General Discussion

MADem

(135,425 posts)

143. Pardon me--Department of Justice.

Thu Dec 11, 2014, 11:58 PM

Dec 2014

The AG is independent from the POTUS in matters of prosecution and does not bow to him. He doesn't work "for" Obama, any more than Janet Reno "worked for" Bill Clinton when it came to matters of prosecution. Clinton couldn't tell Reno "Don't look into anything I've done." That's not how it works.

You seem to forget a guy named Nixon who told a guy named Richardson to fire a guy named Cox. Richardson told him fuck no and resigned. A cretin named Bork finally went and did it...and thus the term "Borked" came into popular usage when Bork wanted to fulfill his nasty little dream of becoming a member of the Supreme Court.

And remember when Alberto Gonzales tried to game the system and dump all those pesky states' attorneys? http://www.salon.com/2007/02/09/united_states_attorneys/

Why do you think it will go over any better if Obama tries to tell the AG what to do? He can't "tell" Holder (or Holder's replacement) to prosecute anymore than he can "tell" Holder's replacement to NOT prosecute. The AG has to go where the evidence takes him--or her--not where Obama tells him to go.

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Some folks seem more OK with the defense of torture and torturers, [View all] MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 OP

Post removed Post removed Dec 2014 #1

Better delete or change that or they will alert on you. (I told ya) L0oniX Dec 2014 #5

Truth hurts, I suppose. morningfog Dec 2014 #7

It has gotten bad. MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #9

I don't approve of that hide. 840high Dec 2014 #97

Neither do I ...I just knew it would happen because...(explanation hidden by jacked jury decision) L0oniX Dec 2014 #118

I know who "they" are. 840high Dec 2014 #182

neither do I nt grasswire Dec 2014 #173

+1 Scuba Dec 2014 #199

Neither do I. Is DU still a discussion forum? Owl Dec 2014 #211

This message was self-deleted by its author 1000words Dec 2014 #16

Are you seriously comparing Obama's role in this to Bush's? KamaAina Dec 2014 #41

To some not prosecuting the criminals means you are the same as the criminals...logical fails are Fred Sanders Dec 2014 #51

Do you not understand the concept of Accessory After the Fact? 99Forever Dec 2014 #54

I do, and clearly you do not...accessory after the fact....funny. Fred Sanders Dec 2014 #55

You understand jack. 99Forever Dec 2014 #65

Amen. 840high Dec 2014 #208

Not to mention, appointing a collaborator, Brennan, to head the CIA sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #209

Do you realize that when a serious crime is discovered nilesobek Dec 2014 #142

It's what he does, it's his thing... SidDithers Dec 2014 #64

You better believe it! zappaman Dec 2014 #67

The irony of your post is LOL. Odin2005 Dec 2014 #121

... SidDithers Dec 2014 #128

... Odin2005 Dec 2014 #131

... SidDithers Dec 2014 #133

You win the Internet! MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #146

... sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #155

Thanks! I was just going to go with "... :rofl:", but thought that Sid would... Odin2005 Dec 2014 #206

Same thing. 840high Dec 2014 #98

The banality of evil. [n/t] Maedhros Dec 2014 #135

What kind of person..? kentuck Dec 2014 #2

"Folks". L0oniX Dec 2014 #4

heh. SammyWinstonJack Dec 2014 #76

According to a fairly recent poll, a majority of Americans support the use of torture. Maedhros Dec 2014 #136

Whatever else it is, this is a graphic illustration of the concept KingCharlemagne Dec 2014 #161

Partisanship is evident in that poll. Registered voters! I would like sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #210

If they are in the Dem party then I am ashamed of them. Disgusting! L0oniX Dec 2014 #3

We live in a propaganda state now. woo me with science Dec 2014 #6

I'd post my Gobbels award meme but it already got me a hide once. L0oniX Dec 2014 #8

Who the fuck here is defending torturers, for fuck sake. LawDeeDah Dec 2014 #10

Folks are defending the defenders of torture MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #12

Got a new word du jour, Manny? I can't wait until ... 11 Bravo Dec 2014 #21

Total Bull Andy823 Dec 2014 #29

We know have official acknowledgement that War Crimes were committed by sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #56

Prosecute them all Andy823 Dec 2014 #104

is Obama seeking investigations and prosecutions? Scootaloo Dec 2014 #59

You got alerted on for this comment. nt Erich Bloodaxe BSN Dec 2014 #37

What "DU folks" are defending torture? zappaman Dec 2014 #49

Lol~ sheshe2 Dec 2014 #115

Oh, I know the act by now. zappaman Dec 2014 #124

I got a hide because one juror didn't think I fetched a link fast enough, LOL! bettyellen Dec 2014 #157

You're DU famous! zappaman Dec 2014 #163

I want to front the band now! So... bettyellen Dec 2014 #165

Yeah yeah yeah zappaman Dec 2014 #169

My hair is even better, my follicles ARE the eighties! bettyellen Dec 2014 #170

Objectification. MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #176

Someone else expressed interest in the jury results on this comment, so Erich Bloodaxe BSN Dec 2014 #200

Just viewed another thread where a DUer actually posted, "We've been torturing since the dawn of the Doctor_J Dec 2014 #52

That person doesn't know his/her history truebluegreen Dec 2014 #77

Thank you for that quote. Just read it the other day and wondered what sabrina 1 Dec 2014 #156

As I recall from my study of the Revolution truebluegreen Dec 2014 #202

This message was self-deleted by its author 1000words Dec 2014 #11

Snowden comes to mind. nt sheshe2 Dec 2014 #110

and boom goes the dynamite...nt SidDithers Dec 2014 #129

;) sheshe2 Dec 2014 #132

+ a gazillion Spazito Dec 2014 #186

Look at who is saying it, no surprise at all. Rex Dec 2014 #13

Who is defending torture, Rex? Have you alerted on these posts? nt msanthrope Dec 2014 #26

Where did I mention DUers in my post? Rex Dec 2014 #27

What Manny posted above Andy823 Dec 2014 #33

I've seen one person on DU give excuses for why we tortured people. Rex Dec 2014 #38

I understand why it happened helpmetohelpyou Dec 2014 #45

But do you condone torture? That is the question. Rex Dec 2014 #48

No I don't condone it but I can see where it could be used under some helpmetohelpyou Dec 2014 #62

Such as? Rex Dec 2014 #66

I know in most cases it has proved to be unreliable helpmetohelpyou Dec 2014 #72

No, just in what scenario would it be okay to torture someone. Rex Dec 2014 #78

I don't have any children but I can see my self pretty helpmetohelpyou Dec 2014 #82

12 years one man was tortured daily marym625 Dec 2014 #94

I could never understand why they tortured in the first place. They know it doesn't work Rex Dec 2014 #107

If you aren't talking about DUers...then who? I mean, if malaise were to write that msanthrope Dec 2014 #34

Well the OP didn't state that he was talking about DU, not all of us are on a witch Rex Dec 2014 #42

Come on Rex, you know it is implied. sheshe2 Dec 2014 #86

Implied or expected? I just read his OP and had a thought, don't make that into a crime. Rex Dec 2014 #91

It was right here... zappaman Dec 2014 #96

My fault I should have read the replies before posting. Rex Dec 2014 #101

I was angry with you before so I didn't reply.....I'm glad you read thread and edits. nt msanthrope Dec 2014 #150

You know something Rex? sheshe2 Dec 2014 #103

Thanks. Rex Dec 2014 #105

... sheshe2 Dec 2014 #106

Always. Rex Dec 2014 #108

Yep, it's all the usual suspects. Odin2005 Dec 2014 #123

Folks with a limited capacity for morality as well as empathy Dragonfli Dec 2014 #14

Imagine a repuke POTUS using the term "Folks"...they'd have to put DU in Defcon 1 mode. L0oniX Dec 2014 #15

+1000000 liberal_at_heart Dec 2014 #17

Yes, indeed. hifiguy Dec 2014 #31

Only an enemy of the Dem party would say things that inspire Dems to not vote. L0oniX Dec 2014 #43

or a racist Doctor_J Dec 2014 #50

I believe DU has been infiltrated by enemies ...and not just recently. L0oniX Dec 2014 #53

I believe DU has been infiltrated by unicorns...and not just recently. zappaman Dec 2014 #63

I could not agree with you more yet, sheshe2 Dec 2014 #181

So this is how the Republic dies, to glorious applause. Odin2005 Dec 2014 #125

"What sort of government have hifiguy Dec 2014 #139

bu$h used the term "folks" Art_from_Ark Dec 2014 #32

I believe the word "Folks" was also used on Hee Haw and the Beverly Hillbilly's. L0oniX Dec 2014 #47

So now using the word 'folks' is really supporting torture (in soup brain code language). LawDeeDah Dec 2014 #71

WTF? LMFAO L0oniX Dec 2014 #84

the folksy use of "folks" is a snake-oil technique bbgrunt Dec 2014 #87

good griefy great green gobs of greasy grimey gopher guts. LawDeeDah Dec 2014 #90

so now Obama is a snakeoil salesman? sheshe2 Dec 2014 #112

and that makes Obama Just like Boosh! He uses some same words! LawDeeDah Dec 2014 #85

Some folks belong at Discussionist. LawDeeDah Dec 2014 #18

It's the Circling the Wagons syndrome Aerows Dec 2014 #19

This message was self-deleted by its author 1000words Dec 2014 #20

And then there's "I SHOOT." 11 Bravo Dec 2014 #22

I think Manny should tell us who these DUers are. They deserve to have their msanthrope Dec 2014 #25

I just got through reading about this in three international newspapers. Everyone is talking Number23 Dec 2014 #114

*gasp! You said 'folks'! LawDeeDah Dec 2014 #126

And you my dear Number23 just nailed it. sheshe2 Dec 2014 #130

You could write a book about the belittling of Obama. joshcryer Dec 2014 #134

Not a book, maybe, but an article from yesterday. greatauntoftriplets Dec 2014 #203

Good article. joshcryer Dec 2014 #205

You Better Believe It! nt msanthrope Dec 2014 #151

Well said! Spazito Dec 2014 #189

Spaz, I don't know why I expected differently here. This place is GONE and has been forever Number23 Dec 2014 #193

I cannot believe how low some will go to try and smear President Obama... Spazito Dec 2014 #194

If the Foo shits.. nt truebluegreen Dec 2014 #79

+100 n/t zappaman Dec 2014 #80

LOL. That shouldn't make me laugh, but yes it did. LawDeeDah Dec 2014 #122

+100000000 woo me with science Dec 2014 #23

P.E.S.A.A.C. sheshe2 Dec 2014 #113

Show us Andy823 Dec 2014 #36

They can't do anything when they are in the majority because of the Blue Dog/Conservative/3rd Way stillwaiting Dec 2014 #58

Prosecutions for war crimes are not a legislative action Scootaloo Dec 2014 #61

They aren't an EXECUTIVE action, either. MADem Dec 2014 #137

"The Judicial Branch doesn't bow to the POTUS." Scootaloo Dec 2014 #140

Pardon me--Department of Justice. MADem Dec 2014 #143

No. MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #144

Sorry, you're wrong. From your very own cite: MADem Dec 2014 #147

So Obama didn't order Holder to stop defending Doma? nt MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #148

I am surprised that a Nixon aficionado (given your avatar, and your prior posts on Nixon) does not msanthrope Dec 2014 #158

Nixon afficianado MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #164

Well, shit....I'm just looking at your avatar, and like any good DUer can, they can google your msanthrope Dec 2014 #167

Heheh... MADem Dec 2014 #187

Many thanks! I like History! nt msanthrope Dec 2014 #196

It likes you, too-you're quite skilled at it! MADem Dec 2014 #197

Class dismissed. Bobbie Jo Dec 2014 #166

I know they teach civics at Cornell. I know they do. nt msanthrope Dec 2014 #168

So this isn't true: MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #174

I am stunned that a person of your education would conflate the terms "ordered" and "concluded." nt msanthrope Dec 2014 #175

In this instance, what is the functional difference? nt MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #177

Manny, can you name the vehicle by which the President orders the AG to do something? msanthrope Dec 2014 #180

So I guess your functional answer is "no difference, Manny" MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #183

No, Manny...my answer is exactly as I wrote....since you insist you are correct, kindly msanthrope Dec 2014 #195

He told them that the government had no "defense" save a few Republicans saying "Ewwww." MADem Dec 2014 #185

The AG is independent of the White House, you need a link? Miss civics classes also? Fred Sanders Dec 2014 #207

Please name them. Come on now...if there are DUers doing such an atrocity...then name them! msanthrope Dec 2014 #24

yes, they should be alerted JI7 Dec 2014 #28

Absolutely!!! nt msanthrope Dec 2014 #30

He can't Andy823 Dec 2014 #39

+1 JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #40

I think you mean ... JoePhilly Dec 2014 #44

Allow me. Doctor_J Dec 2014 #57

How is that defending torture? zappaman Dec 2014 #60

Not only did you only express one tiny sentiment from that post Number23 Dec 2014 #152

He demanded links from posters last night... sheshe2 Dec 2014 #149

Who the you talkin bout now Manny? BootinUp Dec 2014 #35

This message was self-deleted by its author Corruption Inc Dec 2014 #46

... SidDithers Dec 2014 #68

Where are these people claiming to be Democrats who are so blatantly making excuses for war? zappaman Dec 2014 #69

yep, that's exactly what all the "BHO didn't call torturers Patriots!!!" BS stupidicus Dec 2014 #70

It's a complete joke RedCappedBandit Dec 2014 #73

Shark jumping time. Jesus Malverde Dec 2014 #74

Maybe it's time for a new persona to go with the always hilarious "Third Way Manny"? zappaman Dec 2014 #75

Really Manny? sheshe2 Dec 2014 #81

And some folks are more than OK ... NanceGreggs Dec 2014 #83

"Et fuckin' cetera." sheshe2 Dec 2014 #88

So what you are saying is that we have people here that don't agree with each other. Rex Dec 2014 #92

It would be a pretty dull place ... NanceGreggs Dec 2014 #99

Well we have sub-groups for echo chambers, but you are so right. Rex Dec 2014 #111

+1,000 !!!! nt MADem Dec 2014 #138

Well said! zappaman Dec 2014 #93

How does one 'disagree' with people against torture? leftstreet Dec 2014 #95

It's not a matter of disagreement on torture ... NanceGreggs Dec 2014 #100

That's what you said it was leftstreet Dec 2014 #109

You're right. NanceGreggs Dec 2014 #116

A fucking men, Nance. And it will probably get you a hide, but I applaud you for saying it! bettyellen Dec 2014 #162

Oh, I'm getting used to the "hides". NanceGreggs Dec 2014 #178

OMG- juror #1 hates me too! *high five* bettyellen Dec 2014 #179

... NanceGreggs Dec 2014 #191

Some folks have never seen a Benghazi they didn't pile on. ucrdem Dec 2014 #89

NAME NAMES MANNY! snooper2 Dec 2014 #102

Yes it is disgusting to see people defend torture. hrmjustin Dec 2014 #117

People are in denial. They don't want to admnit that the man they adore and voted for twice... Odin2005 Dec 2014 #119

He does? zappaman Dec 2014 #120

He thought torture was so okay, he stopped it 2 days into his Presidency with an EO. LawDeeDah Dec 2014 #127

And "extraordinary rendition"? MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #145

Obama fooled us all by ending torture!! Bwaaaah! He's the saaaaame! bettyellen Dec 2014 #160

Post removed Post removed Dec 2014 #153

Seriously? We are in denial? sheshe2 Dec 2014 #154

What a load. nt Bobbie Jo Dec 2014 #141

You dumped another load on DU Manny. sheshe2 Dec 2014 #159

I suck. MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #184

True that~ sheshe2 Dec 2014 #188

No. MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #190

*SPLAT* bettyellen Dec 2014 #171

Manny Manny Manny. Autumn Dec 2014 #172

Do I get my spanking now? MannyGoldstein Dec 2014 #192

Manny I'm gonna talk to your wife and see if we can hook you up with a couple of Autumn Dec 2014 #204

and then when you ask if torturers should be prosecuted grahamhgreen Dec 2014 #198

Or say they should be pardoned instead. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Dec 2014 #201