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Moonwalk

(2,322 posts)

69. Actually he's not of David's line and not the Messiah given the virgin birth....

Sat Dec 27, 2014, 01:31 AM

Dec 2014

According to New Testament, Joseph is of David's lineage, which should make Jesus of David's line; but NT says he's not Joseph's son, so it's kind of a moot point.

Of course, god is king of kings, and that make Jesus prince of princes, so not merely royal but super royal. He can't, however, also be the messiah. I mean, I know the aim is to have it both ways, but the messiah has to be of David's line and there's no way for that to be possible if Jesus was immaculately conceived and born of a virgin. Such linage is father to son, not mother to child. So, either he's Joseph's son and royal that way—also the potential messiah--or he's the son of god, and therefore not of David's line and so not the messiah according to the old testament requirements.

He can be a god an savior, but not the messiah prophesied in the book of Daniel.

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Whoa... X-Posted From DU Religion Group... 'Jesus Wasn�t Born Rich. Think About It.' - DailyBeast [View all] WillyT Dec 2014 OP

It is also inaccurate. Warren Stupidity Dec 2014 #1

Being a distant descendant of a king in Biblical times was no guaranty of wealth. merrily Dec 2014 #3

I didn't say they were wealthy. Warren Stupidity Dec 2014 #4

I didn't say you said that. merrily Dec 2014 #5

I don't think we are disagreeing. Warren Stupidity Dec 2014 #6

I never said we were disagreeing either. merrily Dec 2014 #7

Yeah, except that given the habits of male royals through the millennia Warpy Dec 2014 #42

You were the one who brought up the alleged significance of his descent from King David, first as merrily Dec 2014 #46

Uh, you're barking up the wrong poster, Slick Warpy Dec 2014 #56

Obviously, I assumed that Warren was continuing our conversation and did not even merrily Dec 2014 #68

Actually he's not of David's line and not the Messiah given the virgin birth.... Moonwalk Dec 2014 #69

Yep. And Jews trace lineage through the Mom, not the father (or putative father). merrily Dec 2014 #81

Can you cite a Biblical verse that says Joseph and Mary were penniless? merrily Dec 2014 #2

Manger... Such A Nice Word For A Barn... And A Word Most Of Us Would Not Have Heard Of... WillyT Dec 2014 #12

A manger is not a barn. merrily Dec 2014 #13

A Distinction... Without A Differencet ??? - Please...Do Explain... WillyT Dec 2014 #15

A barn houses animals. A manger is where the food for animals is placed. We might say "trough." merrily Dec 2014 #18

How Far Is It From The Barn ??? WillyT Dec 2014 #21

You said manger is such a nice word for a barn. It's not. (BTW, you're welcome for the right info.) merrily Dec 2014 #25

Is A Manger... Part Of The Barn... Or A Seperate Stucture ??? WillyT Dec 2014 #27

You've simply repeated yourself without answering my question. merrily Dec 2014 #29

Manger: WillyT Dec 2014 #30

Yes, you've now proved that, as I said, "manger" is not a nice word for a barn. merrily Dec 2014 #75

There are many "socialist" statements in the Bible daredtowork Dec 2014 #8

But if you have slaves you can still keep them, right? brooklynite Dec 2014 #10

Slaves were released every Jubilee year in the OT daredtowork Dec 2014 #11

Not always, and definitely not the gentile slaves brooklynite Dec 2014 #14

Not sure why you are obsessing over the Old Testament daredtowork Dec 2014 #24

Not sure, either, especially since Jesus birth is the subject of the OP, not the OT. merrily Dec 2014 #59

Obsessing? brooklynite Dec 2014 #60

Please see Reply 31. merrily Dec 2014 #83

Context matters, both the written word and the context of a few thousand years B.C. merrily Dec 2014 #31

Ah yes, context... brooklynite Dec 2014 #57

All agree the Bible contains some nasty stuff and some inconsistent stuff. My prior post also merrily Dec 2014 #58

My point is the reference to "socialist statements" brooklynite Dec 2014 #61

"Be nice to the poor: doesn't equate to "give everything you own away," either. merrily Dec 2014 #62

If we're talking context then remember that god has innocent Canaanites murdered, their land stolen... Moonwalk Dec 2014 #74

And that relates to whether the Bible says Joseph was poor when Jesus was born how? merrily Dec 2014 #79

There's a lot of condemnation of greed, self-centeredness and heartlessness in the Bible. merrily Dec 2014 #16

But if you call it socialism, then you get to call some self-righteous bigots daredtowork Dec 2014 #26

The same Jesus who said great things about helping the poor also said some stuff merrily Dec 2014 #28

He did...but take what Jesus "said" with a grain of salt. daredtowork Dec 2014 #32

Now you moved the goalpost to an entirely different discussion. merrily Dec 2014 #35

What was the goal? I was celebrating the "socialist" aspects of the Bible daredtowork Dec 2014 #37

Indeed, what was the goal? merrily Dec 2014 #40

haha, okay I apologize, I misunderstood daredtowork Dec 2014 #41

Yes, I've had that discussion before. However, if you are posting on a thread talking about merrily Dec 2014 #44

Very good point daredtowork Dec 2014 #47

Joseph? Yes. (The OP is talking about the alleged finances of the family when Jesus was born.) merrily Dec 2014 #48

Jesus had skills, too, I thought. daredtowork Dec 2014 #50

Jesus was also a carpenter. (I don't know that the Bible talks of apprenticeship as such. I assume merrily Dec 2014 #52

That's What You Got ??? - You May Have Read The OP... But... WillyT Dec 2014 #64

I've read the Bible cover to cover several times. (Have you?) As to matters about Joseph and Mary, merrily Dec 2014 #65

Yeah... I Have... The Bible As Literature... A Couple Of Times... WillyT Dec 2014 #70

Do you think changing the subject will make you any "righter" about whether Joseph merrily Dec 2014 #71

Because... As The Bishop Says... The King Of Kings Was Born In A Barn... WillyT Dec 2014 #72

PS My replying to a specific post to me does not mean my reply equals all I got from the OP. merrily Dec 2014 #67

AS I recall, Jesus got a tidy chest of gold a few days later... brooklynite Dec 2014 #9

What ??? - Joseph And Mary Were Broke... But Once Jesus Was Born It Was All Null And Void ??? WillyT Dec 2014 #19

Unless you can cite a biblical verse to show that Joseph and Mary were broke, you merrily Dec 2014 #33

You Tell Me... WillyT Dec 2014 #39

No, I asked you first. As for Robinson, I can't help what he says. Does he claim infalliblility? merrily Dec 2014 #43

Well merrily... You Bring Up Provacative Points... But I'm Gonna Go With The Bishop On This One... WillyT Dec 2014 #51

Going with the Bishop on Joseph, as opposed to going with the Bible? Okay. It's a free country. merrily Dec 2014 #53

It Was Pretty Much Implied... WillyT Dec 2014 #55

No, it was not pretty much implied. If anything was implied, it merrily Dec 2014 #63

In fairness, the OP says "born" poor. merrily Dec 2014 #20

So Tell Us... Was Jesus And His Parents Middle Class... The 1% ??? WillyT Dec 2014 #73

I have said what I mean several times. Why do you keep merrily Dec 2014 #76

Ok... WillyT Dec 2014 #82

That is not the Bible, but someone interpreting it for you. merrily Dec 2014 #84

So The Bible Is The End All, Be All, Of This Discussion ??? WillyT Dec 2014 #85

While I don't know if you can say Mary & Joseph were poor... TDale313 Dec 2014 #17

Agree. "Blessed are the poor..." But the moneychangers story has a whole other level to it. merrily Dec 2014 #23

Anyone can say anything. Can anyone back up the statement that Joseph was poor is the issue. merrily Dec 2014 #45

And my point was simply... TDale313 Dec 2014 #54

I got your point and have said about the same all over this thread. merrily Dec 2014 #66

Jesus got it but the rw do not - they just think well if it was good enough for our Lord then it is jwirr Dec 2014 #22

Well, they conveniently put the emphasis on voluntarily helping vs. having the government make you merrily Dec 2014 #49

What's interesting to me is that, for someone born to... JaneyVee Dec 2014 #34

I don't know. A newborn is not the same as a fetus. merrily Dec 2014 #38

What was the theme of his bar mitzvah and what gifts did he get? Moonwalk Dec 2014 #77

What is your actual question, if any? merrily Dec 2014 #78

Fantasyland blkmusclmachine Dec 2014 #36

I always love reading The Right Reverend Robinson's work. n/t. hrmjustin Dec 2014 #80

Locking, sorry, but threads discussing religion are prohibited in GD. Rhiannon12866 Dec 2014 #86