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sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)

28. The person said that the government has the right to punish citizens with 'sin taxes' for

Thu Dec 4, 2014, 01:12 PM

Dec 2014

having the audacity to make personal choices that the government has decided are 'deadly' to them.

I know people who have smoked all their lives and are healthier than many who have never smoked. I know people who grew up in smoke filled homes and have no health issues at all.

I also know people who since childhood, lived on a diet of sugar, coke, fast food, and have diabetes in their 30s.

So where does the government draw the line at 'punishing' citizens who engage in behavior the government has decided is 'deadly'? It would be more accurate to say 'potentially' deadly. But even then, people engage in potentially deadly behaviors all the time. How about Flying, Mountain Climbing, Skate Boarding, Skiiing? All potentially dangerous activities.

How about driving? Driving is deadly, it was deadly to someone very close to me. Should we try to discourage people engaging in that 'deadly' behavior because for some people it has been deadly?

I think the person can speak for themselves btw.

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How much is the tax on one cigarette in NY city? [View all] notadmblnd Dec 2014 OP

$5.85 per pack. Agschmid Dec 2014 #1

Your right not the issue, yeoman6987 Dec 2014 #5

Because they're deadly sharp_stick Dec 2014 #12

Lots of things are deadly to SOME people. Just as cigarettes are deadly to SOME people. sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #14

That's not what the person was saying and you know it. Agschmid Dec 2014 #19

The person said that the government has the right to punish citizens with 'sin taxes' for sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #28

What else is deadly to 450K per year, 55k who choose not to do it, in the US alone? whatthehey Dec 2014 #31

I bet obesity is just as, if not more, deadly joeglow3 Dec 2014 #77

I agree. Cigarettes are deadly to SOME people. My father smoked since he was seven years young. BlueCaliDem Dec 2014 #34

Nice to be lucky sharp_stick Dec 2014 #38

Good post, thank you. I am sorry about your dad though. Not at all surprised at the reaction sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #40

If the government REALLY wanted to prevent people from smoking (or drinking, or whatever) hughee99 Dec 2014 #44

That's all the Drug War was about also, to generate billions, maybe trillions of dollars sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #49

Cigarettes are deadly to sharp_stick Dec 2014 #32

Why were the police there? What was the arrest for? sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #47

It wasn't an arrest sharp_stick Dec 2014 #52

??? I am talking about the murder of Eric Garner. Why were the police there in the first place? sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #58

Ah fuck it sharp_stick Dec 2014 #65

No one I know has died from smoking or from being around smokers. Again with the hyperbole sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #67

I hope your luck holds out sharp_stick Dec 2014 #68

And I've seen firsthand what a car can do a body after someone I loved more than sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #69

Your credibility is shot. Agschmid Dec 2014 #87

What I know is that SOME people are harmed by many things that other people, a majority actually are sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #89

They aren't that intelligent if they are making those choices. Agschmid Dec 2014 #95

That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. But that's all it is, one person's judgemental sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #109

I engage in all kinds of risky behavior everyday... Agschmid Dec 2014 #112

And who said there is 'NO RISK' for those who smoke? A correction was made to the claim sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #113

You win. Agschmid Dec 2014 #116

Thank you. I've read your replies and agree that the gov't isn't all snappyturtle Dec 2014 #101

they also encourage smuggling. Travis_0004 Dec 2014 #33

Sure they do sharp_stick Dec 2014 #36

So deadly 1/2 of NYC cig sales are now rum-runs. Eleanors38 Dec 2014 #104

Why were police interested in this? Who sent them out to arrest someone for, allegedly, he denied sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #11

You got all that out of my post? Agschmid Dec 2014 #17

Yes, it is racism. The racist Drug War has allowed racist cops to target, disproportionately, sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #37

So less than 30 cents per ciggie. KamaAina Dec 2014 #114

When Mr Garner bought the pack, HE paid the tax SoCalDem Dec 2014 #2

That would have been my next question notadmblnd Dec 2014 #6

The city is so dumb! yeoman6987 Dec 2014 #23

I hope they do too notadmblnd Dec 2014 #25

Over 50% of ciggerettes in NYC do not have the tax paid Travis_0004 Dec 2014 #43

Yep, even said in my post someone would be here to claim this. notadmblnd Dec 2014 #46

Link to pages that back up those assertions please. nt stevenleser Dec 2014 #75

Google it. Jesus Malverde Dec 2014 #82

So you would willfully evade paying taxes? philosslayer Dec 2014 #80

yes Travis_0004 Dec 2014 #83

^^^FTW^^^ moondust Dec 2014 #18

Do we know that for sure? aikoaiko Dec 2014 #20

Indian Reservations in NYS lost their battle regarding taxes after decades of fighting sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #53

In 2008 Jesus Malverde Dec 2014 #100

How about they tax SUGAR products? I know, the Sugar lobbies have spent millions trying to sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #103

+1...nt Jesus Malverde Dec 2014 #105

I read somewhere on here yesterday that he was buying them in Virginia where taaxes are lower. arcane1 Dec 2014 #78

aha.. I thought so.. He was SoCalDem Dec 2014 #79

Don't take my word for it, I've been unable to find the link! :) arcane1 Dec 2014 #81

Nothing surprises me.. Every time something happens, SoCalDem Dec 2014 #84

"He'd have gotten a free ride" arcane1 Dec 2014 #86

I think it's fair to say the people are being taxed to death. nt Nuclear Unicorn Dec 2014 #3

No, pun intended. notadmblnd Dec 2014 #7

Taxes pay for services you know. HERVEPA Dec 2014 #29

Yeah. Where would we be if we didn't have taxes to pay for -- Nuclear Unicorn Dec 2014 #56

As I'm sure you know, that's still a very tiny percentages of what taxes pay for. HERVEPA Dec 2014 #57

And the cigarette tax is a very tiny percentage of tax revenue. Yet, it seems to have killed a man. Nuclear Unicorn Dec 2014 #62

Jesus H. Christ. The tax didn't kill anybody. The cop did. Disgusting and ridiculous post. HERVEPA Dec 2014 #63

I should be ashamed for wanting a tax reduced or abolished because Nuclear Unicorn Dec 2014 #70

Wrong. I detest the drug war. I believe the substances should be legal and taxed. HERVEPA Dec 2014 #72

"I believe the substances should be legal and taxed." Nuclear Unicorn Dec 2014 #76

Ha Ha Ha Ha sharp_stick Dec 2014 #66

You must be a another fan of the drug war. Nuclear Unicorn Dec 2014 #71

29 cents....? spanone Dec 2014 #4

Wow, just wow notadmblnd Dec 2014 #8

Fuck Rand Paul. FSogol Dec 2014 #9

What does Rand Paul have to do with the murder of a citizen for, allegedly, selling a few cigarettes sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #13

Rand Paul was promoting the idea last night that if NYC taxes were lower, then FSogol Dec 2014 #15

Did it ever occur to you that Rand Paul might be simply repeating what millions of people sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #22

"I sure hope you are not claiming to represent Liberals by condoning yet another WAR ON" FSogol Dec 2014 #27

If that is your goal, to end racism, then you don't give the cops yet another reason to sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #30

I gave the cops permission? Me? FSogol Dec 2014 #35

I'm glad Rand Paul is seeing the light on this, thanks to all the Liberals who opposed sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #54

How does we know if Eric Garner added the tax on yeoman6987 Dec 2014 #26

FYI: In NYC most strangers "bumming a cig" there days offer to pay for them, was 50, now often 1$. bettyellen Dec 2014 #10

My wife remembers that from 40 years ago in NYC TexasProgresive Dec 2014 #21

I remember being very surprised myself as a kid, so I thought I would mention it. There are also bettyellen Dec 2014 #59

I haven't followed the case much until recently Mosby Dec 2014 #90

Wow, I wonder if that applies here. Interesting. bettyellen Dec 2014 #91

I remember Liquor stores in CA selling them in the not to distant past. Live and Learn Dec 2014 #98

1 human life apparently Glassunion Dec 2014 #16

It's difficult not to lapse into a sense of hopelessness notadmblnd Dec 2014 #24

We're blaming taxes instead of cops? JaneyVee Dec 2014 #39

People like Rand Paul seem to be notadmblnd Dec 2014 #41

The party of "personal responsibility". JaneyVee Dec 2014 #45

it's not about the fucking cigarette notadmblnd Dec 2014 #50

what if he was selling bottled water ? olddots Dec 2014 #42

I agree gollygee Dec 2014 #48

He had over 30 arrests Travis_0004 Dec 2014 #55

He might very well have been doing something illegal gollygee Dec 2014 #61

The cigarettes are just the excuse Man from Pickens Dec 2014 #102

If he was white, he could strip down to his whitey tighteys, play guitar and become rich for adirondacker Dec 2014 #64

Think you'd actually have to be rich and not black for that to occur. nt Live and Learn Dec 2014 #97

For petty little chit that shouldn't even be illegal let alone more than an infraction. Live and Learn Dec 2014 #96

More than the value of Mr. Garner's life NoJusticeNoPeace Dec 2014 #51

who cares,....what NYC sets its tax rate. shallwechat Dec 2014 #60

A % of the sale price........nt CK_John Dec 2014 #73

You're right. Excessive taxation has created a black market LittleBlue Dec 2014 #74

What always cracks me up is that they put sin taxes on something SoCalDem Dec 2014 #85

how much is wholesale price of cigs (without tax)? quadrature Dec 2014 #88

in az a carton of malboros is $60.25 at costco. Mosby Dec 2014 #92

that is the retail price. a pack costs 25 cents to make... quadrature Dec 2014 #93

no that's a wholesale price. Mosby Dec 2014 #94

I think it was partially about the cigarettes. nilesobek Dec 2014 #99

This is a War On Drugs death, no different from... Eleanors38 Dec 2014 #106

WHO CARES? That's not the issue here, even though RWers are trying to make it so. Avalux Dec 2014 #107

SMH, along with a heavy sigh notadmblnd Dec 2014 #108

I never called you a troll, I wasn't thinking that at all. Avalux Dec 2014 #110

Thank you for that reply notadmblnd Dec 2014 #111

Many NYC bodegas (neighborhood markets) sell "loosies" KamaAina Dec 2014 #115