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Manifestor_of_Light

(21,046 posts)
107. What about insisting on "breaking a child's will"??
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 12:24 PM
Jan 2015


There are books by Christians about how to deal with a strong-willed child, which consists of smacking them if they so much as crawl off a blanket to explore before they can walk. Making a child be obedient at all costs? Obedience because the parents insist that they are always right? You get the Nuremberg Defense which didn't work. "I was only following orders".

Telling a child, or any person, they are worthless sinners going to hell, just because of a story about a woman eating an apple in a mythical garden, tempted by a talking snake? That is emotionally and mentally abusive and can drive some people to suicide.
You'll never be perfect like Jesus, you'll always make mistakes, so why go on living if you're failing to live up to those impossible standards of perfection?

John Bradshaw, Ph.D. has several books about dealing with the inner inadequacy that most people have from their values instilled by their parents. People get addicted to certain behaviors and ideas because they have an emptiness in their soul and have never been loved "for being the very one you are". The parents don't say "I love you no matter what". The parents say, "I will only love you if you act a certain way. They eat too much, work too much, have too much sex, obsess on being religious, going to church and praying, and insist on looking perfect to the outside world when everyone inside the family is hurting terribly.

He expanded on the work of Alice Miller and Jean Piaget with BRADSHAW ON THE FAMILY, HEALING THE SHAME THAT BINDS YOU, and HOMECOMING:RECLAIMING AND CHAMPIONING YOUR INNER CHILD.

Alice Miller, who is German, came up with the idea that the "poisonous pedagogy" in which the parent is always right, and physical abuse of children is considered necessary to make children behave, is what turns out little Nazis in which the highest value is obedience. Not thinking "Is this right or wrong?" but "Mother and Father are always right and I must do what they say, or I will be beaten."

I recommend these books by John Bradshaw highly. When a person feels like they are inadequate and failures, these modes of thinking are often the reason. Putting original sin and substitutionary atonement on a kid is a heavy burden. It means that they will never feel like they are adequate or live up to the impossible standards their parents set for them. That's emotionally abusive to children and adults as well. Original sin and substitutionary atonement are the basic foundational beliefs or starting premises of Christianity. So Christians start out being told they are not good enough, that they are bad people and sinners. The emphasis on sin makes some people obsess over every single thing they do as a big deal moral decision. Everyone has to make moral decisions in their daily lives, not just Christians.

The idea of ideas spreading through millions of people, through mass media, for example, or societal teaching, and a very small percentage of those people will become terrorists, whether blowing up the Federal Building in Oklahoma City, Muslim suicide bombers, or killing abortion doctors to save babies, or killing liberals, as happened in a Unitarian church in Knoxville, is known as stochastic terrorism.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

K & R malokvale77 Jan 2015 #1
Sorry, but Christianity is not now relegated to suppression of just gay and minority rights. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #2
This is why we need to ban religion. harrose Jan 2015 #3
Good luck with that shenmue Jan 2015 #4
Who said.. harrose Jan 2015 #7
Communism banned religion, did not work out too well for them. Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #5
Of course.... harrose Jan 2015 #6
Where did that happen? Major Nikon Jan 2015 #22
seriously? dsc Jan 2015 #71
Neither the eastern block, China or PRNK banned religion Major Nikon Jan 2015 #72
you cannot ban religion, nor should you Skittles Jan 2015 #8
Apparently we disagree. harrose Jan 2015 #9
there is plenty wrong with wanting to "ban religion" Skittles Jan 2015 #12
That's fine.... harrose Jan 2015 #13
I agree that we'd be better off without out religion. beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #30
On the contrary... harrose Jan 2015 #35
Banning religion makes martyrs out of extremists. beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #38
The fact that banning something will make martyrs out of its adherents... harrose Jan 2015 #39
Banning it would make us the extremists. beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #40
Again, I disagree... harrose Jan 2015 #52
The root of all evil on the planet is.....sleep. pangaia Jan 2015 #44
and sleepwalkers ND-Dem Jan 2015 #77
True. pangaia Jan 2015 #96
I agree that religion is the root of all evil. notadmblnd Jan 2015 #108
Yes cwydro Jan 2015 #55
What's your plan? rug Jan 2015 #16
this should be interesting Skittles Jan 2015 #18
If he doesn't have one, I trust you know what to do. rug Jan 2015 #19
I'm waiting for him to say the magic words "OUR PARTY" Skittles Jan 2015 #24
! rug Jan 2015 #25
I am utterly confused by the back and forth here... harrose Jan 2015 #36
If you want to discuss this seriously don't waste your time with that poster. beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #41
it's not rug doing the baiting Skittles Jan 2015 #66
Admittedly, I don't have one. harrose Jan 2015 #26
Uh-oh. rug Jan 2015 #27
What uh-oh? harrose Jan 2015 #34
Great idea: ban religion. Dr. Strange Jan 2015 #46
Just because one person managed to use religion in a positive manner.... harrose Jan 2015 #47
just one? i don't think anyone's found that peaceful use for nuclear bombs yet though... ND-Dem Jan 2015 #78
You cannot (and should not) bvf Jan 2015 #48
The difference is.... harrose Jan 2015 #49
What value is there in KKK propaganda? beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #51
No, I believe you missed my point. harrose Jan 2015 #53
Practicing religion is freedom of speech. beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #56
Of Course it's protected by the Constitution... harrose Jan 2015 #59
In my opinion there is no value in racist literature. beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #61
Again... harrose Jan 2015 #65
And religious literature? beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #70
so you want to ban religion and keep free speech. well good luck with that. ND-Dem Jan 2015 #79
What value is there bvf Jan 2015 #60
I believe you missed my point. harrose Jan 2015 #62
No, your point is clear. bvf Jan 2015 #68
Religions do good things also treestar Jan 2015 #118
And when a few hundred million refuse to agree to your ethnic cleansing campaign, then what? Nuclear Unicorn Jan 2015 #54
Who said anything about ethnic cleansing? harrose Jan 2015 #57
Ethnic cleansing -- Nuclear Unicorn Jan 2015 #63
As I said earlier... harrose Jan 2015 #67
oh, i'm sure there's smart people who can figure it out, if that's what you want. ND-Dem Jan 2015 #80
Religious people murder gay people daily. Few ever bother to mention this, but that's genocidal Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #97
And another war for peace will sort this out? Nuclear Unicorn Jan 2015 #98
Is that what I said? No. What I said the pogroms are already going on, the religious are not the Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #100
"I would never propose any limits to religion much less any elimination of it." Nuclear Unicorn Jan 2015 #105
You have some very fascist ideas of how society should function. NaturalHigh Jan 2015 #104
That cannot be done without being as evil as treestar Jan 2015 #117
What, exactly, do you mean by ban? Marengo Jan 2015 #135
That's good stuff. cleanhippie Jan 2015 #10
You think they are not protesting the slaughter of their people by Western powers? malaise Jan 2015 #11
If that is what is inferred from the OP, then the extremists have already won. cleanhippie Jan 2015 #14
There is something vile about using children to make a political point. rug Jan 2015 #15
You must mean 'unless it is a religious person opposing LGBT marriage' because even the Pope Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #99
Actually, I must not. rug Jan 2015 #103
Your ability to use words are not in question notadmblnd Jan 2015 #110
And you are who? rug Jan 2015 #112
I don't let annonymous people on a discussion thread offend me notadmblnd Jan 2015 #115
"I'm just pointing our your hypocrisy" rug Jan 2015 #116
you have a good day now. notadmblnd Jan 2015 #120
You're the one who broght up "Christ-like behavior". rug Jan 2015 #124
Not Irony. To be Christian is to be Christ like, no? notadmblnd Jan 2015 #123
Oh? I thought you were leaving. rug Jan 2015 #125
Well hey, I decided to take your bait. notadmblnd Jan 2015 #127
You'll have to wait. I have to meet someone about an arraignment. rug Jan 2015 #128
that's right- Christians gave themselves an out notadmblnd Jan 2015 #132
Some religious people don't, so it's bigger than that treestar Jan 2015 #119
Bingo. Exactly. Brainbent from infancy seveneyes Jan 2015 #17
So, let me be clear. A child brougt up in religion is brainbent from infancy? Do I have that right? rug Jan 2015 #23
A child taught to defend its religion to the death will do so in most cases seveneyes Jan 2015 #28
What, do you think they're all Chucky? rug Jan 2015 #29
Some may be hormonal Chuckys seveneyes Jan 2015 #32
"hormonal Chuckys" dissentient Jan 2015 #37
Deflect much? bvf Jan 2015 #73
Let him have the last word. cleanhippie Jan 2015 #31
What cleanhippie said beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #33
The Pope says that gay people being parents is a form of discrimination against children. Bluenorthwest Jan 2015 #102
You've got to be carefully taught notadmblnd Jan 2015 #111
http://trailblazersblog.dallasnews.com/files/2013/10/AX069_2392_9.jpg blkmusclmachine Jan 2015 #20
Powerful OP. Recommended. dissentient Jan 2015 #21
then lets look at the things americans aren't protesting. that would be the murders of millions ND-Dem Jan 2015 #81
A GREAT post. hifiguy Jan 2015 #42
This message was self-deleted by its author Raine1967 Jan 2015 #43
Jury results Curmudgeoness Jan 2015 #45
LOVE juror #7! beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #50
Thank you. Curmudgeoness Jan 2015 #69
1-6 to LEAVE IT progressoid Jan 2015 #131
best OP I've read in a long while Ligyron Jan 2015 #58
Some protestors are also setting fire to churches oberliner Jan 2015 #64
The OP is psuedo-profundity with a false premise at it's core. kwassa Jan 2015 #74
Heh. bvf Jan 2015 #75
you don't know much about religious scholars or scholarship then. ND-Dem Jan 2015 #83
Well, bvf Jan 2015 #85
If this is what you learned from that, I don't think you have much of interest to add: ND-Dem Jan 2015 #86
l learned a lot, thanks, bvf Jan 2015 #90
LOL! beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #89
Mark Twain could have saved you some time, bvf. Arugula Latte Jan 2015 #129
D'oh! bvf Jan 2015 #134
+100. pseudo-profundity indeed. ND-Dem Jan 2015 #82
Religion Augustus Jan 2015 #94
Thank you. whathehell Jan 2015 #101
I think many just protest that which threatens their personal faith. greyl Jan 2015 #76
Sylvia Plath wanted to become a Catholic and her mother laughed at her. ucrdem Jan 2015 #84
Score one bvf Jan 2015 #87
Yawn. Warren DeMontague Jan 2015 #88
Point out, exactly, where I said that Augustus Jan 2015 #95
You didn't. You'll have to excuse my jaundiced view of some things, around here. Warren DeMontague Jan 2015 #133
K&R pathansen Jan 2015 #91
Kick and recommend F4lconF16 Jan 2015 #92
So many problems with this OP Pooka Fey Jan 2015 #93
Faith means accepting as true things for which there is no evidence oberliner Jan 2015 #109
I'll start by saying I'm a firm unwavering supporter of Secularism/"Laicité" à la française Pooka Fey Jan 2015 #113
Very good points oberliner Jan 2015 #114
Thank you Pooka Fey Jan 2015 #122
Great Post. Jawja Jan 2015 #106
What about insisting on "breaking a child's will"?? Manifestor_of_Light Jan 2015 #107
This is as true of religion as it is of certain ideologies. hunter Jan 2015 #126
Kick sarcasmo Jan 2015 #121
Bravo! marym625 Jan 2015 #130
I went to church and Sunday School every Sunday when I was a kid. Blue_In_AK Jan 2015 #136
It's all about the degree Augustus Jan 2015 #139
I understand that a lot of denominations Blue_In_AK Jan 2015 #140
Do you hear yourself? Brigid Jan 2015 #137
Apparently your insomnia did get the better of you Augustus Jan 2015 #138
Wow. beam me up scottie Jan 2015 #141
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