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Prism

(5,815 posts)

59. I don't know what to do

Thu Feb 5, 2015, 05:58 PM

Feb 2015

One thing we crave, especially when our ideologies come into play, is certainty. We must do A or B.

With ISIS, I don't know. Will this regional cancer spread? Or, will the neighbors finally declare enough and confront this threat? There is little doubt we played a significant role in creating ISIS. Do we have a responsibility to go in and restore balance? What does balance look like? Would "doing something" result in a better regional environment, or does something worse take its place?

My emotional impulse is to leave alone - for now. To see how the regional powers confront this medieval group. To give current strategies time to resolve. I admit, by adopting this strategy, I am condemning the locals to horrors. That has to be acknowledged. But sometimes we're given the choice of horrors - do they want us to inflict the horror of war or will ISIS's horror move the people of the Middle East to act?

I don't know. I wish I had more certainty, but I don't.

I want the people of the Middle East to be more self-determinative, but how long do we wait before we declare that such a thing is not materializing with enough alacrity?

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Laser Focus 2-3-15 - ISIS, Some Fellow Liberals and War [View all] stevenleser Feb 2015 OP

K&R eom MohRokTah Feb 2015 #1

So if the US and UN have targeted funding for ISIS, why are these guys still sitting on thrones? leveymg Feb 2015 #2

Here is UN Security Council Resolution 2170. You can read it for yourself stevenleser Feb 2015 #3

Resolution dated 15 AUG 14 - I repeat the question, what should be done? leveymg Feb 2015 #5

There is a universal freeze on their assets. What do you think isn't being done? As the Syrian stevenleser Feb 2015 #7

There is broad agreement that "substantial" funds are still reaching ISIS from KSA and GCC states leveymg Feb 2015 #12

From the link you provided... stevenleser Feb 2015 #14

Do the numbers. Oil accounts for about 40%, that leaves a big hole in the Caliphate's budget leveymg Feb 2015 #15

Do what numbers? Do you have a number for ISIS's accountant? Do you have their Quicken account? stevenleser Feb 2015 #16

Believe it or not, they issue annual reports. Like any other foreign-held corporation. leveymg Feb 2015 #17

Those do not provide the basis for analyzing your claims. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #21

If you say so, Steven. leveymg Feb 2015 #22

Anecdotes in an article are not a balance sheet or list of income. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #23

You should do your homework before you post on these issues, Steven. leveymg Feb 2015 #19

I did. My point stands. Provide their detailed sheet, not anecdotes in an article. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #20

Links in FT article here - do you read Arabic, Steven? leveymg Feb 2015 #24

I'm not doing homework to validate your claims, that's your job. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #25

You haven't given any sources or figures to back up your claims. leveymg Feb 2015 #26

I didn't make any claims based on financial figures, you did. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #31

You wrote ISIS is "making money from selling Syrian and ... Iraqi oil" and a "universal freeze" on leveymg Feb 2015 #34

You give the OP too much credit. Rex Feb 2015 #85

Note in particular the comments by the Syrian who sits on the UN Sec Council... stevenleser Feb 2015 #4

What is your point, here? leveymg Feb 2015 #6

Why are you asking question #5 about their funding if the Syrians explain here how they are making stevenleser Feb 2015 #8

They're getting everything trucked in from Turkey CJCRANE Feb 2015 #48

"there is an opinion on the left that if the US simply leaves people alone..." wyldwolf Feb 2015 #9

Well said. Love this comment. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #11

the fire department tends to use water zipplewrath Feb 2015 #28

the theory of blowback guillaumeb Feb 2015 #29

The possibility of blowback always exists with violence at the micro or macro level. As I noted in stevenleser Feb 2015 #32

blowback redux guillaumeb Feb 2015 #50

+1 Jamaal510 Feb 2015 #37

Too many are invested in the "We suck!" narrative. Nuclear Unicorn Feb 2015 #10

Yep, group A may have done something wrong, but we can't do anything because "US Bad" stevenleser Feb 2015 #13

Exactly. Waiting For Everyman Feb 2015 #27

Not exactly. ISIS is evil but wouldn't likely exist without our actions. Actions with similar TheKentuckian Feb 2015 #41

well said. bigtree Feb 2015 #46

Word. KG Feb 2015 #55

+100000000000 woo me with science Feb 2015 #110

Very well said Oilwellian Feb 2015 #113

Exactly get the red out Feb 2015 #81

Excellent post! True at every level. Lint Head Feb 2015 #18

I hate, hate, hate, hate war. BUT in this case I think you are all right about what we and the world jwirr Feb 2015 #30

So if it's not on video it doesn't matter? CJCRANE Feb 2015 #33

this is a classic argument in favor of preemptive war - a Bushian defense of military intervention bigtree Feb 2015 #35

You so wonderfully make my point. You make a superficial analysis to say "this is all the same" stevenleser Feb 2015 #36

you make my point bigtree Feb 2015 #38

LOL. Do you even get how ridiculous your position is? Arguing Iraq/Saddam 2003 is the same as ISIS stevenleser Feb 2015 #39

ridicule bigtree Feb 2015 #42

There is no point to which to reply. You are making a ridiculous posit. Good luck with it. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #43

good luck with your 'ridiculous' new interventionist role bigtree Feb 2015 #45

Nothing new. I am for interventions where its justified and against those that aren't. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #56

"Justified" sounds like some kind of naive moral crusade. Marr Feb 2015 #61

Which post WW2 US military interventions Deny and Shred Feb 2015 #84

Yes, the trend is clear. CJCRANE Feb 2015 #40

we had to save the Vietnamese from communism... bigtree Feb 2015 #44

excellent guillaumeb Feb 2015 #51

It will be different time is said every time and almost never in living memory has it been. TheKentuckian Feb 2015 #53

It is the same is also said each time just as you are doing. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #54

And if each of us had to live on betting their respective positions you'd have to hock your organs TheKentuckian Feb 2015 #62

The OP is entirely superficial. Orsino Feb 2015 #106

From Gilda Radner...."There's always somthin'". Indeed. But once you're committed to Empire, the libdem4life Feb 2015 #47

One quibble: ISIS is already getting their asses kicked on all fronts. So why change tactics? nt ieoeja Feb 2015 #49

Garbage whatchamacallit Feb 2015 #52

Elizabeth Warren has already "endorsed it". Tarheel_Dem Feb 2015 #57

K and R for good old-fashioned sense. hifiguy Feb 2015 #58

I don't know what to do Prism Feb 2015 #59

While I have no sympathy for groups like ISIS whatsoever, I'm also not inclined to engage in Marr Feb 2015 #60

You're a Liberal? Octafish Feb 2015 #63

Steven has been on Fox News many times. Leser is listed as a "Fox News Insider" leveymg Feb 2015 #64

Thank you. Quite the CV, especially the resignation of Sarah Palin part. Octafish Feb 2015 #67

Yep, I was there for a debate on Healthcare reform and suddenly Palin resigned. And they needed stevenleser Feb 2015 #71

I'm not being a smart ass here: can you elaborate on what was "stirring" about deutsey Feb 2015 #90

You will have to ask the person who wrote the bio. I didn't write it. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #91

I'll pass, thanks. deutsey Feb 2015 #92

Nope. I have better things to do with my time. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #93

Like giving stirring commentary about Sara Palin? deutsey Feb 2015 #95

Nope, she resigned several years ago. I talk about things happening as they happen. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #97

Keep on truckin', dude deutsey Feb 2015 #99

Yes, ply your feeble minded insults elsewhere. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #100

Um, that wasn't meant as an insult. deutsey Feb 2015 #101

Do you know who you're calling ''feeble minded''? Octafish Feb 2015 #105

LOL, that's not what that means. You get listed there for having a particularly hot debate. stevenleser Feb 2015 #70

On Election Night, 2012, Steve interviewed me on his radio show for my work on behalf of the Obama msanthrope Feb 2015 #107

He plays a liberal on TV Fumesucker Feb 2015 #65

Is that sort of like how the Washington Generals "play" the Harlem Globe Trotters? leveymg Feb 2015 #66

You mean like my desired candidate winning the Presidency the last two times? stevenleser Feb 2015 #73

You mean like the candidate who said he was a Liberal, then as president wasn't. Octafish Feb 2015 #103

The plays part is what isn't getting across. Octafish Feb 2015 #68

I say exactly what I believe. And that happens to coincide with what most Liberals believe. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #72

Any actions to back up the words you say you say? Octafish Feb 2015 #74

You mean like my desired candidate winning the Presidency the last two times? nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #75

No, I mean you stating you are a Liberal. Octafish Feb 2015 #77

And my answer is the same. The majority of Liberals and I support the same candidates. nt stevenleser Feb 2015 #79

It still isn't a definition. Octafish Feb 2015 #104

Not really. Rex Feb 2015 #94

Having been on his radio show, detailing my work as an voter protection attorney, I msanthrope Feb 2015 #108

Yes, I am and my views are shared by most Liberals. stevenleser Feb 2015 #69

Show where I'm wrong on what I post and I'll apologize. Octafish Feb 2015 #76

I'm not going spend time going through your posts. I've seen enough to know you're wrong on most stevenleser Feb 2015 #80

In other words, you can't find anything wrong with what I post. Octafish Feb 2015 #83

A real journalist might, but a political hack? Rex Feb 2015 #89

Steve Leser was glad to have me on his show on Election Night, 2012, where I detailed msanthrope Feb 2015 #109

LOL! A political hack and nothing more. Rex Feb 2015 #86

I'm glad that I don't appeal to you. It means I am doing something right. stevenleser Feb 2015 #96

This is such a relief to read get the red out Feb 2015 #78

ISIS is doing the same shit JonLP24 Feb 2015 #82

The OP cannot go out of a very narrow narrative and your issue doesn't fit. Rex Feb 2015 #88

This creates big problems for those of you who want to continue honoring the Saudis and others Bluenorthwest Feb 2015 #87

The simple answer is that the Saudis are not engaging in wars of conquest where ISIS is. stevenleser Feb 2015 #98

the simple answer does not go far enough guillaumeb Feb 2015 #102

The Saudi Royals are too rich to do their own wars. They pay the peasants (IS) and mercenaries (US) leveymg Feb 2015 #111

Kick Cha Feb 2015 #112