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13. No, we don't know.

Wed Oct 15, 2014, 05:16 PM

Oct 2014

The important thing in this story is that the State tried to cram religion on this guy, (and any "higher power" talk IS religion,) and he said no, so they threw him in jail.

And that was 100% wrong.

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Atheist jailed for denying ‘higher power’ in Calif. drug rehab gets $2M [View all] reflection Oct 2014 OP

atheism pays! unblock Oct 2014 #1

I just hope he found another drug rehab to yeoman6987 Oct 2014 #7

You are assuming he is addicted . . . markpkessinger Oct 2014 #11

Very true. I hope he is just a casual user yeoman6987 Oct 2014 #21

Although what you say is true marym625 Oct 2014 #39

Not as much as religion. Arugula Latte Oct 2014 #46

sure, when you're at the top. this guy was just one of the faithless. unblock Oct 2014 #47

Wonder how long 2 million dollars worth of meth is gonna last him? CBGLuthier Oct 2014 #2

Why do you assume he will return to using? tkmorris Oct 2014 #3

Well, it is like giving lighter fluid to an arsonist... Archae Oct 2014 #4

We don't even know if this guy was necessarily addicted . . . markpkessinger Oct 2014 #10

No, we don't know. Archae Oct 2014 #13

He should have called their bluff and made the "higher power" liberalhistorian Oct 2014 #23

Clarify what you mean by "the other way around" please robbob Oct 2014 #38

It would have been stunned amazement whatthehey Oct 2014 #43

Substitute "Future Self" for "Higher Power" AndyTiedye Oct 2014 #53

Or, his higher power could have been methamphetamine ... CaptainTruth Oct 2014 #62

He might not have even been a user. Possesion does not necessarily mean it was for his use. Thor_MN Oct 2014 #27

Wow, what a classy comment. nt Logical Oct 2014 #58

Because everybody knows that the 12 steps are the ONLY way to get sober, silly! Warren DeMontague Oct 2014 #26

I'm sorry, that just isn't a fact. It's a great resource, but "success" rates are highly exgeratede. 2banon Oct 2014 #41

A success rate of 1 out of 10 sounds highly exaggerated? hughee99 Oct 2014 #50

It is hard to get definite statistics, I'd agree with you there. Warren DeMontague Oct 2014 #66

Agree completely. n/t 2banon Oct 2014 #68

There needs to be alternatives...noone should cally Oct 2014 #5

and godbothering groups (ALL 12 steppers) are no more successful than other interventions. whatthehey Oct 2014 #44

Drug and alcohol rehab needs to be in the hands of trained educated therapists, not religions. Dont call me Shirley Oct 2014 #6

Portugal is leading the way on this issue Ampersand Unicode Oct 2014 #9

Portugal? Wow! Interesting, Thanks for the insight.. n/t 2banon Oct 2014 #69

Whenever I hear "trained therapists," I think of the McMartin preschool witch hunt. Archae Oct 2014 #52

Yeah, I wasn't thinking about that, just good old fashioned regular psychotherapists. Dont call me Shirley Oct 2014 #54

Except what is a "regular" psychotherapist? Archae Oct 2014 #55

Like a chiropractor, you gotta find a good one. Dont call me Shirley Oct 2014 #56

Good for him! Joanie Baloney Oct 2014 #8

I recommend reading Rehab Nation JonLP24 Oct 2014 #12

Also Gabor Mate "In The Realm Of Hungry Ghosts" Dont call me Shirley Oct 2014 #14

Excellent point, and I'd also liberalhistorian Oct 2014 #24

I've read an article at Cracked.com about the guy who started AA... Archae Oct 2014 #15

KNR n/t DirkGently Oct 2014 #16

"Higher Power" alternative.... Spitfire of ATJ Oct 2014 #17

LOL! good one .n/t 2banon Oct 2014 #42

First thing he saw the check? "Ok, maybe there is a god". lol jtuck004 Oct 2014 #18

Works for me! mountain grammy Oct 2014 #19

sanity prevails! AtomicKitten Oct 2014 #20

K&R Solly Mack Oct 2014 #22

Good. 12 Step Programs work for some people, don't work for others. People- particularly Atheists- Warren DeMontague Oct 2014 #25

This is the problem with AA and 12 step programs .. too much turning responsibility over to ''GOD" YOHABLO Oct 2014 #28

"...is within you." Pastiche423 Oct 2014 #30

That is, I think, an oversimplification. Plus, it's not up to anyone to walk anyone else's path. Warren DeMontague Oct 2014 #36

The beehive analogy F4lconF16 Oct 2014 #37

There are good points here, but one problem. whatthehey Oct 2014 #48

I dont buy that people who have an innate physiological dependence on alcohol Warren DeMontague Oct 2014 #64

but mm and aa success rates are both approximately equal, and aa horror stories are ten a penny too. whatthehey Oct 2014 #70

Actually, I said I think there are probably different forms or manifestations of "alcoholisms". Warren DeMontague Oct 2014 #72

I agree with the last bit whatthehey Oct 2014 #73

I fully support scientific research into alcoholism. I know for a fact there are physiological, Warren DeMontague Oct 2014 #74

Also I'd add this, regarding "the only sometime successful mitigation is psychological" Warren DeMontague Oct 2014 #67

Nothing I said was over simplified. Treatment programs are beneficial .. we can't live in treatment YOHABLO Oct 2014 #61

Like i said, i wouldnt second guess how anyone else pulls it off. Warren DeMontague Oct 2014 #65

Amen! Dustlawyer Oct 2014 #29

Court-mandated rehab is ridiculous Recursion Oct 2014 #31

Just a tentacle of the war on drug economy. More tentacles than an underwater sea kelp forest. lonestarnot Oct 2014 #32

Christians are CONVINCED it works... Spitfire of ATJ Oct 2014 #40

Good. ZombieHorde Oct 2014 #33

JHC.. Lucrative to stand up for what you don't believe in! The "JHC" part is Cha Oct 2014 #34

Barry Hazle Jr sounds clear.. Cha Oct 2014 #35

Guy was not cooperating with the higher power... Jail was the only solution :) Helen Borg Oct 2014 #45

thx for this thread Liberal_in_LA Oct 2014 #49

Good. hifiguy Oct 2014 #51

Good. alarimer Oct 2014 #57

good. forcing that higher power nonsense on people is BS RedCappedBandit Oct 2014 #59

This one god thing is so boring. EEO Oct 2014 #60

Reminds me of a friend who got a DUI some years back. CaptainTruth Oct 2014 #63

Just want to say, Good! 2banon Oct 2014 #71