2014 #25

The asshole AnalystInParadise Sep 2014 #29

Right. Octafish Sep 2014 #31

That would be completely different assholes. Thor_MN Sep 2014 #34

Wow, you really oversimplified the hell out of that. NuclearDem Sep 2014 #43

You're exposed to far, far more mercury.... paleotn Sep 2014 #51

Chlorine is a seriously poisonous gas. Archae Sep 2014 #73

!!!!!! zappaman Sep 2014 #74

FATALITY NuclearDem Sep 2014 #88

Beware the dihydrogen monoxide, though. awoke_in_2003 Sep 2014 #124

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2014 #123

Wonder if it was Library Girl... SidDithers Sep 2014 #126

Damn AnalystInParadise Sep 2014 #138

Who else? greatauntoftriplets Sep 2014 #165

Depends on the question. I would put people who still press the question of whether vaccines cause LeftishBrit Sep 2014 #152

You know who else "Just asks questions"? cemaphonic Sep 2014 #153

Climate change deniers, Holocaust deniers, Birthers, people who believe ACORN stole the elections... YoungDemCA Sep 2014 #180

Don't bother YoungDemCA Sep 2014 #179

Because Sid, You Have Violated One Of The Unwritten Rules Wolf Frankula Sep 2014 #93

That site has a great review of "Dr" Oz.... xocet Sep 2014 #14

I'd never seen that... SidDithers Sep 2014 #15

No problem. I hadn't seen it either until I followed Archae's link and looked around at some of... xocet Sep 2014 #22

Who ignores the effects of BPA and other cumulative toxins in food and other products? Voice for Peace Sep 2014 #44

Thanks. elleng Sep 2014 #66

Agenda 21? Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2014 #85

Your post is a great way to defeat argument by authority. However, the letter's content is not... xocet Sep 2014 #136

not here to debate your point of view, or defend Dr. Oz, who has always given me the creeps Voice for Peace Sep 2014 #142

Thank you for your kind elaboration. I appreciate your reply. n/t xocet Sep 2014 #150

And right on schedule... NuclearDem Sep 2014 #24

Please keep this asshat away from liberal issues MohRokTah Sep 2014 #3

K&R mcar Sep 2014 #4

unrec. 2banon Sep 2014 #6

This is why the static Oz got from Congress was well deserved. What makes this even more of a white still_one Sep 2014 #7

Absolutely. SoapBox Sep 2014 #12

RFK is not a Democrat onecaliberal Sep 2014 #8

actually the anti-vaxers crosses party lines still_one Sep 2014 #50

Granted... paleotn Sep 2014 #54

I prefer the word ignorant still_one Sep 2014 #62

Willfully ignorant... Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2014 #86

That kind of stupidity is bringing back onecaliberal Sep 2014 #107

Your hyperactive autocorrect changed "eradicated" to "irradiated" in tblue37 Sep 2014 #159

If you deny science you are not a democrat. onecaliberal Sep 2014 #106

i wish you were right, but you are wrong. posts on DU have reflected such views still_one Sep 2014 #146

You're entitled to your opinion onecaliberal Sep 2014 #148

You're certainly not a progressive if you outright deny science YoungDemCA Sep 2014 #183

Agree!!! onecaliberal Sep 2014 #184

Please review post 63. Of course, some would rather go blind than see but I hope you're smarter. proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #186

I agree that not all Democrats are the same. There are good Democrats and rhett o rick Sep 2014 #92

Mhm. NuclearDem Sep 2014 #95

Yes, I agree to a point. onecaliberal Sep 2014 #108

K & R SunSeeker Sep 2014 #9

Let's see how you respond, Oz, to a few cases of Polio... SoapBox Sep 2014 #11

If There Were A Vaccine For Ebola otohara Sep 2014 #229

his dad would be ashamed of him for this. wyldwolf Sep 2014 #13

I agree... SidDithers Sep 2014 #16

His grandfather would be VERY proud 951-Riverside Sep 2014 #167

based on the science of his time, I'm sure wyldwolf Sep 2014 #168

Scammers, hucksters and delusional "true believers" etherealtruth Sep 2014 #18

I probably know 100 physicians personally, and every single one supports vaccination. ColesCountyDem Sep 2014 #19

I'm sure thankful that vaccines exist, that's for sure. Because... PatrickforO Sep 2014 #20

Actually, I routinely told my math students chervilant Sep 2014 #35

The following graphic makes clear how current official recommended schedules are varied by country. proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #70

Are those mortality rates for all causes, or just infectious diseases? Jim Lane Sep 2014 #84

Post removed Post removed Sep 2014 #115

Gosh, Croatia is better than us. That makes me feel better! PatrickforO Sep 2014 #116

Great, but which schedule? It's changed a lot, you know. proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #128

How about a respectful dialogue about vaccines? ... DesertDiamond Sep 2014 #21

There is a legitimate debate to be had. NuclearDem Sep 2014 #23

You are not up-to-date. In addition to the sources below, look around for audio of #CDCwhistleblower proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #63

Ugh, NTSA. NuclearDem Sep 2014 #81

NTSA? Let me guess from the source/context: "No Telling Stupid Anything?" Well, I disagree. proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #102

Actually I think it's 'Not This Shit Again' beam me up scottie Sep 2014 #104

1) #hearthiswell on youtube 2) that Baez song, Diamonds and Rust, 'Then give me another word for it' proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #105

Sharyl Attkisson works for the Heritage Foundation. alp227 Sep 2014 #110

When are you going to stop killing infants? Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2014 #114

Kennedy calls world-leading immunologists "biostitutes", like prostitutes... SidDithers Sep 2014 #27

There is no legitimate debate. Anti-vaxxers are a bigger public safety geek tragedy Sep 2014 #33

It will not happen on this website, I think there are too many insecure people here Tumbulu Sep 2014 #36

No, this is generally a pro-science site. geek tragedy Sep 2014 #55

No, the poster before wanted to talk specifics, not pro or anti vax Tumbulu Sep 2014 #119

Person was/is an obvious anti-vaxxer. geek tragedy Sep 2014 #139

Call it "insecurity" that many here refuse to give a platform .... etherealtruth Sep 2014 #101

See? The same old closed minded reactions Tumbulu Sep 2014 #118

That's what the climate change and Holocaust deniers say when people geek tragedy Sep 2014 #140

No, the issues worth discussing exist Tumbulu Sep 2014 #175

You are joking, right? etherealtruth Sep 2014 #163

No I am not, and this is just the typical thing- lumping not approving of gmo's in Tumbulu Sep 2014 #177

Just FYI: chervilant Sep 2014 #37

So what idiot alerted on this request for a dialog? Tumbulu Sep 2014 #134

I did. Because anti-vax nonsense kills people who believe it geek tragedy Sep 2014 #141

well there, you proved my point Tumbulu Sep 2014 #147

There is nothing to debate geek tragedy Sep 2014 #162

So you admit abusing the alert system to push your point of view. Apparently you don't rhett o rick Sep 2014 #149

I wish that members would refrain from bullshit alerts. blackspade Sep 2014 #143

"but those who believe in vaccines are so terrified" "No arguments are ever won by name-calling." Thor_MN Sep 2014 #38

Respectfully, you are wrong: "There actually are plenty of studies showing that vaccines can be FSogol Sep 2014 #40

You may be correct about many or most anti-vaxxers, but not all are con men or grifters. Voice for Peace Sep 2014 #49

Compassion doesn't make junk science geek tragedy Sep 2014 #53

I agree but it's never an effective strategy to attack people in order to change their beliefs. Voice for Peace Sep 2014 #57

There is no legitimate anti - vaccination geek tragedy Sep 2014 #58

I don't know if there is or isn't. But there are legitimate stories of damaged children; and it's no Voice for Peace Sep 2014 #61

. geek tragedy Sep 2014 #67

How many is plenty? Iggo Sep 2014 #47

please post links to those "plenty of studies" cali Sep 2014 #48

Ironically, its the anti-vaccination movement that refuses to have a real dialogue YoungDemCA Sep 2014 #182

You're more concerned with disproven claims of vaccine danger than REAL diseases that kill Arugula Latte Sep 2014 #200

So disappointing. silverweb Sep 2014 #26

+1...nt SidDithers Sep 2014 #28

This message was self-deleted by its author silverweb Sep 2014 #30

He is such a sharp guy, it's amazing how DUMB he is on this issue. Quixote1818 Sep 2014 #32

Dr. Oz - more poison that Oprah has unleashed on the world. Initech Sep 2014 #39

Re: "dr" Oz: giving out suspect medical advice should not be allowed on tv NightWatcher Sep 2014 #41

The letter from the FDA to his producers... SidDithers Sep 2014 #42

sid, thanks for being you. mopinko Sep 2014 #45

Thanks, mopinko... SidDithers Sep 2014 #46

Well said. (nt) paleotn Sep 2014 #56

Delete the 'asshat' references elleng Sep 2014 #52

Well, RFK Jr. IS an asshat... Dr Hobbitstein Sep 2014 #60

You are asking a lot. It's so much more fun to get out tar and feathers than actually rhett o rick Sep 2014 #122

Considering every single one of your posts in this thread NuclearDem Sep 2014 #145

Look, y'all VA_Jill Sep 2014 #59

Won't happen, DU has niche groups that fight over certain topics...this being one. Rex Sep 2014 #64

Oz testified before Congress that he is a cheerleader geek tragedy Sep 2014 #68

Regardless of an improbable autism connection, thimerosal does not belong in children's vaccines. pnwmom Sep 2014 #65

did your PHD tell you much mercury you inhale living downwind of a coal-fired power plant? hobbit709 Sep 2014 #83

One wrong exposure doesn't excuse more -- especially one that's injected directly into pnwmom Sep 2014 #87

Did he say anything about a nice tuna filet? Separation Sep 2014 #137

Yes. We eat other fish. We skip the tuna. pnwmom Sep 2014 #156

Good idea to remove it... LeftishBrit Sep 2014 #154

We don't eat any tuna around here, which is the fish most likely to have high levels. pnwmom Sep 2014 #155

What an asshat, I guess nobody told him thimerosol was out in 2001 Warpy Sep 2014 #71

Yup. And here's a screencap from the Oz show... SidDithers Sep 2014 #72

I guess no one told you that pregnant women now take flu vaccines with thimerosol, pnwmom Sep 2014 #157

Yes, and he failed to mention barbaraj Sep 2014 #169

I think you put your finger on it. ucrdem Sep 2014 #171

This is good information, barbaraj Sep 2014 #178

Kick and rec! zappaman Sep 2014 #75

Disgusting that this is still debated on DU. beam me up scottie Sep 2014 #76

bmus! Good to see you... SidDithers Sep 2014 #77

Hi Sid! beam me up scottie Sep 2014 #78

Not so little anymore. Both in high school... SidDithers Sep 2014 #79

Excellent OP as always, Sid. RFK Jr. is a stain on the progressive cause. nt msanthrope Sep 2014 #80

I just got my T-Dapp for free with Obamacare. Starry Messenger Sep 2014 #94

I am glad you are so health conscience. How about fracking? Are you as passionate about rhett o rick Sep 2014 #96

You should start a thread about fracking... SidDithers Sep 2014 #97

Don't you agree that fracking is a very serious health concern? Or do you agree with Pres Obama rhett o rick Sep 2014 #103

Yes, fracking and anti vaxxers are the same thing. zappaman Sep 2014 #109

Because if there's one thing we know NuclearDem Sep 2014 #100

Upset someone benefited from Obamacare, Rick? zappaman Sep 2014 #111

That's a shame that he's an antivax person. NutmegYankee Sep 2014 #99

Anti-vaxxers should be loudly ridiculed... awoke_in_2003 Sep 2014 #127

Love those grandkiddies to the moon and back... SidDithers Sep 2014 #129

I am almost barbaraj Sep 2014 #132

Thank you barbaraj, and welcome to DU RobertEarl Sep 2014 #160

It's a rough topic barbaraj Sep 2014 #166

Thank you, barbaraj Sep 2014 #170

What happened to that guy???? MADem Sep 2014 #151

I know!... SidDithers Sep 2014 #193

Sid you know this is an insulting title. It's also inaccurate. ucrdem Sep 2014 #158

Some feel better if they find someone to tar and feather and heaven help those that try rhett o rick Sep 2014 #173

Remember Science Diet? ucrdem Sep 2014 #174

It was melamine-tainted gluten from China, unbeknownst to MANY pet food brands eShirl Sep 2014 #189

Right. Scores of pet food makers got it wrong, pets died. It happens. ucrdem Sep 2014 #248

Can't believe he got sucked into all that - TBF Sep 2014 #164

to place too much credence in RFK is to believe in dynasties bobduca Sep 2014 #176

DU rec. joshcryer Sep 2014 #187

Why does Dr. Oz still have a medical license? eShirl Sep 2014 #188

Who knows. It's a mystery... SidDithers Sep 2014 #190

just so there is no confusion, i completely support the use of asshat in this context La Lioness Priyanka Sep 2014 #191

Thanks, Lioness!... SidDithers Sep 2014 #192

Kick! zappaman Sep 2014 #194

Thanks for the kick... SidDithers Sep 2014 #195

kick again msanthrope Sep 2014 #196

Thimerosal was removed from all childhood vaccines in 2001 bhikkhu Sep 2014 #197

Familiar w the following? If not, please investigate further including Youtube #hearthiswell (~340?) proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #198

Then removal of thimerosal from children's vaccines 13 years ago should have affected autism rates bhikkhu Sep 2014 #199

It's crushing how misleading a single sentence can be, not to mention paragraphs. proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #201

I should say, I was briefly on the anti-thimerosal bandwagon bhikkhu Sep 2014 #204

I cannot imagine disregarding the informed& unequivocal views of CDC scientist Dr William W Thompson proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #205

I cannot imagine ignoring all the science leading away from the thimerosal/autism theory bhikkhu Sep 2014 #206

CORRECTION: 'Dr. William Thompson, a senior CDC researcher' 'senior scientist Dr. William Thompson' proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #207

This message was self-deleted by its author proverbialwisdom Sep 2014 #214

Ageofautism... SidDithers Sep 2014 #203

Extra butter on mine, please. KamaAina Sep 2014 #202

I wonder if he'd recommend "no" to an ebola vaccine to those in Liberia? TexasMommaWithAHat Sep 2014 #208

Good question...nt SidDithers Oct 2014 #250

Does smearing a good Democrat really have anything to do with autism? Octafish Sep 2014 #209

What do the assassinations of RFK and JFK have to do... SidDithers Sep 2014 #210

It has to do with character assassination. Octafish Sep 2014 #211

... SidDithers Sep 2014 #212

You better believe it! n/t zappaman Sep 2014 #213

Tag Team is so second banana, Dude. Octafish Sep 2014 #216

Love ya, buddy! zappaman Sep 2014 #217

Hope for change. Octafish Sep 2014 #218

I agree with you that RFK Jr is quite the asshat zappaman Sep 2014 #219

What's it called when you put words in somebody else's mouth? Octafish Sep 2014 #220

Kick. n/t zappaman Sep 2014 #221

Good. Octafish Sep 2014 #223

I join you again in the kick! zappaman Sep 2014 #224

Years of your life. Octafish Sep 2014 #225

Coincidence? I think not! zappaman Sep 2014 #230

Why do you devote years of your life minding what I write? Octafish Sep 2014 #231

Why do you devote years of your life minding what I write? zappaman Sep 2014 #232

Do you suffer from echolalia? Octafish Sep 2014 #235

Really? zappaman Sep 2014 #236

Gosh. I guess that makes the rest of your posts really something. Octafish Sep 2014 #237

I love that meme! zappaman Sep 2014 #238

Odd you should mention the BFEE. Octafish Sep 2014 #239

Yeah. zappaman Sep 2014 #240

There aren't enough smilies to cover up how un-democratic character assassination is. Octafish Sep 2014 #215

Sure is. NuclearDem Sep 2014 #241

Show where. Octafish Sep 2014 #242

If I posted every single time you tried suggesting a DUer was a paid operative NuclearDem Sep 2014 #243

It's one of his signature moves zappaman Sep 2014 #244

Years of your life. Octafish Sep 2014 #245

Found a hair in my soup the other day. zappaman Sep 2014 #246

But it's what your hero engages in... SidDithers Sep 2014 #247

More asshattery here... zappaman Sep 2014 #222

Glad I'm catching up on OUTLANDER instead!!!!!! MADem Sep 2014 #226

RFK, Jr. has been a champion for the environment and other liberal causes. 3rdwaydem Sep 2014 #227

When it comes to vaccines he's an asshat. tammywammy Sep 2014 #228

Funny how the posters who cry "hero worship" anytime anything positive is said about Obama zappaman Sep 2014 #233

Honest question: have you read the first page of his 2005 article? ucrdem Sep 2014 #249

+1 pnwmom Sep 2014 #234

I still admire RFK, Jr., but on this one issue, we part ways. n/t Tarheel_Dem Oct 2014 #251