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In reply to the discussion: If you don't think we're already living in a police state, consider this. [View all]woo me with science
(32,139 posts)80. Yes, a police state is being constructed around us:
Apologies for repeating this post, but I think it's relevant here.
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Yes, a police state is being constructed around us. And yes, it's used to further political goals...
http://election.democraticunderground.com/?com=edit&forum=1002&thread=5914695&pid=5915944
http://election.democraticunderground.com/?com=edit&forum=1002&thread=5914695&pid=5915944
...and defend our corporate oligarchy and its corruption. It's a corporate-authoritarian state being very carefully and deliberately constructed around us.
All the indignant denials take the same form:There's no Hitler, we're not being burned alive in ovens, or we're still typing on the internet, or we aren't being lined up in the streets and shot (well, that one's certainly debatable, isn't it...).
As though the corporate owners of the United States of America, who rely on its reputation as the beacon of freedom and democracy in the world, can't find more effective and less politically damaging means to make sure dissent never materializes into anything seriously threatening to the PTB.
Psst. Our president has a "Kill List." And indefinite detention. And a surveillance state. And an entire secret government, secret laws and secret courts, operating alongside the one we are taught about in school. And all it takes to become part of that is for someone to invoke the word, "terrorism" and relate it to you.
"But that's a high bar!" all the sensible woodchucks will protest. "I TRUST my president! And it's only for TERRORISTS!"
Really? And do we trust the next one?
Actually, we're all being spied on. And "terrorism" is being invoked as a weapon against political dissent.Report Details How Counter Terrorism Apparatus Was Used to Monitor Occupy Movement Nationwide
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12527647
Whoop, There It Is... 'Evidence Homeland Security Coordinated Occupy Crackdown' -
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002462465
ACLU discovers FBI is labeling peace activists as 'potential terrorists'
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4500788
And the most sinister aspect of all of this is the fact that the language of terrorism and espionage is being actively expanded to include whatever citizens or groups the corporatists consider to be irritants: political enemies, protesters, even journalists.Protestors against Energy Company charged with terrorism
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024175848
Mission Creep: When Everything is Terrorism
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023279560
US Uses Espionage Act To Convict Manning Using Words Added In 1990: "with a computer"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023375845
Fed Court: Just changed interpretation of Espionage Act to cover leaks that are NOT Harmful To USA
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023365713
NY Times: White House Uses Espionage Act to Silence Employees, Press
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101616764
Obama Has Charged More Under Espionage Act Than All Other Presidents Combined
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023080388
If you are a One Percenter trying to effectively use the government you have purchased to manage unpleasant press about what you are doing, what do you do? Well, one tactic might be to try to get the government into the business of deciding who is a journalist. That way you can claim to establish "protections" for whistleblowers, when what you are actually doing is creating categories through which you can exclude from protection those you don't want to protect.http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023708417
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4976955
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4976082
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4976955
Yeah, journalism isn't doing too well in this country. One might say it is being murdered. There's a reason it's supposed to be protected by the First Amendment. That reason is not compatible with increasingly totalitarian corporate control.Petition Calls On Obama Stop Intimidation Of Journalists And Whistleblowers
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025509395
Why Is President Obama Keeping a Journalist in Prison in Yemen
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023300531
James Clapper Calls Journalists "Criminal Accomplices" -
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017174990
Reporters without Borders: 'Security interests threaten press freedom'
http://www.democraticunderground.com/11333723
US Plummets In Press Freedom Rankings
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024487392
Obama's escalating war on Freedom of the Press
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023314296
Risen Case: War on Journalism coming to a head
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101699216
Government Surveillance Is Crippling Press Freedoms, Report Shows
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023902153
So....you shut up the journalists.
And you shut up the protesters.
Who else do you need to shut up?
Ah....all the people who work for the government, many of whom can be assumed to still have consciences and thus be potentially dangerous to the corporate coup of democracy. How do you handle them?
Well, you can fire them. See, it's *useful* for the government of an ostensibly free nation to have highly visible groups engaged in protest...like the Black Panthers, etc....and not to deny them employment or do anything serious to them. It gives the illusion of freedom. But look what we learned of recently, about how firings happen at the Federal Reserve:The Secret Goldman Sachs Tapes
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025587384
But you can also wage legal war against their power to function as whistleblowers. And you assault the unions that protect them.The Obama administration/DOJ war on whistleblowers, federal unions
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5586389
You can institute draconian snitch rules to intimidate those who might be thinking about whistleblowing:President's 'rat out your co-worker' plan unlikely to work, experts say
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023214675
And you claim the right to spy on them even at home.
You let the dissent flourish, as long as it's safe dissent. But you take care of the stuff that has the potential to be truly threatening. Most importantly, you make a vicious example of those who carry through with revealing corruption:Daniel Ellsburg: Snowden would not get a fair trial today, was right to flee US
http://www.democraticunderground.com/11784497
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023198130
Bradley Manning: top US legal scholars voice outrage at torture
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x871563
That includes those who whistleblow on financial institutions, not just the government. Since you're not prosecuting the banking criminals, you have plenty of time to send up a guy who tried to identify them:Bradley Birkenfeld, UBS Whistleblower, Finds Himself in Federal Prison
http://www.cnbc.com//id/41257962
It's a delicate line to walk, all this intimidation while still claiming to be the beacon of freedom for the world. But the intimidation is necessary, because people are starting to catch on.
No, nobody has sent the jackboots to line up the protesters in front of everyone and methodically kill them. But we're seeing the next best thing.
Militarizing the hell out of the police departments. That way it's blamed on some "programs"....but it sends a clear psychological message to the upstarts.Stopping police militarization: Once again, the solution requires confronting corporate politicians.
http://sync.democraticunderground.com/10025416709
Federal grants drive the militarization of police departments in America.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025383806
And then you get this:
And this:
And this:
Quite a few of the Occupy violence pics I used to use regularly now I cannot find anywhere on the internet; if I could, I'd put them here, too. The elderly woman tear-gassed, the mobs of jackbooted storm troopers surrounding a few people on a blanket...
And, meanwhile, out in the community, the militarized police are starting to terrorize ordinary citizens, mostly the impoverished and voiceless ones. But the corporate-controlled federal government keeps sending the hardware and the storm trooper uniforms, even encouraging it with grants, and they refuse to keep records on how many citizens have been murdered. How many were there this week?"What I've Learned from Two Years Collecting Data on Police Killings...
...I'm convinced to my core: The lack of such a database is intentional."
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025429276
Twenty-Three People Killed by American Police in the Span of One Week
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025593137
We're all suspects, potential terrorists now. and the mechanisms are in place to ensure that any dissent that begins to bubble up can be handled and eliminated before it materializes in any serious way.
The truth is that we don't know what dissent may have already been cut off at the root, because of the elaborate, secret, unaccountable system that has been put into place. We know that the president has sought the power to lie in response to Freedom of Information requests. We know that data collected from NSA spying has been used to imprison Americans using false evidence trails. We know that the CIA can spy on the Senate Intelligence Committee with impunity and nothing is done about it, and that Clapper can lie to Congress and the Department of Justice can lie to the Supreme Court about spying and nothing is done. These are just the things we know.DEA Manuals Show Feds Use NSA Spy Data, Train Cops to Construct False Chains of Evidence
http://sync.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4507611
Obama Admin Seeks Permission TO LIE In Response To Freedom of Information Requests - Even To The COURTS
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2185303
DOJ lied to Supreme Court about domestic surveillance
https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20140514/06214727229/doj-still-trying-to-hide-fact-it-flat-out-lied-to-supreme-court-about-domestic-surveillance.shtml
The sensible woodchucks keep telling us that someone has to be actively involved in VERY SERIOUS TERRORISM against the United States of America in order for our government to start throwing *that* word around, or showing an interest in us. But we are all surveilled, and the methods for it keep expanding. If you think about it, it's GOOD for corporate control to have people posting dissent on the internet. It helps you know whom to watch. Voiced dissent is USEFUL as long as it doesn't lead to anything...you know, serious. Our corporate government is keeping an eye on us.
OKC protestors slapped with terrorism charges
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024175848
A Nation of "Suspects"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x5011487
http://www.truth-out.org/nation-suspects/1314810046
American Protesters Declared Enemy for Weapons Testing Purposes; Rules of Engagement
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2132808#2139011
DoD Training Manual: Protests are "Low-Level Terrorism"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/100227662
Ridiculous FBI list: You might be a domestic terrorist if...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1790765
Doctors asked to identify potential terrorists under government plans
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=1261120&mesg_id=1261120
Do You Like Online Privacy? You May Be a Terrorist
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002257966
Top US counterterrorism official: drone critics are Al Qaeda enablers
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002279862
"Arrogant complaining about airport security is one indicator Transportation Security Administration officers consider when looking for possible criminals and terrorists"
http://www.cnn.com/2011/TRAVEL/04/15/tsa.screeners.complain/
N.S.A. Examines Social Networks of U.S. Citizens (Decision Made In Secret, in 2010)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014605329
Now, tell me.
Why would the corporatists who have purchased into our government and rely on its reputation as the beacon of freedom and democracy for the world, use such heavy-handed and politically damaging tactics as shutting down the internet or ostentatiously lining up protesters to shoot them in the streets, when they have already put into place and legalized this elegant system to control dissent?
Yeah, I'm typing on the internet. That PROVES we're free.
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Thank you for this important OP.
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If you don't think we're already living in a police state, consider this. [View all]
99th_Monkey
Feb 2015
OP
14 Defining Characteristics of Fascism (http://www.rense.com/general37/char.htm)
blkmusclmachine
Feb 2015
#1
It is 14 out of 14, the first step is to define realized what religion is being intertwined
happyslug
Feb 2015
#160
But to this degree and such highly sophisticated organization against democracy for ALL?
lexington filly
Feb 2015
#79
At some point, the pendulum will begin to swing away from this practice toward equality for all.
Dont call me Shirley
Feb 2015
#3
I consider it the most sane of woowoo notion that at some point a critical mass of sanity triggers
Dont call me Shirley
Feb 2015
#13
i hope that eventually a switch will be thrown in the unconscious mind of everyone.
TimeToEvolve
Feb 2015
#60
Yes and I have been in the blackness of eternal night, and I made it through.
Dont call me Shirley
Feb 2015
#24
The phrase actually comes from Hermeticism - A swing to the right is a swing to the left
Hestia
Feb 2015
#138
Interesting, but the pendulum I referred to is meant to cut victims in half
HereSince1628
Feb 2015
#162
Yup! When I saw the beatdown of Occupy and the neo-military response to Furgoson
OffWithTheirHeads
Feb 2015
#14
Brightened my day! We still got Obama, the White House, all the good States, and all the good ideas.
Fred Sanders
Feb 2015
#30
oh pleeeez...you insult people being persecuted around the world by using this term for the USA.
uhnope
Feb 2015
#26
When younger, I would NEVER have believed the USA could EVER sink to 46th in press freedom
Faryn Balyncd
Feb 2015
#54
+10000 And..The United States has the largest prison population in the world,
woo me with science
Feb 2015
#100
"I mean some people who claim to be poor even have microwave ovens and TVs..." Fox News
whereisjustice
Feb 2015
#112
We lost this game a long time ago. The two minute warning was when we let the Supreme Court
world wide wally
Feb 2015
#40
I think your first paragraph could use more detail because as I read about the last 40 years being
Bluenorthwest
Feb 2015
#46
yes. The INCREASE in freedoms in the USA in last 40 years doesn't fit into the narrative
uhnope
Feb 2015
#52
I see. So there's a plan by the "The Oligarchs" to fool us by giving us some freedom
uhnope
Feb 2015
#59
You demean the years of struggle against your straight culture that produced the progress in
Bluenorthwest
Feb 2015
#91
I think the fact that you feel you can characterize me with impunity suggests a lack of equity in
Bluenorthwest
Feb 2015
#141
What specifically leads you to believe that gay rights was a "carrot" developed by oligarchs?
LanternWaste
Feb 2015
#144
and how does this supposed Police State USA compare to actual police states in...
uhnope
Feb 2015
#55
Asking questions in lieu of presenting an actual counter argument seems to indicate
rhett o rick
Feb 2015
#145
police reform is of the utmost importance IMO but reform is stalled by yahoos yelling "police state"
uhnope
Feb 2015
#147
OK, you may be conflating a number of issues, hyperbalizing things and calling up a mythical past.
pinto
Feb 2015
#68
The answer is two fold. "Can it be a true police state whil citizenry are armed?"
rhett o rick
Feb 2015
#146
Excellent post, the rich are funding a police state to stifle dissent as they steal
whereisjustice
Feb 2015
#115
The fact this post stays up, and DU actually exists, speaks against the idea of a police state.
Drunken Irishman
Feb 2015
#118
Armed officers appearing at people's residences over building code enforcement
aint_no_life_nowhere
Feb 2015
#119
A slowly boiled frog doesn't get it until he's dead, at which point, he's oblivious.
merrily
Feb 2015
#142
You might want to re-think your "investigative journalists" with the benefit of hindsight
Blue_Tires
Jan 2018
#169