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Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)

57. And yet when Rick Warren called LGBT people some terrible names and got rewarded by being

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 10:15 AM

Jan 2015

invited to the Inaugural as the official Minister, many member of DU harshly criticized LGBT posters for objecting to the denigrating language of Rick Warren, who had called us all pedophiles the month before. We were told that to object to public insults was 'poutrage' and that we just 'wanted our pony'.
Today, when some stone cold murderers declare that they were 'offended at denigrating language, many members of DU have vast empathy for them and instead of saying it is 'poutrage' to object to denigrating language they say that while they don't condone murder, anyone who insults others should expect a strong reaction....so for the killers, empathy. For denigrated LGBT people, insults and mockery.
That's just the facts. Sorry if they bother you, but the people who taunted LGBT for objecting to insults from religion who are now saying religion has the right to object to insults even with violence are wandering all over the ethical meadows, hither and yon, taking one position with great certainty one day, the opposite position with equal certainty the next.

And yes, that is a double standard. A glaring, homophobia shaped double standard.

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If you have a strong moral objection to criticizing, satirizing or mocking deeply held beliefs [View all] PeaceNikki Jan 2015 OP

I agree with you. DLevine Jan 2015 #1

Exactly. I usually post mocking blatant hypocrisy in various situations rather than blanket peacebird Jan 2015 #3

A Branch Levitican TheKentuckian Jan 2015 #184

We even mock each other Fumesucker Jan 2015 #2

Good point. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #5

Agreed. bvf Jan 2015 #8

No, it shouldn't dumbcat Jan 2015 #67

I stand corrected. bvf Jan 2015 #74

Exactly. We are a PROGRESSIVE board. We SCRUTINIZE reactionary nonsense and nonsense in general. alp227 Jan 2015 #163

Though it seems many people forget that there may be consequences.... MattSh Jan 2015 #126

Thanks. bvf Jan 2015 #131

Good point. The CCC Jan 2015 #55

Criticizing even mocking religion should never be off limits. Criticizing and mocking PEOPLE who BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #97

Yeah, though everyone is guilty of sometimes crossing lines. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #99

LOVE it. It's what I believe, too. BlueCaliDem Jan 2015 #104

Thanks. I had the supreme pleasure of being in a NOH8 photo shoot a few years ago. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #112

If you'd paid closer attention maybe you would have noticed we mostly just mock you. ieoeja Jan 2015 #7

So you're a Fumesuckeraphobe? PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #11

Unofficially. I found the meetings kind of silly so stopped going. n/t ieoeja Jan 2015 #15

:) PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #18

BINGO! k&r B Calm Jan 2015 #4

Maybe NanceGreggs can explain it to you.. whathehell Jan 2015 #6

I replied to her thread. I was going to rewrite it and replace "religion" with PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #9

That's nice. whathehell Jan 2015 #46

I doubt it lame54 Jan 2015 #73

Whatever floats your boat, Rig whathehell Jan 2015 #75

Sneering at the poor and rubbing their faces in it is not what DU is all about. nt ucrdem Jan 2015 #10

Since when are religious organizations "the poor"? PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #12

So you claim the Saudis are 'the poor'? To criticize billionaire autocrats is to sneer at the poor? Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #19

Oh, darn. You figured out our nefarious plot! Arugula Latte Jan 2015 #91

My question to you is if you would not do it to a person face to face. Jappleseed Jan 2015 #13

My avatar... ironic? PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #17

It is easier to reject than to consider. Jappleseed Jan 2015 #23

Again - criticism is not the same as hate. I reject your framing. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #24

Last post from me on this. Jappleseed Jan 2015 #25

Still *totally* not hate. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #26

What would you say if someone criticized LGBT or women? zeemike Jan 2015 #35

I bite back when conservatives AND religions threaten autonomy and human rights. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #39

Well so do I. zeemike Jan 2015 #48

And yet when Rick Warren called LGBT people some terrible names and got rewarded by being Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #57

!!! +1 wavesofeuphoria Jan 2015 #61

Well I know that when people start dragging up old hurt feelings zeemike Jan 2015 #70

AGREED Skittles Jan 2015 #149

" I was sickened by DUers defending Rick Warren's inclusion in the inagural" greiner3 Jan 2015 #153

And those same people who are saying religion must not be criticized BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #151

No, but vicious, sneering ridicule bears a remarkable resemblance to it. whathehell Jan 2015 #77

Still *totally* not hate. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #80

Still I *totally* disagree. whathehell Jan 2015 #83

Also PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #20

I find is worth noting that many of the posters who defend the worst of religious acts using Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #21

I do not ascribe it to religion because the absence thereof would remove the effect. Nuclear Unicorn Jan 2015 #52

And... PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #22

Well, I for one can imagine a political cartoon skewering Benyamin Netanyahu Surya Gayatri Jan 2015 #28

Yes. It's like bigotry and hate are OK so long as directed at the "right" treestar Jan 2015 #69

Ding!..We have a winner! whathehell Jan 2015 #87

So when we criticize Republicans is that bigotry and hate too? Should we refrain from that? Arugula Latte Jan 2015 #101

Of course not. treestar Jan 2015 #105

I don't see how mixing supernatural beliefs into something makes it off limits. Arugula Latte Jan 2015 #107

No if you believe made up nonsense is real, that is MORE deserving of respect. Warren Stupidity Jan 2015 #129

Good point, Warren. Thank you for the clarity. Arugula Latte Jan 2015 #135

Usually DU is all about letting the offended decide what is offensive treestar Jan 2015 #182

I am totally bigoted against homophobic idiots. I hate them too. Warren Stupidity Jan 2015 #128

I submit that it is not bigotry treestar Jan 2015 #181

Are the anti-women policies of major religions also bigotry? Arugula Latte Jan 2015 #100

Oh no no no! BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #152

The religions didn't cause that treestar Jan 2015 #183

Ahh, that's right, nothing is ever the fault of religions. Arugula Latte Jan 2015 #185

There are things still totally off limits even for precious free speech and satire in America. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #118

I think most of those people just can't stand the idea of LGBT people and women having anyone Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #14

That's a whole lot of assumptions & straw men all balled up together. Ms. Toad Jan 2015 #168

There is a creeping, deliberate authoritarian movement in this nation. woo me with science Jan 2015 #16

+1000 nt freebrew Jan 2015 #33

same here.. Duppers Jan 2015 #88

I could not have stated that any better. smirkymonkey Jan 2015 #148

And obviously on this board BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #154

Unfortunately, mocking isn't going to do the job. NancyDL Jan 2015 #176

Aye, there's the rub and the crux of the conflict: Surya Gayatri Jan 2015 #27

So DU is not just for progressive, liberal democrats... brer cat Jan 2015 #29

You see mocking and ridiculing of conservative ideology all the time. It's the core of our existence PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #30

This is not a conservative site. brer cat Jan 2015 #37

Equating ideology I find horrible with ideology I find horrible is fair. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #38

That certainly makes good sense. LOL brer cat Jan 2015 #41

+1000 classykaren Jan 2015 #68

if your faith endorses misogyny and homophobia HOW is it different? Skittles Jan 2015 #147

I'd like to see the answer too BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #165

they CANNOT defend it Skittles Jan 2015 #166

I find it INCREDIBLE the world's largest religions with billions of members needs kid gloves BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #169

I guess it depends on what you call lately...this happened last year but began earlier OnlinePoker Jan 2015 #180

It sounds like a rather poorly written article to be sure BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #186

Faith is my personal belief, brer cat Jan 2015 #170

you don't need religion to achieve such things Skittles Jan 2015 #172

Criticism isn't the same as mocking brer cat Jan 2015 #174

it is according to many people, including on DU Skittles Jan 2015 #175

When Obama was campainging with hate preachers and then employed Rick Warren Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #51

Oh, I remember that very well. djean111 Jan 2015 #109

If someone mocks what I believe in, I must be doing something right. Rex Jan 2015 #31

And maybe doing something wrong too. Silent3 Jan 2015 #59

And it is a far too common error to assume that being mocked means you did something wrong. Rex Jan 2015 #138

It may be a common error, but so is the badge-of-honor interpretation. Silent3 Jan 2015 #142

Amen Borchkins Jan 2015 #32

Beliefs Roy Rolling Jan 2015 #34

I will separate religion from politics the day that the religious separate their beliefs from it. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #40

!!! +1 wavesofeuphoria Jan 2015 #63

+1000 Duppers Jan 2015 #90

... Arugula Latte Jan 2015 #92

DU rec... SidDithers Jan 2015 #36

Amen! (old habits die hard) mountain grammy Jan 2015 #58

I AGREE WITH SID! BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #155

And he wrote more than one short snarky sentence! BeanMusical Jan 2015 #179

I will continue to criticize, satirize, and mock things and people that I sinkingfeeling Jan 2015 #42

Me, too. As we should. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #43

The only group I routinely mock and insult is Republicans. MoonRiver Jan 2015 #44

I understand what you're saying, but religion is on a different plane than politics. Tommy_Carcetti Jan 2015 #45

They're intersecting planes Prism Jan 2015 #47

Well, ideally they are on seperate planes. Practically, not as much. Tommy_Carcetti Jan 2015 #53

But the religion births the policies Prism Jan 2015 #56

How then do you explain whathehell Jan 2015 #89

Oh, it's still religion Prism Jan 2015 #103

Oh, really, lol? whathehell Jan 2015 #108

If you haven't, read up on religion in Russia and the role of the Orthodox Church Prism Jan 2015 #111

I like your point. MatthewStLouis Jan 2015 #62

religion is first and foremost political... lame54 Jan 2015 #72

DU Rec Jesus Malverde Jan 2015 #49

I'm on the fence with this... pipi_k Jan 2015 #50

huge DU rec olddots Jan 2015 #54

I have a moral objection to bigotry and broadbrushing ismnotwasm Jan 2015 #60

neat. and I to barbaric tenets, misogyny and violence in the name of religion. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #65

Sure, me too ismnotwasm Jan 2015 #76

That's entirely up to you, isn't it? PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #78

Exactly. ismnotwasm Jan 2015 #81

amen and hallelujah. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #82

Are we really going there? ismnotwasm Jan 2015 #84

pssst PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #85

Sorry ismnotwasm Jan 2015 #86

I have an objection to bigotry and broadbrushing hidden behind religions. Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #66

Of course ismnotwasm Jan 2015 #79

Pack mentality? You mean like this pack? Arugula Latte Jan 2015 #96

Sure that pack ismnotwasm Jan 2015 #98

It doesn't do any good treestar Jan 2015 #64

So will you petition the 'faith communities' to stop mocking and denigrating others? Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #71

I probably would, yeah treestar Jan 2015 #94

Religion is an idea invented for and by weak and lazy people nolabels Jan 2015 #93

Actually you are wrong about that ismnotwasm Jan 2015 #102

Thanks for the information nolabels Jan 2015 #113

I was talking historically ismnotwasm Jan 2015 #114

Everybody's bodies are different to one degree or another as everyone knows nolabels Jan 2015 #136

There are lots of people posting here who have strong objections to criticizing or mocking ND-Dem Jan 2015 #95

after all, is there any bigger sacred cow than something that's turned into a marketing phenom MisterP Jan 2015 #150

k&r Duppers Jan 2015 #106

One can be critical without mocking. Satire, is usually best left to a professional. Tuesday Afternoon Jan 2015 #110

I had no idea that was the entire point of the site. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jan 2015 #115

Ever hear of "The Top 10 Conservative Idiots"? PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #116

As I noted, mockery does take place on the site. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jan 2015 #117

Re-read the OP. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #119

I try to avoid mocking religious beliefs. To me, there is a difference between LittleBlue Jan 2015 #120

Let me shorten it for you... MellowDem Jan 2015 #121

Because when my ancestors came to this country LittleBlue Jan 2015 #123

It is another idea... MellowDem Jan 2015 #125

Then debate on LittleBlue Jan 2015 #130

People change their mind on religion. MellowDem Jan 2015 #144

Can polite disagreement coexist with "live and let live"? alp227 Jan 2015 #171

Because mockery is not something decent people do to other human beings. Bullies use mockery sabrina 1 Jan 2015 #122

yeesh, someone should tell EarlG!! PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #124

I'm with you Sabrina 1. Very nicely put. nt kelliekat44 Jan 2015 #187

Tim Minchin from "White Wine in the Sun"... SidDithers Jan 2015 #127

Thanks, and one of my favorites, Patton Oswalt on respecting beliefs. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #132

He's awesome... SidDithers Jan 2015 #134

I'm not at all opposed to mocking ideas gollygee Jan 2015 #133

+1,000,000 n/t cpwm17 Jan 2015 #140

The internet is not a safe zone for sensitive people. TeamPooka Jan 2015 #137

i heard that there might be *porn* on it, too. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #139

This message was self-deleted by its author Corruption Inc Jan 2015 #141

The Big Lie colsohlibgal Jan 2015 #143

We are very much on the same page oberliner Jan 2015 #145

I have no problem with ... NanceGreggs Jan 2015 #146

Absolutely agree. They should leave the word "idiot" out. It's not helpful. n/t jtuck004 Jan 2015 #164

If liberals no longer have the stomach to stand up to power or the oppressors, BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #156

Thank you. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #157

Thank you for this thread BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #162

If someone gives me "After-Death" threats uriel1972 Jan 2015 #158

"After death threats". I like that phrase. PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #161

Well said. Basically if you can't take the heat, don't go to the kitchen. alp227 Jan 2015 #159

Read my sig line. It is a deeply held belief and mocking it does nothing but hurt. uppityperson Jan 2015 #160

You're a kind and compassionate voice of reason in this whole passionate PeaceNikki Jan 2015 #167

that looks like an interesting book uppityperson Jan 2015 #173

I replied to a thread some time way back when I was new to DU... C Moon Jan 2015 #177

I'm not walking on egg shells around the bible thumpers. They whine and yell all the time; so can I. blkmusclmachine Jan 2015 #178