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sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)

121. I thought I explained that. Fundies who want war as a fulfillment of prophecy are

Sun Jan 11, 2015, 05:22 PM

Jan 2015

ignoring the man whose name they have chosen as their symbolic leader. It would be like Alexander the Great calling himself a Ghandi supporter.

Christ never promoted killing people in wars. So how they chose HIM as their symbol is beyond me.

And it may come as a surprise to those who think religious people in general spend their days wondering if everything they do corresponds with their religion. Most people disagree with many things their religion may require of them. They are not frightened by the threats of eternal damnation if they don't live like medieval monks. They take the good from their religions, and try to do the best they can to be decent humans, assuming that overall, THAT is what is required of them.

Jesus was a Social Democrat, a Liberal who believed in Social Safety nets. Free HC, food for the hungry, free of charge etc. His 'followers' are against pretty much everything he stood for.

They need a different symbolic name. Can't think of one off the bat, but it amazes me that War Mongers and anti-Minority, anti Social Programs for the poor, the elderly and disabled still insist that Jesus, as Bush stated as he led the country into a crusade in the ME, 'is my Hero'. Are they nuts?

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If you don't think these people represent all Christians.... [View all] Fred Sanders Jan 2015 OP

They represent the worst of Christian fundamentalism oberliner Jan 2015 #1

Excellent point Oberliner JustAnotherGen Jan 2015 #2

No argument there, they are all distortions of their religion. Cloaking power lust with religion is Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #4

There's no objective standard phil89 Jan 2015 #26

"distortions of their religion" - oh bullshit. Warren Stupidity Jan 2015 #100

George Bush's God demanded that we go on a Crusade into Iraq. I am a Christian and he sure as hell sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #102

And he had, and the neocons continue to have, plenty of support from religious leaders. Warren Stupidity Jan 2015 #106

You really think our War in Iraq had anything to do with religion? It didn't, but having a real sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #109

Absolutely. Plenty of fundamentalists are all for all out war in the middle east to bring about the Warren Stupidity Jan 2015 #110

I thought I explained that. Fundies who want war as a fulfillment of prophecy are sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #121

Sabrina, a word of advice Fortinbras Armstrong Jan 2015 #128

It is not a fallacy if the underlying facts are true. And a "Scotsman" is not a religion. A lot of Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #129

Apparently, you do not know what the "No True Scotsman" fallacy is Fortinbras Armstrong Jan 2015 #132

Because it is an example of the no true scotsman fallacy. Warren Stupidity Jan 2015 #130

No, it is pointing to an extreme example, Fortinbras Armstrong Jan 2015 #131

The Democratic Party has an official platform that is not "allegorical". Warren Stupidity Jan 2015 #133

Christianity has statements about loving your neighbor that Phelps did not follow Fortinbras Armstrong Jan 2015 #136

The fallacy is anyone accepts the fallacy as always applying. Only in Scotland apparently. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #135

Jesus leading a foray into the Middle East with flaming sword astride a Snow White snarling horse... Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #111

As in the OP, pangaia Jan 2015 #63

I'm a Buddhist and I love Jesus vlyons Jan 2015 #79

Precisely. lovemydog Jan 2015 #126

Extremist fundamentalists JustAnotherGen Jan 2015 #3

Here's a book by Jimmy Carter on that subject... YvonneCa Jan 2015 #38

This. Sissyk Jan 2015 #120

That is the point I have been trying to make for days DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #5

Then I want no part of that Christianity, you are confusing self decleration with the reality of Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #8

What is your criterion for deciding who is and isn't of the religion he or she purports to be of? DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #11

Well, killing folks or threatening them for not agreeing with ones religion while cloaked in white Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #12

Is the person who said this a Christian? DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #15

You can be an idiot and still be a Christian, who would argue about that? Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #16

Jesus said that. I'll give you a hint the same person said this: DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #22

No argument there. A very few still cling to these outdated notions that no longer belong. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #23

Then wouldn't it be fairer to say DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #27

Killing gays as an abomination to God, stuff like that, is not religion, it is hate. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #33

An outright majority of US Christians support torture Fumesucker Jan 2015 #42

Have atheists been polled on this? thucythucy Jan 2015 #52

Sorry, your surmise is not correct Fumesucker Jan 2015 #53

Good to know. thucythucy Jan 2015 #57

That is just plain sad. Enthusiast Jan 2015 #116

Here's an a article posted here just the other day about what athiest think and feel about torture notadmblnd Jan 2015 #64

Thanks! thucythucy Jan 2015 #66

Welcome! notadmblnd Jan 2015 #67

Hence the Bible = Hate Speech kevin.xiii Jan 2015 #65

"Killing gays as an abomination to God" - you know this how? Warren Stupidity Jan 2015 #134

At least in Christianity that is the problem and why there are so many denominations. Anyone who jwirr Jan 2015 #82

I know you got upset with me yesterday DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #90

Thank you. I am also that kind of Christian. And I see where you were coming from now. Sorry jwirr Jan 2015 #92

Well, yeah, there are a lot of out there Muslims, Jews, Christians (and) secular folks. DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #94

Explain this then.. Fumesucker Jan 2015 #6

Explain what? Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #7

If you don't see something morally wrong with those poll results then you don't wish to see Fumesucker Jan 2015 #9

I have no idea what you are on about, truly. Maybe YOU could explain so I can understand. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #10

Your view is apparently that religion is supposed to convey a higher moral standard Fumesucker Jan 2015 #13

I think every religion's own view is they carry a higher moral standard, no? Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #14

Hoisted on your own petard. Somewhere Socrates is smiling. DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #18

Everyone is the hero in their own story Fumesucker Jan 2015 #19

They are all branches of the same rotting tree only lunatics would climb. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #25

Well in the case of Christians in the US it's actually the trunk not a branch Fumesucker Jan 2015 #32

It proves 39% do believe it, not 0%. treestar Jan 2015 #21

If the majority of a community believe something horrid perhaps you should rethink belonging to it Fumesucker Jan 2015 #24

Why? treestar Jan 2015 #30

You could set the same standard for the KKK or Al Qaeda Fumesucker Jan 2015 #37

There are no "perfectly wonderful Klansman or AQ members".....maybe you could point to one? Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #39

Evidence? Fumesucker Jan 2015 #41

?? By the way, they are a cult, not a religion. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #44

And the outright majority of Christians who approve of torture unto death? Fumesucker Jan 2015 #46

Misled by a push poll. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #47

Hmm... a substantial majority of the non religious weren't fooled Fumesucker Jan 2015 #49

This is amazing to watch. Marr Jan 2015 #96

They are playing to their strengths Fumesucker Jan 2015 #99

That is so messed up........... Marrah_G Jan 2015 #34

So if they DON'T represent ALL Christians.... ChosenUnWisely Jan 2015 #17

Easy. Mariana Jan 2015 #119

just because many of us believe the terrorists DID do this because of their religious views m-lekktor Jan 2015 #20

"Fear everything, then give us the power to save you from the fear"....avoid at all costs. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #28

+1, well said. /nt Marr Jan 2015 #97

All religions are equally capable of inspiring horrors. Let's look at the slur laden comic #2 Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #29

Seperate the wheat from the chafe, dear sir. Throw away the chafe, it is worthless. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #35

Ah. So if a comic uses actual slurs to tell a lie about an oppressed minority group that's ok if the Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #60

World wide, the vast majority of muslims agree with the Westboro sentiment MNBrewer Jan 2015 #69

So do the vast majority of Russian Christians....I am not defending any religion in particular, just Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #71

K&R nt freedom fighter jh Jan 2015 #31

But ... but ... but ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #36

The One True Scotsman fallacy, more common sense than fallacy, only applies to non-white folks, I guess. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #40

You've already poo-pooed the One True Scotsman fallacy and now you drag it out as a weapon? Fumesucker Jan 2015 #43

Free country. Oh, and being Scottish is not a religion, another fail of how folks are applying it. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #45

I'll take you just as seriously as you take yourself Fumesucker Jan 2015 #48

The "hue" issue is merely a coincidence ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #50

It wasn't only "Tea-Party Republicans" who opposed the so-called "Ground Zero Mosque". Nye Bevan Jan 2015 #51

As one can always unearth a few Muslims who do not represent the Muslim religion, you can also Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #54

56% of Democrats opposed the project Nye Bevan Jan 2015 #59

Thanks for this, Sanders LawDeeDah Jan 2015 #55

Rusty cogs.....good analogy...they need a little intellectual lubrication to free up the gears. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #58

Who is arguing that they represent all Muslims? However I would guess that the Muslims in your tritsofme Jan 2015 #56

I DON'T believe islamic terrorists represent all muslims... brooklynite Jan 2015 #61

Pretty low bar to be a welcome guest in a religion...just regurgitate some of the tenents, but do Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #62

People not in a religion don't 'welcome' anyone into a religion. I'd like them all to leave their Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #70

Let this be a turning point for all religions to expunge all the radicals that sully their name. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #73

agreed.... Burf-_- Jan 2015 #108

Name a position taken by Westboro that is inconsistent with Christian scripture. brooklynite Jan 2015 #75

Which ones, which sect? Which interpretation of the same words, which translation? Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #78

If your argument is that we can't know what REAL Christian scripture is... brooklynite Jan 2015 #80

I can argue their interpretation is immoral, can't I? Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #84

Based on your subjective morality, absolutely...not based on their religious faith. brooklynite Jan 2015 #88

Did Christian terrorist Eric Rudolph represent Christianity? cascadiance Jan 2015 #85

What is lost or unknown or not wanting to be known is that thousands of Muslims are dying resisting Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #91

And far more Muslims live in countries with dictatorships than Christians do... cascadiance Jan 2015 #95

Thank you Shamash Jan 2015 #68

Listening and watching the French today.......I love those folks..... what a lesson they are giving to Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #72

... SidDithers Jan 2015 #74

Our perspective is clouded by the fact that we are coming from randr Jan 2015 #76

As a woman I think they are both scary. WCLinolVir Jan 2015 #77

Exactly. As a woman, a strong supporter of women, LGBT and a secular society, Republicans are my PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #81

In the US we are far more threatened JustAnotherGen Jan 2015 #101

they are still Christians and Muslims JI7 Jan 2015 #83

They are also men, women, and children.....I agree and stand with the French and their President, you are Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #86

extremists tend to be the same Prophet 451 Jan 2015 #87

+1 Enthusiast Jan 2015 #117

Thank you for the cartoons Gothmog Jan 2015 #89

First they fear you, then you fear them, then they kill you, then you fear them more and give Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #93

1.3 to 1.5 million folks (police estimate), marching through France to also say "these terrorists Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #98

Argumentum ad populum is yet another logical fallacy.. Fumesucker Jan 2015 #104

It is not an argument it is a reality shown everywhere in pictures. Total for all France is now 5 Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #107

It doesn't matter how many people say it, that does not make it true Fumesucker Jan 2015 #118

Growing up I attended The Door church on my mom's side of the family JonLP24 Jan 2015 #103

That second-to-last one just proves a worthy point. They sure have something big in common. calimary Jan 2015 #105

Great post! Enthusiast Jan 2015 #112

Thanks. The last line of the last cartoon covers a lot of bases in concisely explaining a few things Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #115

This message was self-deleted by its author Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #113

There are social factors at play beyond religion. Trillo Jan 2015 #114

OP makes an outstanding point. DemocratSinceBirth Jan 2015 #122

Well, progressoid Jan 2015 #123

In pictures .....OK...I can do this too. Burf-_- Jan 2015 #124

Wow, NYC_SKP and Fred Sanders agree on something else! NYC_SKP Jan 2015 #125

THE LAST ONE. AngryDem001 Jan 2015 #127