General Discussion

djean111

(14,255 posts)

12. I am much too cynical to think all that is going to happen.

Wed Jan 14, 2015, 12:40 PM

Jan 2015

Plus - most of the TPP is really about giving the Investor State more powers, and I don't think those powers will be used to pay people any more money than they can get away with, because the overriding theme of the TPP is corporate profits no matter what the cost to people.
Do you really think the Vietnamese, for instance, are really going to clean up the way they harvest, feed, clean, pack the shrimp they sell us? I do not.
And it looks like the TPP will do away with labeling country of origin, because, for example, who would buy shrimp from Vietnam once they see the condition of the shrimp and the workers?

Even if the small parts about workers do come to pass, the rest of the TPP reeks, and there is no excuse for it. That's why, I believe, Obama wants Fast Track, so none of it can be amended or deleted.

Support for the TPP will pretty much determine who I vote for.

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"there�s reason to believe the link between falling unemployment and rising wages has been severed" [View all] marmar Jan 2015 OP

No doubt about it. Our workers now have to compete with Bangladesh wages (and working conditions) Doctor_J Jan 2015 #1

And if the job can't go to Bangladesh, bring Bangladesh to the job via H1B. (nt) MH1 Jan 2015 #33

right. we still have osha though, at least until the multinationals use tpp Doctor_J Jan 2015 #69

This is what the TPP is all about - not raising up, but pushing all to the djean111 Jan 2015 #2

+1 Phlem Jan 2015 #6

Uhmm ... Actually, no ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #8

Specifically, in the TPP we are seeking... Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #11

There are no tariffs (that I know of) ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #14

Your points suggest an unfair off-shoring advantage Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #16

You are spot on. The TPP is indefensible, and I wish, in a way, TPP supporters djean111 Jan 2015 #20

LOL +1 Honest is the best policy! Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #21

There are no TPP supporters on this board ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #79

+ 1000 to that. Anyone with Wall St investments is a TPP supporter at this point. raouldukelives Jan 2015 #118

The US' position closes the current unfair off-shoring advantage ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #22

bernie sanders disagrees with you. ND-Dem Jan 2015 #34

Okay ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #42

It follows crystal clearly except for the willfully oblivious TheKentuckian Jan 2015 #89

count me as cynical, with cause to be. if you're not, you haven't been paying attention. ND-Dem Jan 2015 #94

by raising the wage floor for trade partner nations... Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #38

he's not soft peddling it. This is a hard sell of yet another far right abomination Doctor_J Jan 2015 #67

Providing information being left out of a discussion ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #80

The text you posted... sendero Jan 2015 #112

That is why it is termed "negotiating Objectives" ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #114

Empty rhetoric... sendero Jan 2015 #115

Okay ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #116

There is no progress potential here... sendero Jan 2015 #117

Okay. n/t 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #119

The "US's position" is the position of the multinational corporate lobbyists. stillwaiting Jan 2015 #58

"Probably" ... "Surely" ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #83

It does not say US wages will be the floor QuestionAlways Jan 2015 #108

The standard doesn't have to be as high as wages in the US ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #111

I am much too cynical to think all that is going to happen. djean111 Jan 2015 #12

Well ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #15

Really? People already DO buy shrimp from Vietnam... Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #18

LOL ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #23

How did you get that from what I have written?...From your own words Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #40

I think you really should take a breath and re-read the thread ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #45

Why would you promote the TPP? Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #50

I'm not ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #56

Yes you are pointing to the labor and environment wish list Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #62

Surely, you understand that ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #84

Not for everyone. djean111 Jan 2015 #19

I know people that eat only from their gardens. n/t 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #29

I don't buy shrimp from anywhere but local. grasswire Jan 2015 #27

I know people that eat only from their own gardens. n/t 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #31

and likely we'll see more of them. ND-Dem Jan 2015 #35

True, in fact ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #41

and people who used farmers markets used to be 'well outside' too. but now we have two ND-Dem Jan 2015 #93

And those of us that use farmers markets ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #98

I live in a poor, conservative town and a hell of a lot of people go to the farmers' market. ND-Dem Jan 2015 #99

Do you really think more people shop at the farmer's markets ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #101

no (though we don't have a 'mega' grocery store.) but being as 20 years ago we didn't even ND-Dem Jan 2015 #103

Yes ... actually, I do ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #105

it reads "affects trade or investment" Rilgin Jan 2015 #24

All of the language in the negotiating position of all of the partners ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #26

Who do you work for? upaloopa Jan 2015 #28

I work for a Major University ... why? ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #39

I work for a Major University ... why? ... Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #43

Okay, now I'm convinced, as I indicated in post #45 ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #48

I get the "context" Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #52

LOL ... I'm DONE! n/t 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #57

I have come to the conclusion that it is impossible to have a reasoned debate here on DU about this MADem Jan 2015 #55

Thanks for the "lecture" lol Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #61

Let me try to answer your questions. MADem Jan 2015 #71

Good response ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #76

Heh heh... MADem Jan 2015 #81

And how do we learn when ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #85

I know ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #73

What needs to happen is for people to pipe up the minute the details are known. MADem Jan 2015 #75

Yep ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #77

You are a PR person for the TPP upaloopa Jan 2015 #44

Okay ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #46

We are talking about the lives of working Americans upaloopa Jan 2015 #49

No ... you are SPECULATING about ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #54

As you are speculating about the impact of the TPP Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #59

You almost got my speculation correct ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #88

Ok, you clarified the points. Cosmic Kitten Jan 2015 #90

Yes, it's all speculation ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #97

I asked you to tell me what trade deal upaloopa Jan 2015 #60

"...build on the strong labor provisions in the most recent U.S. trade agreements"< Which destroyed jtuck004 Jan 2015 #100

More people available, and fewer people needed The2ndWheel Jan 2015 #3

He's Missing A Major Point ProfessorGAC Jan 2015 #4

I don't think he missed it all seeing the same point is right there in the blurb TheKentuckian Jan 2015 #86

Is part of it age related Johonny Jan 2015 #5

Certainly that is a contributing factor. Sherman A1 Jan 2015 #7

That is a very real part of it ... 1StrongBlackMan Jan 2015 #9

Once again Reich nails it seabeckind Jan 2015 #10

Not Sure I Know Where You're Going ProfessorGAC Jan 2015 #17

huh? ND-Dem Jan 2015 #32

I Mean What Reich Means ProfessorGAC Jan 2015 #53

I don't know if it's you or me, but I'm having a hard time getting your meaning. "Demanders" ND-Dem Jan 2015 #95

Outsourcing results in factories closing when the entire function is outsourced seabeckind Jan 2015 #36

Well, Then I Disagree With Him ProfessorGAC Jan 2015 #51

K & R !!! WillyT Jan 2015 #13

Our workforce participation rate is at or close to historic lows. Calista241 Jan 2015 #25

+100. the economic system is broken. ND-Dem Jan 2015 #30

^^This!^^ BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #37

Meanwhile, TPP's proponents here say, "I don't care about inequality". closeupready Jan 2015 #63

It is so curious to me that income inequality does not mean "equality" to some BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #74

Completely agree. Generally, things are what they appear to be. closeupready Jan 2015 #113

yup - too many people are distracted by shiny numbers and not seeing the real picture Skittles Jan 2015 #91

excellent post marmar Jan 2015 #92

The labor participation rate is what you mean, I think bhikkhu Jan 2015 #102

the reason college rates are at record highs Skittles Jan 2015 #107

Sorry this is happening for so many new hires. I can only speak for my family 4 re-employments kelliekat44 Jan 2015 #47

Recommend. n/t Jefferson23 Jan 2015 #64

Ross Perot warned us. Octafish Jan 2015 #65

BUT IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH NOT RAISING TH MINIMUM WAGE! so says the tinklebell wing. pansypoo53219 Jan 2015 #66

And the president's a good man. He would never favor corporations over Americans Doctor_J Jan 2015 #68

du rec. xchrom Jan 2015 #70

Plus.. anemic unionization. No champions for the workers. . . . . n/t annabanana Jan 2015 #72

The unemployment number is polticized BS Man from Pickens Jan 2015 #78

A majority of us... Dont call me Shirley Jan 2015 #82

Rec Ramses Jan 2015 #87

Why hasn't the Senate ratified SHAFTA* yet? ybbor Jan 2015 #96

Things are going to get even worse with Deep Learning AI threatening many service and admin jobs AZ Progressive Jan 2015 #104

:( sad kick&rec. n/t BlancheSplanchnik Jan 2015 #106

Americans have been suckered into believing $15 an hour is a really good deal.... Spitfire of ATJ Jan 2015 #109

it is called NAFTA, and Ross Perot spoke of it. nt silvershadow Jan 2015 #110

Mission almost accomplished. Creating a cheap labor force right here in the US. sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #120