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bhikkhu

(10,708 posts)
26. Valid, but I can't imagine a viable candidate who would have done otherwise
Tue Nov 11, 2014, 11:58 PM
Nov 2014

Much of that comes with the territory (sadly).

To not do #1, he would have had to shut down the NSA, and a certain amount of the CIA and the FBI. I don't think that could be done from the executive branch.

To not do #2, he would have had to have published the records, pictures and video of the bush era torture practices. While I would have welcomed that, there are pros and cons. He did sign an executive order in his first week clearly ending the practices, and probably there was some rationalization that that was sufficient, and a "least harm" approach (though clearly not a "maximum justice" approach).

#3 is a matter of enforcing existing law. I don't know how he could do otherwise - its kind of the job. The administration did move towards a hands-off policy of marijuana enforcement where state laws had been passed that conflicted with federal laws.

#4 is an objection to a method of modern war. I don't think the drone program has been effective, but I believe it was a choice between doing nothing, or unnecessarily committing troops, or trying to do something. On paper there is a compelling military argument for drone warfare, but it hasn't worked out so well in practice, apparently.

#5 Technically, military action against a foreign power is illegal without an act of congress, and congress has authorized only 11 actions since 1787. A list of actual wars and military interventions is here https://www.globalpolicy.org/us-military-expansion-and-intervention/26024.html . I didn't count them, but its certainly well over a hundred. Obama followed the same practices as every other president; not that that's a good thing, but "illegal" means nothing in context. And I think the side you are fighting on outweighs any other factor if you are fighting in a war. Al-Awlaki chose his side.

#6 I don't know what this refers to

#7 Snowden and Manning, I imagine. I'm again not for prosecution, but if you have protocols for classified information, its hard not to have punishment for releasing classified information. I wish Manning had been treated better from the beginning, and I'm fine with Snowden being allowed to leave.

Agree completely. truebluegreen Nov 2014 #1
anyone who says my "tribalism" has overcome my "moral compass" has pretty much lost my attention arely staircase Nov 2014 #2
No prob. Appreciate your honesty!! RiverLover Nov 2014 #3
thanks arely staircase Nov 2014 #4
Really? Can You Be Any More Disingenuous? billhicks76 Nov 2014 #33
Ahem......" fuck this guy" is aimed at the journo , not the poster...hence no " Flag" option. Nt pkdu Nov 2014 #51
+1 eom. 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #101
What a freaking surprise AnalystInParadise Nov 2014 #131
What are you talking about? eom. 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #136
+1. freshwest Nov 2014 #21
Post removed Post removed Nov 2014 #32
No, he and I disagree with the assessment. We have no reason to be ashamed. Nt stevenleser Nov 2014 #41
LMFAO L0oniX Nov 2014 #44
You should delete that before the jury seats. L0oniX Nov 2014 #43
Me too! sabrina 1 Nov 2014 #98
It doesn't bother me because it doesn't apply to me. If someone I love is doing something wrong sabrina 1 Nov 2014 #37
"moral compass" is a critical issue.. truth2power Nov 2014 #80
You are wrong TshaiRedhair Nov 2014 #56
It's very telling that if Bush was doing these, all of us would be up in arms. alarimer Nov 2014 #5
+1 840high Nov 2014 #24
They Are Blind To The Fact billhicks76 Nov 2014 #38
the hypocrisy displayed by many DUers is utterly DISGUSTING Skittles Nov 2014 #62
Can you kindly provide ... NanceGreggs Nov 2014 #70
Message auto-removed Name removed Nov 2014 #89
Items 1, 2 and 5 LondonReign2 Nov 2014 #96
Yes, yes, of course. NanceGreggs Nov 2014 #142
You asked for, and I provided, examples LondonReign2 Nov 2014 #163
Look, it's simple. NanceGreggs Nov 2014 #165
Glad you approve of torture AnalystInParadise Nov 2014 #133
Despite your user name ... NanceGreggs Nov 2014 #140
You can respond however you want AnalystInParadise Nov 2014 #147
Like I said ... NanceGreggs Nov 2014 #150
hear hear nt arely staircase Nov 2014 #148
This is what it all comes down to right here LittleBlue Nov 2014 #130
When reports emerged earlier this year that the CIA had spied upon the KingCharlemagne Nov 2014 #6
At least Watergate was perpetrated by Nixon's personal cabal, not the aparatus of the state. nt Nuclear Unicorn Nov 2014 #12
One of the principal charges laid to Nixon, though, was that he used the CIA KingCharlemagne Nov 2014 #13
"The only reason the Republicans haven't made hay over it is... Nuclear Unicorn Nov 2014 #14
I've voted Dem in every election since 1980 (including this past Tuesday), but KingCharlemagne Nov 2014 #15
Exactly....And Read The Nation Article. billhicks76 Nov 2014 #42
Did the Atlantic write the same stuff about Bush when he did the Nay Nov 2014 #7
The Atlantic is a weird bird, too sane to hew to the NeoCon line religiously but KingCharlemagne Nov 2014 #8
Many. Here's my favorite~ "Classify This" RiverLover Nov 2014 #9
Here are 20 more articles under "The George Bush Years" RiverLover Nov 2014 #10
Then I give them a pass. They're consistent! Nay Nov 2014 #11
as are the liberals at du. unlike the fan club Doctor_J Nov 2014 #25
Many did not dare speak up at that time. People were getting booted off of tv for speaking truth. L0oniX Nov 2014 #46
K and R bigwillq Nov 2014 #16
The article title is misleading; this is simply the individual opinion of this author. kwassa Nov 2014 #17
Mahalo kwassa.. Please check out my post if you care to. :) Cha Nov 2014 #20
"Holder's Legacy: Steering Away From the Drug War" and It's not all bad.. but, I understand there Cha Nov 2014 #18
Yeah, Obama and Holder deserve probably a "B" on drug war issues. Comrade Grumpy Nov 2014 #27
I would give them a b+ maybe a- on the drug war arely staircase Nov 2014 #99
Each point made in the OP can be refuted as well as you do on the Holder legacy .... kwassa Nov 2014 #30
Excellent post, Cha... Spazito Nov 2014 #143
I tend to agree. lumberjack_jeff Nov 2014 #19
Fuck the Atlantic mwrguy Nov 2014 #22
It is a complete distortion still_one Nov 2014 #103
I'm thinking that... OilemFirchen Nov 2014 #23
+1!! Cha Nov 2014 #29
Mahola Cha! OilemFirchen Nov 2014 #31
Hey, Sweetie.. It's Mahalo! During the campaign I was always writing.. "Dakato" as in South Dakota! Cha Nov 2014 #34
It's my Ohio accent. OilemFirchen Nov 2014 #39
Have I told you this week that I love you? Number23 Nov 2014 #64
Finally! OilemFirchen Nov 2014 #83
+1 treestar Nov 2014 #85
Exactly... SidDithers Nov 2014 #144
Valid, but I can't imagine a viable candidate who would have done otherwise bhikkhu Nov 2014 #26
Yes, it would take a President with political courage. Maedhros Nov 2014 #35
No, it would take someone with zero courage stevenleser Nov 2014 #45
So we should tolerate government misdeeds to avoid problems. Got it. Scuba Nov 2014 #100
Just as performing surgery in stages ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #107
Huh? So tolerating government misdeeds is actually not tolerating them? WTF? Scuba Nov 2014 #111
That's not what I said ... Read it again ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #119
If that's supposed to be a defense of the President, it's a pretty lame one. Scuba Nov 2014 #123
Lame? Maybe ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #127
Cool story, bro. Scuba Nov 2014 #128
Yep ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #129
+1 ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #104
And then there's Mitt.... defacto7 Nov 2014 #28
If Romney were elected and had done the exact same things, Maedhros Nov 2014 #36
The shrugging and ignoring defacto7 Nov 2014 #49
I stand by my statement. Maedhros Nov 2014 #57
At least defacto7 Nov 2014 #63
"He's better than{fill in the Republican}" . . . markpkessinger Nov 2014 #153
Lol. Good thing assholes like this won't write the history books. nt Ykcutnek Nov 2014 #40
And look at some of the expressions of support from some folks. I said a few days ago stevenleser Nov 2014 #48
Who reads the Atlantic? redstateblues Nov 2014 #47
Better question: OilemFirchen Nov 2014 #53
Looks like a large number of people read The Atlantic, probably because it's a quality publication. Maedhros Nov 2014 #105
That American citizen who was killed "without due process" cheapdate Nov 2014 #50
Mahalo cheapdate..exactly. Conor Friedersdorf looks like an idiot up on his high horse pontificating Cha Nov 2014 #71
Is that the guy whose son got killed too? nt julio_maracas Nov 2014 #74
Yes. The son was in Yemen reportedly looking for his father. cheapdate Nov 2014 #88
If it's so cut and dry, why not have due process? Man from Pickens Nov 2014 #79
Anwar Al Awlaki pushes the argument for due process to the very limit. cheapdate Nov 2014 #91
All of the allegations you claim in your post are unproven and were fed to you by the Pentagon Maedhros Nov 2014 #108
That's consistent, at least. cheapdate Nov 2014 #132
"spied on every American" zappaman Nov 2014 #52
You should see the dossier he has on my four-month-old great-niece. OilemFirchen Nov 2014 #54
Makes Santa and God look like underachievers zappaman Nov 2014 #55
Yep, according to the OP.. Pres Obama is right up there with God and Santa Claus! LOLOLOLOL Cha Nov 2014 #59
Mahalo Cha! zappaman Nov 2014 #60
Rolf.. this sounds like it was written by Edward freakin Snowden. Cha Nov 2014 #58
It looks like he did. Here's ACLU's take on it~ RiverLover Nov 2014 #72
When it comes to that issue, exaggeration is essential treestar Nov 2014 #86
Yes. LondonReign2 Nov 2014 #97
I do hope he meant sarcasm DonCoquixote Nov 2014 #61
I think you misread. grasswire Nov 2014 #68
My response? The things on that list were ecstatic Nov 2014 #65
Attitudes like yours are disgusting. Maedhros Nov 2014 #112
which amendments are you referring to? ecstatic Nov 2014 #154
Misses the mark completely on turd way financial complicity, failure to prosecute war crimes. on point Nov 2014 #66
yes, I noticed that no financial criminals were mentioned. nt grasswire Nov 2014 #67
Totally agree ~nt RiverLover Nov 2014 #73
well, now you'll be getting more of your alternative. Get back to me in a year world wide wally Nov 2014 #69
Conor Friedersdorf. LOL...nt SidDithers Nov 2014 #75
He's not a civil libertarian President Depaysement Nov 2014 #76
They'd be carving his face on mt Rushmore JoePhilly Nov 2014 #78
Killing bin Laden alone would have done the trick... Liberal_Stalwart71 Nov 2014 #92
YUP. JoePhilly Nov 2014 #94
Who needs civil liberties anyway, amirite? Maedhros Nov 2014 #115
Another hit piece and and another group of Dems agree - No wonder the Republicans won the elections liberal N proud Nov 2014 #77
So you're in favor of those actions? Savannahmann Nov 2014 #81
I've found, with almost no deviation, the more one's user name Maedhros Nov 2014 #117
Those same Dems didn't blink an eye regarding the astrocities that Bill Clinton Liberal_Stalwart71 Nov 2014 #93
The author of this piece is an apologist for homophobes if not a homophobe himself.... Bluenorthwest Nov 2014 #82
He is a right wing shrill. Look it up on wiki still_one Nov 2014 #110
7 false overgeneralized accusations treestar Nov 2014 #84
There is no error so monstrous that it fails to find defenders among the ablest men. Lord Acton Tierra_y_Libertad Nov 2014 #87
We are a united oligarchy, not a gridlocked democracy. woo me with science Nov 2014 #90
Excellent, if depressing summary, woo. k&r, nt appal_jack Nov 2014 #124
1: It was written before Election Day Old Nick Nov 2014 #95
Connor friedersdor is a right wing shrill. still_one Nov 2014 #109
Obama lost me when he shoved Romneycare down our throats. grahamhgreen Nov 2014 #102
It would have been better to have nothing right? So children and uninsured got covered, and still_one Nov 2014 #106
First, he could have done it with reconcilliation. Second, Leiberman has a price-tag, obviously, grahamhgreen Nov 2014 #114
First ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #125
You can always express your distaste by foregoing the evil that is the ACA. eom. 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #113
That's not what I said. It was a marginal step forward, thanks to Sen Sanders, but the opportunity grahamhgreen Nov 2014 #121
Now, 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #126
Oh yes, he lost me with the marginal step forward. Why? grahamhgreen Nov 2014 #151
Okay. eom. 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #152
It was much more than a marginal step. Susan Collins, the so-called moderate republican voted still_one Nov 2014 #134
The reason he had the brief window was BECAUSE of the Crapsurance law he passed! grahamhgreen Nov 2014 #168
They weren't going to get that. The blue dogs would NOT have voted for it, and neither would still_one Nov 2014 #169
Then pay him more! Simple math. grahamhgreen Nov 2014 #170
would not have worked, it was more than lieberman. We just disagree that's all still_one Nov 2014 #171
Yes. I firmly believe that anyone who can be bought and sold, can be bought and sold! grahamhgreen Nov 2014 #172
ok still_one Nov 2014 #173
Damned hard to disagree. hifiguy Nov 2014 #116
What does Obama stand for, if not for the items on that list? BlueStreak Nov 2014 #118
" If we weren't going to get any Republican votes, then why not do something that Democrats actually grahamhgreen Nov 2014 #122
Tell us how you really feel..come on, you're holding back... RiverLover Nov 2014 #156
That's the same list the BOG has for why the are in love with Obama. DesMoinesDem Nov 2014 #120
I don't know if you are from Iowa or Wisconsin, but in either case the midterms sure indicated still_one Nov 2014 #137
Mahalo still_one.. some just can't wrap their heads around the fact that the President has Cha Nov 2014 #145
.Mahalo right back at you Cha. Your points are right on still_one Nov 2014 #149
Classic selective evaluation gmb92 Nov 2014 #135
Exactly still_one Nov 2014 #139
Why would anyone give this person, the writer of the opinion, a nanosecond of attention... Spazito Nov 2014 #138
The writer is a right winger. still_one Nov 2014 #155
Yep, a Paulite it seems... Spazito Nov 2014 #157
He admitted freely to his right wing leanings in an interview related on Wiki still_one Nov 2014 #159
Jeez, attack the messenger. He wrote this also "British Liberty is Under Threat" RiverLover Nov 2014 #158
He admits it himself he leans to the right, and votes libertarian. So yes, he is a right winger. still_one Nov 2014 #160
OK ~nt RiverLover Nov 2014 #161
Perhaps my phrasing right winger is a big strong, but leaning to the right, a libertarian, and a still_one Nov 2014 #162
A bit too simplistic Babel_17 Nov 2014 #141
I think it's utterly insane. True Blue Door Nov 2014 #146
The "Seattle Police Department" has Drones easychoice Nov 2014 #164
Sorry, I didn't read the full article Catherine Vincent Nov 2014 #166
kick woo me with science Nov 2014 #167
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