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In reply to the discussion: If Democratic candidates ran on progressive ideas on a consistent basis... [View all]MADem
(135,425 posts)23. From one of the sources on your very list, there.... (uh oh...)
It's not a myth. It's apparently a pricey methodology:
That October, Mountaineer began a pioneering experiment in carbon capture. Powell oversaw it. His father had worked for three decades at a coal-fired power plant in Virginia; Powell himself had spent his career at Mountaineer. The job was simple, he said: We burn coal, make steam, and run turbines. During the experiment, though, it got a bit more complicated. AEP attached a chemical plant to the back of its power plant. It chilled about 1.5 percent of Mountaineers smoke and diverted it through a solution of ammonium carbonate, which absorbed the CO₂. The CO₂ was then drastically compressed and injected into a porous sandstone formation more than a mile below the banks of the Ohio.
The system worked. Over the next two years AEP captured and stored more than 37,000 metric tons of pure carbon dioxide. The CO₂ is still underground, not in the atmosphere. It was only a quarter of one percent of the gas coming out the stack, but that was supposed to be just the beginning. AEP planned to scale up the project to capture a quarter of the plants emissions, or 1.5 million tons of CO₂ a year. The company had agreed to invest $334 million, and the U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) had agreed to match that. But the deal depended on AEP being able to recoup its investment. And after climate change legislation collapsed in the Senate, state utility regulators told the company that it could not charge its customers for a technology not yet required by law.
In the spring of 2011 AEP ended the project. The maze of pipes and pumps and tanks was dismantled. Though small, the Mountaineer system had been the worlds first to capture and store carbon dioxide directly from a coal-fired electric plant, and it had attracted hundreds of curious visitors from around the world, including China and India. The process did work, and we educated a lot of people, said Powell. But geez-oh-whizits going to take another breakthrough to make it worth our while. A regulatory breakthrough above allsuch as the one Obama promised last summerbut technical ones would help too.
Capturing carbon dioxide and storing or sequestering it underground in porous rock formations sounds to its critics like a techno-fix fantasy. But DOE has spent some $6.5 billion over the past three decades researching and testing the technology. And for more than four decades the oil industry has been injecting compressed carbon dioxide into depleted oil fields, using it to coax trapped oil to the surface. On the Canadian Great Plains this practice has been turned into one of the worlds largest underground carbon-storage operations.....
http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2014/04/coal/nijhuis-text
Another of the sources in your list is the American Coal Council--you can have a look there, yourself. They say clean coal is NOT a myth.
And someone better tell the DOE (also on your list): http://www.fe.doe.gov/education/energylessons/coal/coal_cct2.html
You probably want to read the cites before you hand over a blanket google.
I don't disagree that "clean" coal isn't entirely clean, but there are ways to make it "cleaner" like capturing methods and sulphur washing and things like that. The real question is this, over the long term--do people want to invest in those technologies, which are expensive, or just get off their asses and transition to solar and wind and even wave technology? I'm in favor of the latter, but I am not from KY, either, and I understand that all politics is local.
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If Democratic candidates ran on progressive ideas on a consistent basis... [View all]
Yavin4
Dec 2014
OP
Exactly! Far too many democratic politicians are gutless and try to be more rightward than the
RKP5637
Dec 2014
#1
+1!!! We have to change our tactics! We have to focus solely on the root problem instead of
Dustlawyer
Dec 2014
#28
I totally agree that it's a systemic problem, and that we need publicly funded elections
RufusTFirefly
Dec 2014
#30
Don't get me wrong, I am not dismissing OWS, I just believe that we need a singleminded purpose
Dustlawyer
Dec 2014
#37
Yep, so right about who writes their checks. And, we have citizens united! It's a cruel joke on
RKP5637
Dec 2014
#33
Unfortunately, you will never hear this from mainstream sources. Ergo, it isn't true.
RufusTFirefly
Dec 2014
#36
Much like the good Germans were during WWII who ignored what was going on in their country until
RKP5637
Dec 2014
#41
Yep, the 'boiling frog' syndrome and it's been going on in this country for some time now, just
RKP5637
Dec 2014
#50
It is, in fact, not much of a democracy exists today. We go through the motions of a democracy, but
RKP5637
Dec 2014
#34
"I think most Americans don't believe that the Dems are any different from the Repubs...
liberal_at_heart
Dec 2014
#7
She boxed herself into a place where she managed to be less genuine than McTurtle and
TheKentuckian
Dec 2014
#9
Those states weren't "red" in the seventies. Red states are controlled by the GOP.
MADem
Dec 2014
#29
That's the second time, at least, in this thread where you've mischaracterized my
MADem
Dec 2014
#87
I'm not saying that at all. Stop putting words in my mouth -- you ALWAYS get it wrong.
MADem
Dec 2014
#120
I do nothing of the sort. If you can't respond to debate with anything besides personal
MADem
Dec 2014
#116
Never said it should be a nationwide strategy. I advocated a state by state strategy
joeglow3
Dec 2014
#102
You seriously think that's a winning strategy? To diss the industry that puts food on
MADem
Dec 2014
#11
You're citing the American Coal Council as a legitimate source??? Bwahahaha!!!! n/t
RufusTFirefly
Dec 2014
#24
You're not bothering to read what I wrote, OR even following the thread? Bwahahahahaha!!!!!!!
MADem
Dec 2014
#31
You clearly didn't comprehend them too well if you didn't take the obvious point I was making.
MADem
Dec 2014
#38
No, no, no--that's not how it rolls. It's not my job to peck through the shit looking for corn.
MADem
Dec 2014
#47
Why don't you try reading a conversation in FULL context, instead of jumping in with a
MADem
Dec 2014
#109
Opportunist my ass. And what a mischaracterization of my views, too. I live in the real world.
MADem
Dec 2014
#86
Neither am I--but you persist in characterizing me in that fashion to be rude and disruptive.
MADem
Dec 2014
#117
No one is "telling" you anything--you just can't hold up your side in debate, so instead of arguing
MADem
Dec 2014
#128
No, I am not, but that sounded a bit like a put-down...I am a practical thinker who thinks that it
MADem
Dec 2014
#130
No, she ran away from Obama, and she was insincere. It had nothing to do with "Bill and Hillary and
MADem
Dec 2014
#52
Yeah, right--I'll provide those just as soon as you provide all of your links to back up the
MADem
Dec 2014
#63
You jumped in at post 25, and if you want links, you've got to provide yours first.
MADem
Dec 2014
#70
Well, come up with that link, why don't you? Did she use that Wall Street money to pay Warren's
MADem
Dec 2014
#68
That would make us a "four corners" regional party and lock us out of the White House
Recursion
Dec 2014
#39
not all 18-22 year olds want the same thing, if you go by state, voting patterns are not
JI7
Dec 2014
#42
did any Candidate win California running on Defense Cuts when that was a big part of the state
JI7
Dec 2014
#44
i don't view politics as a religion, it's why i can still say FDR was a good president even though
JI7
Dec 2014
#82
so do you think FDR should not be seen as a positive part of the democratic Party ?
JI7
Dec 2014
#85
Lots of folks here seem to confuse the way they wish things would be with how they are
stevenleser
Dec 2014
#92
Because the Clinton experiment in triangulation has worked out well for democrats?
Exultant Democracy
Dec 2014
#101
LOL. Only if you confuse buzzwords with arguments and forget several important facts
stevenleser
Dec 2014
#104
There have only been two good election cycles for democrats since Clinton got into office,
Exultant Democracy
Dec 2014
#107
Why would someone today in KY who works in the coal industry vote for someone who ran against big
still_one
Dec 2014
#105
I doubt running against coal would have helped Grimes but it would have been interesting to
hrmjustin
Dec 2014
#126