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In reply to the discussion: This Is How A Police State Protects “Secrets” - Marcy Wheeler/Salon [View all]Octafish
(55,745 posts)212. Even with you reminding us, yes.
Hannah Bell posted important information that shows the warmongers and banksters for what they are.
For instance:
Obama follows Bushs modus operandi on Iran
And while I don't know who is correct on this and the other issues we can no longer get from Hannah Bell, I do know I prefer Hannah Bell's perspective over yours, msanthrope. You see, Hannah Bell wants me to hear the other side. You don't.
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If this were a police state, you would not have the freedom to post what you just did
Glassunion
Jan 2015
#1
I know you are being sarcastic, but I wish to remind DU of Hannah Arendt's observation that
KingCharlemagne
Jan 2015
#127
My sarcasm was not a jab at the state of things, but one at those who say they have
Glassunion
Jan 2015
#224
Yeah, I got that. I wished to underline the serious point I thought (correctly) you were
KingCharlemagne
Jan 2015
#226
The Constitution is not immutable. And Sterling's case has nothing to do with it.
randome
Jan 2015
#21
'Outing' an agent means giving the name to someone who is not authorized to know it.
randome
Jan 2015
#101
In the indictment, Sterling's book proposal is detailed. Some posters here are
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#114
Well... OP article is a lesson to those who would quote such a sloppy source....
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#122
But she only discussed 7 counts--ignoring the other 2, and thus, from this thread, it's pretty
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#199
By specifying how the agent delivered secret messages, Sterling in effect outed him/her.
randome
Jan 2015
#126
When did outing an agent become illegal? When Plame was outed by Novak, it took the prosecutor
hughee99
Jan 2015
#143
Novak was a journalist and so was given 'extra-special-super-duper' consideration.
randome
Jan 2015
#144
Compromising an identity is not 'greivous harm' but it is potentially dangerous.
randome
Jan 2015
#166
Assumption? He was convicted. You may make an assumption, but understand something.....
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#182
It's also circumstantial to see someone holding a smoking gun but without seeing the gun fired.
randome
Jan 2015
#180
No, I'm talking about a national security agent giving away national security secrets.
randome
Jan 2015
#20
The government pressed Risen to reveal his sources. When he refused, they basically gave up.
randome
Jan 2015
#48
And Maybe... Just Maybe... The Reason Some Will "willingly obfuscate and deflect."
WillyT
Jan 2015
#50
Interdicting AMERICA'S Nuclear Program May Be Un-American... Iran Has It's Own Sovereignty...
WillyT
Jan 2015
#237
I certainly wouldn't want Congress to decide what's good for the American people
JonLP24
Jan 2015
#39
But there is no mention of "selling" secrets in the indictment or conviction
Kelvin Mace
Jan 2015
#97
My arguments are NOT based on strict readings of the law since I'm not an attorney.
randome
Jan 2015
#104
His book was his memoirs that the CIA refused to give him permission to publish.
randome
Jan 2015
#210
Actually...Sterling's attempt to publish is in the indictment...there's also
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#118
Msanthrope did not read the article. Wheeler does indeed, at the beginning of the article
Luminous Animal
Jan 2015
#198
But it's apparent from this thread that Wheeler is unclear--and I blame Wheeler, rather than DUers
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#207
No, it is clear that people are discussing the Espionage Act charges. The focus of Wheeler's article
Luminous Animal
Jan 2015
#217
Thank you for admitting that Wheeler is selectively discussing the charges. And I think that proves
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#219
Quoting inaccurately and making false statements in order to further her agenda?
bvar22
Jan 2015
#228
I am a 'master' at nothing other than my ability to look at all the fine print.
randome
Jan 2015
#211
Is it difficult to admit it's possible that Congress blew him off because there was nothing illegal?
randome
Jan 2015
#157
Nobody Wants To Talk About Their Pedophile Uncle Either... Doesn't Mean They Shouldn't Be In Jail...
WillyT
Jan 2015
#242
I am loving the post hoc defense of Judith Miller and Scooter Libby, myself. nt
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#12
I was disgusted when James Risen made shit up about Wen Ho Lee. Why else do you
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#16
What was covered up here? Every trial document is available online. Merlin wasn't an
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#24
Um, no...that's not the only evidence. What say you as to the evidence presented with
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#44
Nope. You're claiming this is just like Judith Miller and Valerie Plame
riderinthestorm
Jan 2015
#108
Um....I don't have to back it up...it's the charge on the indictment he was
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#112
Yes I know. I'm focusing on your persistent charge that Sterling outed an agent
riderinthestorm
Jan 2015
#141
First and foremost....I've already given the indictment link. I can't make you
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#177
And So Is Every Person Who Believed In The American Myths We Were Told As Children...
WillyT
Jan 2015
#243
Again...you make the mistake Wheeler did. You focus on the 'leak' but not on the
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#102
You don't seem to understand that the Wheeler article is only talking about 7 of the 9
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#128
Okay--I can't physically make you read the charges in the indictment. That's true.
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#185
You never mention that article's co-author, NYT reporter Jeff Gerth, msanthrope. Why?
Octafish
Jan 2015
#27
Because Jeffy wasn't part of the legal cases in the 4th involving either Miller or Risen?
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#34
Because it may be Gerth who deserves your wrath, scorn, whatever for Wen Ho Lee, not Risen.
Octafish
Jan 2015
#47
Well, I'm really glad you have respect for the rule of law. How do you feel about the Government
sabrina 1
Jan 2015
#106
Well, I have never seen any evidence that those Americans were guilty of anything. A teenager going
sabrina 1
Jan 2015
#135
No, it's Congress' job. No. Wait. It's Sterling's job. No, no, still not right. Risen's?
randome
Jan 2015
#65
the government fought to keep him off the stand to limit his testimony about lies and deceptions
bigtree
Jan 2015
#78
As I understand it, the government fought to keep Risen's testimony out of the transcript.
randome
Jan 2015
#82
Okay, so they did. But didn't the judge then rule that only Risen's transcript would be redacted?
randome
Jan 2015
#136
The truth would negatively impact the Government's case against Sterling, so...
Octafish
Jan 2015
#84
The defense could have called Risen. There was no bar to that. The government's
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#134
No--it's not. Federal juries are generally smart enough to make inferences from testimony--and lack
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#171
Nonsense--the 4th circuit's denial of appeal CLEARLY stated that he was compelled to testify. The
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#168
He should have gone to jail, just like Miller if he was going to let Sterling go to prison falsely.
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#179
Risen was willing to go to jail. The Government apparently, especially after the show in France
sabrina 1
Jan 2015
#227
No--Risen was not willing to go to jail, which is why he appealed over and over. As to the rest,
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#229
Of course he appealed it. Why was he even threatened with jail in a country that puts on such a
sabrina 1
Jan 2015
#231
So... Say It Out Loud... Let The World Know... We Have Their Backs... We ARE The World's Police...
WillyT
Jan 2015
#248
Why... The Rest Of The World Would Have Been Better Off If We Didn't Have One...
WillyT
Jan 2015
#251
only if you take the government's prosecution at face value, which you apparently do
bigtree
Jan 2015
#256
I'll look into it some more.... But the story doesn't make much sense to me. n/t
Adrahil
Jan 2015
#257
Risen's book outlines a pattern of deception by the U.S. intelligence agencies
bigtree
Jan 2015
#258
No doubt Ellsberg was a whistleblower. His actions saved lives. Sterling's actions endangered lives.
randome
Jan 2015
#93
So Sterling outed an agent because Operation Merlin wasn't as flawless as he would have liked?
randome
Jan 2015
#131
first of all, the subject we were discussing was his intial report to Congress
bigtree
Jan 2015
#138
There was enough circumstantial evidence to convince the jury beyond a reasonable doubt.
randome
Jan 2015
#150
'Dubious'. Right. Not illegal, just Sterling's desire to protect us years after the fact.
randome
Jan 2015
#159
Sorry, an article that equates Snowden with a whistleblower is blatantly biased.
randome
Jan 2015
#96
It's not ridiculous. It's a mistake of law and fact to presume that circumstantial
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#54
and here your posts and a few others have me thinking of a different 'streak' at DU
bigtree
Jan 2015
#63
You know....you seem to be suggesting that Risen's lack of testimony let an innocent man go to
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#183
Well--it's the obvious conclusion of what you write. You suggest that Risen's lack of testimony
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#187
Sterling and Risen are friends. Do you think Sterling wanted his friend in jail?
riderinthestorm
Jan 2015
#189
Would you face an 80 year jail term for a friend? Look--of course Risen could have forecasted this
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#193
No--you misunderstand....the defense had no bar, at all, to Risen being called to the stand.
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#197
Look--I've said this before to posters....if you think I'm lying about being an Obama campaign
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#173
Some of the associations going back to Smirko Madministration become clear, as well.
Octafish
Jan 2015
#76
Hannah Bell is a banned troll..and you are missing the joke in the thread. nt
msanthrope
Jan 2015
#213