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JonLP24

(29,929 posts)
131. It amazes me there is one key fact that eludes Maher and the debate in general
Mon Nov 3, 2014, 10:24 AM
Nov 2014

Early on I understood where he was going is it isn't an isolated band of criminals or isolated ideas but that there are more support for their brand than someone totally clueless that viewed the entirety of the faith as just some people doing their own things. He acts like this falls under the same umbrella when he should be directed these sort of comments to Wahhabi Islam which features more of the orthordox, fundamentalist, right-wing sects of the faith where you find this sort of wanting humans to die stuff. You start looking at Christianity through the same lens and you'll find a lot of the same shit. You may not find the same scale of violence (not much since the 1st, 2nd, and 50's-70's KKK) but he made those specific comments addressing the support of other Muslims and you'll certainly find the same type of support. Pat Robertson suggested we should go ahead and assassinate Hugo Chavez since he seemed to be under the impression that he already was a target and the reasons given, with irony, because he is using Veneuzuela as a launching pad for Communism and the Muslim sect I mentioned.

His guest shown he did have a much lesser understanding when he (paraphrasing - a long the lines with what he said) that those countries, cultures, faith had a problem with us over there after he made the claim that we need to be over there but that our precence was disliked because of "infidels near holy sights" - does Iran 1957 ring a bell? If anyone has shown more hypocrisy in that region.. look at the Yemen civil war. Whose side are they fighting? US claims to dropping drones on Al-Qaeda in Yemen, there are have been many claims they have also targeted the rebels up against the regime allied by Saudi Arabia & Egypt who were allies of the US at the time of the claims. But when you look at what it is ISIS wants, it is another Saudi Arabia(when it comes to penalties and no man-made law only Sharia law type of thing). There have been Muslims fighting the Wahabbi terrorists at one time or another in the region but US aids the other side whenever it is convenient.

Just some general thoughts I had in my head and not entirely directed to you -- Maher makes some good points but he gets locked into this Islam tunnel vision that leads me confused on what it his point his. An acknowledgement? The 4th ranked person in terms of media coverage of the debate made the point that all sorts of notable people of the faith speak out to mess less press. Maher knows there are vast numbers of Muslims that don't do or support those things but leads me confused where he sees a problem which implies a solution or compromise typically but I'm not hearing what that is from him.

When you have a faith which includes ISIS, Ice Cube, and Muhammed Ali under the Islam umbrella it is pretty obvious followers have vastly different views on practicing.

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They should let him speak. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #1
He is also not a liberal, but one of those libretarians hollysmom Nov 2014 #3
His two top religious targets are Muslims and Christians. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #4
and frequently an ignorant one. hollysmom Nov 2014 #8
I am glad to see people push back with him. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #11
That is very understanding of you, justin. Like a true Liberal Christian of Cha Nov 2014 #14
Thanks Cha! hrmjustin Nov 2014 #17
A' ole pilikia, Justin~ Cha Nov 2014 #18
I don't like him because of his meanness but also because hollysmom Nov 2014 #21
He's also spewed some ugly misogynist garbage.. whathehell Nov 2014 #55
"I don't like him because of his meanness" Nuclear Unicorn Nov 2014 #128
I have issues with DU - disagree politely. hollysmom Nov 2014 #143
He is myopic in selecting his Skidmore Nov 2014 #79
Agreed! hrmjustin Nov 2014 #81
He has actually read those holy books, which both have hurtful and cruel shit from coved to cover snooper2 Nov 2014 #133
And they also have loving things in them. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #136
No such thing as a libertarian who wants to ban guns Reter Nov 2014 #134
He holds a particular disdain for Islam. MontyPow Nov 2014 #26
OMG. He thinks that Islam is more violent than Christianity? Nye Bevan Nov 2014 #85
No sarcasm thingy? Rhinodawg Nov 2014 #116
He's like Christopher Hitchens Scootaloo Nov 2014 #35
This is totally not true oberliner Nov 2014 #48
And he supported killing christians becuase they were christians? Scootaloo Nov 2014 #67
Let him speak after the ceremony. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Nov 2014 #51
I would let him speak. bravenak Nov 2014 #2
It is a commencement speech. The graduates just have to sit there and take it. djean111 Nov 2014 #49
I thought the show tonight was great. I think he's wrong if he's blaming all,, or the majority, Hoyt Nov 2014 #5
I thought the lady on his show tonight went way overboard aint_no_life_nowhere Nov 2014 #6
It was something like 60 some percent applegrove Nov 2014 #16
You know if you watch the original exchange between Affleck and Maher he didn't say one thing scarystuffyo Nov 2014 #24
He was critisizing Islam. Just like he applegrove Nov 2014 #29
I always marvel at his selectivity when Skidmore Nov 2014 #82
He was saying no liberal criticizes Islam. Liberal certainly do criticize Israel. applegrove Nov 2014 #95
But 60% of Egyptians do not kill people who leave Islam. Bill was all but equating poll responses merrily Nov 2014 #38
I share yr thoughts and concerns. I also wonder how much Maher is getting truedelphi Nov 2014 #73
Bill is worth well over 20 million bucks.... Bluenorthwest Nov 2014 #109
Diane Feinstein is also worth well over 20 million bucks. truedelphi Nov 2014 #124
Starts at 5:10 scarystuffyo Nov 2014 #7
Thank you so much for posting this. LittleGirl Nov 2014 #30
if his speaking fee came out of student fees, they certainly haave a right to have someone hollysmom Nov 2014 #9
The students are the ones who originally chose him. Dr. Strange Nov 2014 #59
to me he has always been a seriously flawed person. hollysmom Nov 2014 #63
we are all seriously flawwed.. VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #77
exactly hollysmom Nov 2014 #90
The problem is, which students? kiva Nov 2014 #106
I think the contract is of first importance. hollysmom Nov 2014 #125
Berkeley has already said they won't cancel him. tammywammy Nov 2014 #126
Free speech doesn't mean he's owed a speaking gig. Union Scribe Nov 2014 #10
He's not 'owed' one, but who will be good enough for Berkeley now? nt babylonsister Nov 2014 #15
Maybe someone who has some kind of academic achievement rather than a talkshow host. JVS Nov 2014 #46
That is not the rule for commencement speakers. former9thward Nov 2014 #61
No - the first rule of commencement speaking is... Blue Idaho Nov 2014 #121
+1 Exactly. merrily Nov 2014 #28
Uh, no SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2014 #76
you understand freedom of speech only pertains to the govt right? VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #94
And you know that UCBerkeley is a state university and thus part of the gov't, right? n/t Sivafae Nov 2014 #138
not the way meant by freedom of speech... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2014 #142
That's right, Bill ATTACK! I imagine they'll be protesting at his gig, too.. good. Cha Nov 2014 #12
If you only listen to people you agree with, Stonepounder Nov 2014 #13
Don't go? They are supposed to not attend their own graduation? merrily Nov 2014 #32
Nitpick Erich Bloodaxe BSN Nov 2014 #52
Who said Maher had the right not to be protested? Orsino Nov 2014 #83
Seems to me there is a difference between protesting and 'uninviting'. Stonepounder Nov 2014 #89
The protesters are asking those who hired him to cancel the appearance, yes. Orsino Nov 2014 #137
The pro lifers do far more than mere disagreement. They interfere with women's life choices. alp227 Nov 2014 #99
That's the thing about free speech... MoonchildCA Nov 2014 #19
One thing i've learned from DU... Scootaloo Nov 2014 #36
Or Zionists oberliner Nov 2014 #80
Political affiliation is not identity Scootaloo Nov 2014 #96
It's a generation composed of special snowflakes... Oktober Nov 2014 #20
Bill Maher's generation? Erich Bloodaxe BSN Nov 2014 #53
Uh huh... Oktober Nov 2014 #57
Haha. Great evasive, broad brush ad hom. alp227 Nov 2014 #100
So make the case... Oktober Nov 2014 #104
Sometimes, differing ideas are far beyond mere disagreement. alp227 Nov 2014 #105
Of course Bill is speaking in favor of equal rights for LGBT people and freedom of religion Bluenorthwest Nov 2014 #110
He does while at the same time othering American Muslims. alp227 Nov 2014 #114
They aren't trying to "shut him up" BuelahWitch Nov 2014 #118
"why, I have to look at Muslims every day on the street--even at Nobel awards!" nt MisterP Nov 2014 #22
Berkeley's still got a chance to keep its reputation for "free speech," but not without a fight, ancianita Nov 2014 #23
This has nothing to do with free speech, nothing. Please see Replies 28 and 32. merrily Nov 2014 #33
I appreciate your points about students' views. Thanks. Does the protest represent ancianita Nov 2014 #40
On another thread, I did specify it would, for me, turn on how a merrily Nov 2014 #44
My last commencement was high school; didn't attend my college ones. I read #41. ancianita Nov 2014 #45
As to representing the views of the majority of students... Erich Bloodaxe BSN Nov 2014 #54
I'd prefer a majority representation of the graduating class, although a case can be made for ancianita Nov 2014 #58
Berkley has a not so great reputation among Union loving performers, the last non CEO or political Bluenorthwest Nov 2014 #113
spot on Bill. Puzzledtraveller Nov 2014 #25
Guess what, Bill. They don't have to listen to you. MontyPow Nov 2014 #27
Maher's abrasive, know-it-all attitude is why people dislike him. Ykcutnek Nov 2014 #31
It's like inviting Gordon Gecko to speak at graduation - it's an insult to the graduates. nt bananas Nov 2014 #43
Bill Maher needs to get over himself and stop acting like a petulant toddler. merrily Nov 2014 #34
Bill Maher = Joy Behar - yes! Though I like Joy. closeupready Nov 2014 #120
Reza Aslan is a nice man Scootaloo Nov 2014 #37
Exactly why Bill Maher welcomes him on the show. That, and Bill Maher makes money from his show merrily Nov 2014 #41
"I have no pretensions of being a nice person" oberliner Nov 2014 #127
offending folks is what he does dembotoz Nov 2014 #39
On his own dime. That doesn't mean anyone has to have him as commencement speaker. merrily Nov 2014 #42
Exactly. This is a commencement speech, it is not about Maher. djean111 Nov 2014 #47
Face it Bill. Boom Sound 416 Nov 2014 #50
IIRC, a student led group extended the initial invitation several months ago... CincyDem Nov 2014 #56
The students did pick him. A small number protested after his episode with Affleck riderinthestorm Nov 2014 #78
From your link, student led group called The Californians picked him BuelahWitch Nov 2014 #123
people that are purposely offensive, get offended when they offend. he needs to suck it up. nt seabeyond Nov 2014 #60
With Bill 100%. True Blue Door Nov 2014 #62
+1 superpatriotman Nov 2014 #65
+2 Throd Nov 2014 #66
+1 PasadenaTrudy Nov 2014 #69
Your post whatchamacallit Nov 2014 #71
Monosyllabic sniping - is that how you make an argument? True Blue Door Nov 2014 #72
Protesting is a big part of civil rights, and people have the right to protest... Violet_Crumble Nov 2014 #75
You have no clue whatsoever how ironic and hypocritical that statement is, do you? True Blue Door Nov 2014 #88
+1000 Rhinodawg Nov 2014 #117
I largely agree with you. Anyone who is actually for human rights would be Marr Nov 2014 #139
Of course, nobody "has to hear" him speak. LWolf Nov 2014 #64
So does Maher realize he is doing the exact same thing he so protests? Rex Nov 2014 #68
Once more, Maher doesn't know squat... joeybee12 Nov 2014 #70
I like Bill, but he needs to learn to be more tactful ecstatic Nov 2014 #74
I agree with Bill! Way too much political correctness with liberals. If you need to know whats the B Calm Nov 2014 #84
"Way too much political correctness with liberals"? Like what? alp227 Nov 2014 #101
Please, please won't someone protect the young impressionable Berkeley students Nye Bevan Nov 2014 #86
Campus statement on commencement speaker antiquie Nov 2014 #87
Sounds like they're doubling down on dumb. ucrdem Nov 2014 #91
Exactly. antiquie Nov 2014 #92
They shouldn't hire political figures to give these speeches LittleBlue Nov 2014 #93
Students make the selection, it is usually a CEO or a political figure Bluenorthwest Nov 2014 #107
The student group that invited Maher disinvited him LittleBlue Nov 2014 #119
Did the students not originally pick him? If they did - oh well. Drunken Irishman Nov 2014 #97
Some ideas are too worthless - not offensive - to be spoken. nt alp227 Nov 2014 #98
I don't think I have ever seen a better example of "Poutrage" Sen. Walter Sobchak Nov 2014 #102
Maher can be brilliant at times, however Voice for Peace Nov 2014 #103
If, say, a right winger had said what Maher said - hedgehog Nov 2014 #108
nope noiretextatique Nov 2014 #112
It amazes me there is one key fact that eludes Maher and the debate in general JonLP24 Nov 2014 #131
they said fuck you, maher: get over it noiretextatique Nov 2014 #111
if an opposing/upsetting opinion can't be heard Nevada Blue Nov 2014 #115
Maher has the right to speak, and the students have the equal right to protest his speech. n/t. Ken Burch Nov 2014 #122
If your answer is to fire someone or to shut them up BubbaFett Nov 2014 #129
The article opens up with the one of the worst and common defenses of a bigot JonLP24 Nov 2014 #130
Here's some more wisdom from good ol' Bill Maher Orrex Nov 2014 #132
Some comments Maher made reminded me of an odd story JonLP24 Nov 2014 #135
I think he's right. leftyladyfrommo Nov 2014 #140
This is what I don't get. tammywammy Nov 2014 #141
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