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lumberjack_jeff

(33,224 posts)

19. It's from the "Mitt Romney fun with math" school of statistics.

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 05:18 PM

Apr 2012

It may be true, strictly speaking, but it's a statistic which is both completely misleading and inherently impossible to mitigate.

Women make less because they choose jobs for different reasons than men choose jobs. Women ALWAYS put a higher premium on nonmonetary reward, and go to college to get these jobs. Men on the other hand put a higher premium on money, and are more likely to choose jobs which are more dangerous, difficult and are less rewarding in exchange for that higher pay.

I have a friend who is a drives a septic tank truck. I have never seen a woman do this job, even though the pay is pretty good. He only has to get in the septic tank for repairs occasionally, and the tank is mostly pumped out (usually no more than knee-deep), and the homeowner usually doesn't flush the toilet while he's in there.

He earns every penny of whatever pay gap exists.

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A Woman�s Lifetime Earnings Lost To Pay Gap Could Feed A Family Of Four For 37 Years [View all] Luminous Animal Apr 2012 OP

But it buys a 1%'er another house. liberal N proud Apr 2012 #1

surprised this post isn't getting more love nashville_brook Apr 2012 #2

that's a pretty typical reaction to women's issues BlancheSplanchnik Apr 2012 #4

Or maybe is much ado about nothing taught_me_patience Apr 2012 #6

Hey I just got home from work varelse Apr 2012 #47

:) glad this got kicked -- ! nashville_brook Apr 2012 #54

I thought the 77% myth has long been debunked taught_me_patience Apr 2012 #3

Feel free to "trot" out the old debunking arguments... please. Please do so. nt riderinthestorm Apr 2012 #5

Here you go taught_me_patience Apr 2012 #7

Not debunked... Luminous Animal Apr 2012 #8

You've actually proved my point taught_me_patience Apr 2012 #10

I am not going to lend credence to a report commissioned by the Bush Admin and done by a Rand Corp Luminous Animal Apr 2012 #13

+10000000000000 nashville_brook Apr 2012 #55

Your link explained nothing taught_me_patience Apr 2012 #66

Actually, most studies up to this Randian pretty much supported this stat. Luminous Animal Apr 2012 #70

Your own article doesn't support the stat, if you read it carefully. They blazon "77%," but read HiPointDem Apr 2012 #79

It's not a rand spin-off, it's headed by a former rand employee. somewhat different. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #67

= 60% of that "77% gap" is an artifact. I think that's a debunking. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #11

as if those factors were dismissable anyway iverglas Apr 2012 #14

Yep... Luminous Animal Apr 2012 #16

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Apr 2012 #32

too bad iverglas Apr 2012 #38

Ugly is right. Warren DeMontague Apr 2012 #39

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Apr 2012 #40

self delete hlthe2b Apr 2012 #42

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Apr 2012 #44

You are right.... Sorry.. hlthe2b Apr 2012 #45

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Apr 2012 #46

Some stay at home parents are like that. I know, I used to cater to Luminous Animal Apr 2012 #49

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Apr 2012 #50

I agree with the 1st paragraph 100%. Luminous Animal Apr 2012 #56

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Apr 2012 #72

Doesn't matter what you believe, she says it was her choice and there's no particular reason HiPointDem Apr 2012 #80

Why do men take jobs which yield an 1150% greater risk of death? n/t lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #17

And women? I'm a female farmer - one of the most dangerous occupations on any list. nt riderinthestorm Apr 2012 #18

but men disproportionately perform the most dangerous jobs. that's just a fact. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #60

I'm sure you have an answer, and a source iverglas Apr 2012 #23

What relevance does any of the stuff you posted hold? lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #26

that's for me to know iverglas Apr 2012 #28

oh, and by the way iverglas Apr 2012 #29

the actual source of your pretty pic has some more meaningful info iverglas Apr 2012 #33

Do you have a link for that? riderinthestorm Apr 2012 #34

Mining, farming, fishing, roofing, pay more than comparably skilled safe jobs. lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #37

Link to factual back up your statements in your other post? riderinthestorm Apr 2012 #43

. lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #52

You made the statement, back it up. nt riderinthestorm Apr 2012 #53

I did. lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #61

You should commission a study... LanternWaste Apr 2012 #92

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Apr 2012 #35

is there a diffference between your behaviour in this thread iverglas Apr 2012 #41

This message was self-deleted by its author Warren DeMontague Apr 2012 #90

Something wrong with this statistic. For most people, 37 years is about close to a lifetime's work HiPointDem Apr 2012 #9

In 2010 women who worked full time, year round, still only earned 77 percent of what men earned Luminous Animal Apr 2012 #15

"average" HiPointDem Apr 2012 #20

I have no idea what you are talking about... Luminous Animal Apr 2012 #22

77% accounts for neither occupation nor overtime nor experience. lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #27

Bureau of Labor Statistics says 81%. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #63

It's from the "Mitt Romney fun with math" school of statistics. lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #19

And my sister washes shit off of old people. Luminous Animal Apr 2012 #24

And the men that do the same job (I'm assuming nurses' aide) get the same lousy pay. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #65

Well, there is the rub. A traditional man's job (education and training) will command Luminous Animal Apr 2012 #68

and that's a question that "women only make 77% of what men do" does nothing to advance HiPointDem Apr 2012 #69

Actually, it does. And is the root of the parity movement. Luminous Animal Apr 2012 #71

Equal pay for equal work is already the law of the land, and so is non-discrimination in hiring. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #74

and that's where i disagree with you, when you put wage differences in job categories down to HiPointDem Apr 2012 #73

How did "traditional mens jobs" become that? lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #89

pretty funny iverglas Apr 2012 #25

Women ALWAYS put a higher premium on nonmonetary reward BlancheSplanchnik Apr 2012 #36

One at a time. lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #51

"holding the same full-time, year-round job" is a misrepresentation, intentional or otherwise. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #81

yes, thank you! BlancheSplanchnik Apr 2012 #84

I agree that nurses aides are underpaid for what they do. That said, they *did* chose to do it. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #93

Your male friend doesn't "deserve" to get paid more than women. nt Liquorice Apr 2012 #64

He doesn't. The job does. nt lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #85

Women don't need to feed families. Iris Apr 2012 #12

I didn't say anything like that. They *do* need to feed families, and half of them do it on abysmal HiPointDem Apr 2012 #21

I was replying to the OP. Iris Apr 2012 #30

no problem, my mistake. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #58

Both kinds of disparities exist. undeterred Apr 2012 #31

The disparity between the bottom 20% and the top 20% is larger and has larger ramifications for HiPointDem Apr 2012 #57

The problem being laundry_queen Apr 2012 #75

Yes, they're going to hire the woman, but it could just as easily be an h1b male or anyone else HiPointDem Apr 2012 #78

mkay. laundry_queen Apr 2012 #88

I recently finished reading "Women Don't Ask" varelse Apr 2012 #48

Damn. lonestarnot Apr 2012 #59

Yeah. Rex Apr 2012 #62

Now that I read the entire article, I see how duplicitous it is. While trumpeting the lifetime HiPointDem Apr 2012 #76

I didn't know there were wage gap deniers. And to find one on the DU of all places! nt Liquorice Apr 2012 #82

show me where i deny a wage gap. HiPointDem Apr 2012 #83

Sure. There are some honest people here, too.nt lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #87

Nobody in the thread is denying a wage gap taught_me_patience Apr 2012 #91

Male full time workers also work more overtime. lumberjack_jeff Apr 2012 #86

k&r Starry Messenger Apr 2012 #77