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valerief

(53,235 posts)

4. Belief shouldn't enter into it.

Reply to Donald Ian Rankin (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 01:15 PM

Sep 2014

The only time in which yelling "fire" at a crowded theatre should be illegal is when the yeller believes that the theatre is not on fire.

If the yeller can provide enough evidence that it would be reasonable to conclude the theater was on fire, then it should be legal. After all, the yeller might believe in creationism, but that doesn't make it true and there's no evidence it's true.

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Yelling "fire" in a crowded theatre is not merely legal, it's praiseworthy. [View all] Donald Ian Rankin Sep 2014 OP

Can we get some context? Erich Bloodaxe BSN Sep 2014 #1

I specifically did write this in a vacuum. Donald Ian Rankin Sep 2014 #6

Let me suggest a hypothetical context. Jackpine Radical Sep 2014 #28

Great analogy, Jackpine n/t ReRe Sep 2014 #38

And what of the caller who lied to 911? Praiseworthy? riqster Sep 2014 #39

Where I come from we call that brush shooting Bandit Sep 2014 #45

We call them "sound shots." Jackpine Radical Sep 2014 #48

Quite possibly the silliest thing I have read today. Egnever Sep 2014 #2

Of course, but I disagree with your interpretation cali Sep 2014 #3

Belief shouldn't enter into it. valerief Sep 2014 #4

When that example was given, it was specified that the "yell" was false. merrily Sep 2014 #5

Exactly! Thanks for posting that ... Tuesday Afternoon Sep 2014 #9

You're welcome, but remember, merrily Sep 2014 #11

for realz Tuesday Afternoon Sep 2014 #14

"I fell into a vat of chocolate and I yelled, 'Fire!'" rock Sep 2014 #7

What Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr. actually said: moriah Sep 2014 #8

^ woot ^ Tuesday Afternoon Sep 2014 #10

The actual holding of the case was, in my opinion, a wretched one, but it's good to get merrily Sep 2014 #12

Holmes position has been superseded by Supreme Court rulings made 40 some years ago Kaleva Sep 2014 #13

Yeah, still, he never tried to say a true cry of "fire!" would be a violation of free speech. moriah Sep 2014 #16

Thanks for that. Holmes's "yelling fire" example was never overturned. merrily Sep 2014 #23

His position on falsely yelling fire in a crowded theater has not been overruled, though. merrily Sep 2014 #17

Can you provide an example of anyone in the past 40 years charged with thus? Kaleva Sep 2014 #30

There are laws against "inducing a panic" which is what Lex Sep 2014 #31

A link to an article where a case was dimissed Kaleva Sep 2014 #35

Right, there are laws. And people aren't always guilty of breaking them Lex Sep 2014 #36

"incite to riot" reddread Sep 2014 #37

What does that have to do with anything that I posted? merrily Sep 2014 #44

Now spinning in his grave because of Faux, Gohmert, Beck and the rest. freshwest Sep 2014 #41

Yell "Theater" at a crowded fire. hobbit709 Sep 2014 #15

That's just playing into the fire's...um...hands. randome Sep 2014 #21

It was an Abbie Hoffman quote hobbit709 Sep 2014 #24

Beat me to it. Jackpine Radical Sep 2014 #29

That's because you don't have the quote correct in the first place jberryhill Sep 2014 #18

I'm not quoting Holmes, I'm quoting people quoting him. N.T. Donald Ian Rankin Sep 2014 #20

People slaughter these things jberryhill Sep 2014 #22

Fire Ron Obvious Sep 2014 #19

Oh, wow! Thanks! Great video by Hitch! I'm going to let that sink in... freshwest Sep 2014 #42

Isn't the clear and common usage of that phrase directly implying the person doing the yelling knows LanternWaste Sep 2014 #25

NO. elleng Sep 2014 #26

That was what I was looking for... cascadiance Sep 2014 #27

Christopher Hitchens - In Defense Of Unpopular Speech jamzrockz Sep 2014 #32

Say said person yells "fire" sarisataka Sep 2014 #33

Hands down, it would be your fault no matter where you were at the time. randome Sep 2014 #46

Well try it some time and see where it gets you. Cleita Sep 2014 #34

"Genuinely believe" is what Teabaggers use to deny science. riqster Sep 2014 #40

What if they don't believe the guy yelling fire until it's no longer a matter of belief? freshwest Sep 2014 #43

Fire can only harm you if you believe it can. randome Sep 2014 #47

Like the apartment building in the Monty Python sketch. riqster Sep 2014 #49

Basil gives voice to my frustration, awful me! freshwest Sep 2014 #53

Evidence is always to be respected. And it trumps belief. riqster Sep 2014 #50

How many angels can dance on the head of a pin? tularetom Sep 2014 #51

42 n/t tazkcmo Sep 2014 #52