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In reply to the discussion: Red Scare #9 [View all]

H2O Man

(74,300 posts)
66. Fair enough.
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 11:02 AM
Mar 2015

I likely include both Truman and Nixon out of habit, though they were the "book-end" presidencies.

MLK did put on the pressure that resulted in Ike's 6-23-58 meeting with Civil Rights leaders. Martin was 29 years old at that time, and while he was gaining national influence, the President was more interested in the other older, more established leaders of the movement. To be fair, Ike was sincere in his belief that their approach was more beneficial to progress in "race relations," than the young, more confrontational minister's.

Ike's VP actually had a much closer relationship with King. Indeed, Nixon lobbied for Ike to meet with King. Yet, as history shows, the cautious President would do so in a group setting -- distinct from Nixon's personal relationship with King. (It's interesting to speculate on what might have happened if Nixon had, during the 1960 election contest, reached out to King's people, in the manner that JFK did to Mrs. King? Until that point, both Rev. Kings -- Senior and Junior -- were registered republicans. Those southern black citizens who did vote tended to support republican candidates. When the Kings came out for JFK, it changed that dynamic.)

Now, let's fast-forward to April '67, at the time when King delivered his most prophetic message to America. He publicly opposed the war in Vietnam, thus breaking the increasingly strained relationship with LBJ. By identifying those "giant triplets" of militarism, materialism, and racism, King was challenging a heck of a lot more than LBJ's policies on Vietnam -- and the speech could not be mistaken as an endorsement of Johnson's damaged Great Society as such.

King was being pressured to actually run on a presidential ticket with the nation's top "baby doctor." He knew that Nixon was running, on a vague promise to bring peace with honor in Vietnam, and lawn and order to America's cities. Nixon, that snake, would hint that the Great Society programs promoted lawlessness, even riots. This was part of his "southern strategy," to compensate for the loss of the black voters' support.

Hence, a small group -- led by a retired general and a former senator -- pretending to be an independent-from-the-White House organization (but directed by LBJ), came out loudly in support of LBJ's policies in Vietnam. They identified themselves as the "anti-anti-war" advocates. One of their best-known spokesmen was, of course, Harry Truman. Though Harry wasn't about to mention him by name, he was outraged by King's attempts to combine the Civil Rights and anti-war movements. He could not be objective, for he had a major share of the responsibility for the US involvement there.

Red Scare #9 [View all] H2O Man Mar 2015 OP
kick Warren Stupidity Mar 2015 #1
Thanks. H2O Man Mar 2015 #4
Go to church ...or the Devil will take over. L0oniX Mar 2015 #2
"Heaven for the climate, H2O Man Mar 2015 #8
What is this... nuance? Bucky Mar 2015 #3
No, I promise! H2O Man Mar 2015 #10
The Day Joe McCarthy came to DU. leveymg Mar 2015 #51
It's the "Love it or Leave It", "You're with us or against us", "Not as Bad" wing of the party. Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2015 #5
Iraq... Love it or leave it! world wide wally Mar 2015 #9
Outstanding answer. H2O Man Mar 2015 #12
Excellent comment.. You could add to your list of the 'blame game' tactic, 'blame the voters' sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #14
Can we get the pledge flavored with Vanilla? Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2015 #34
I suppose so, but I am resistant to 'loyalty pledges' regardless of how they are flavored! Lol! sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #35
Flavored with Rum or Tequila might be a more effective inducement to oath taking. Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2015 #36
It would take a whole lot of that with a few stronger drugs to get me to take any 'loyalty oaths' sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #40
Even as a drunk & druggie I found them unpalatable and even more so now. Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2015 #43
Great quote from Jefferson. And that is why we have a country AND parties to even fight over, sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #55
But Lemon Pledge keeps your table shiney! hootinholler Mar 2015 #68
+ 1000. nt antigop Mar 2015 #15
and our "outrage" is "manufactured". nt antigop Mar 2015 #16
"vote for the candidate who can win and ignore their record" Martin Eden Mar 2015 #18
Thanks... onyourleft Mar 2015 #21
I don't think they are even pretending this time will be different, any more. djean111 Mar 2015 #26
+1 ! KoKo Mar 2015 #69
I've seen this here, and I don't like it either... ms liberty Mar 2015 #6
Thank you! H2O Man Mar 2015 #23
Alerting. Zorra Mar 2015 #7
Jury Results: H2O Man Mar 2015 #29
I'm fixing this. Few realize that Nixon was a staunch McCartneyist who almost beat Kennedy in 1960. Zorra Mar 2015 #39
The strange thing H2O Man Mar 2015 #44
Your OP's are exactly the length they need to be. Zorra Mar 2015 #56
Exactly. H2O Man Mar 2015 #57
Number NIne, Number Nine, Number Nine zeemike Mar 2015 #11
Right. H2O Man Mar 2015 #31
When I played it backwards, I thought I heard "Paul is a dead man" (perhaps an KingCharlemagne Mar 2015 #45
The end of H2O Man Mar 2015 #52
why can't you write pretty KG Mar 2015 #13
I'll try my best: H2O Man Mar 2015 #32
Thank you... onyourleft Mar 2015 #17
And thank you! H2O Man Mar 2015 #38
Part of it I believe is driven by overconfidence. Rex Mar 2015 #19
And some of it is actually support for neo-liberal policies. sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #20
True and it appears there are a few here that do. Rex Mar 2015 #22
Yes, like Chained CPI eg. Or the support for the continuation of neocon wars. At least we are no sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #25
Well it is sad when all people want is for money to get out of politics and they get yelled at. Rex Mar 2015 #42
Interesting points. H2O Man Mar 2015 #41
I don't think it is the leaders as much as the policy wonks they hire Rex Mar 2015 #46
And then again, a real leader doesn't need policy wonks to tell them how to think. sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #54
Excellent OP, H20 Man Oilwellian Mar 2015 #24
Someone on another thread called Trotsky a 'red Fascist,' so clearly logo- KingCharlemagne Mar 2015 #47
! H2O Man Mar 2015 #59
Right. H2O Man Mar 2015 #58
As always, sane and articulate and taking the long view. Thanks H2O Man. Hekate Mar 2015 #27
Thank you. H2O Man Mar 2015 #60
I skip a lot, trash others. Had my faith almost restored by the responses to FLyellowdog Hekate Mar 2015 #64
I am trying to learn to do that. But sometimes some things require a response, to correct the sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #70
"Your thinking, Sir, H2O Man Mar 2015 #71
excellent contrast using Johnson's 'Great' Society efforts vs. his Vietnam push bigtree Mar 2015 #28
Very good! H2O Man Mar 2015 #61
don't remember Truman and MLK associating bigtree Mar 2015 #62
Fair enough. H2O Man Mar 2015 #66
fascinating bigtree Mar 2015 #67
Excellent OP as always, H20 Man ... sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #30
Thank you. H2O Man Mar 2015 #72
Because happiness is a warm gun seveneyes Mar 2015 #33
Since "half of what I say is meaningless," think I'll just KingCharlemagne Mar 2015 #48
A great song. H2O Man Mar 2015 #73
Excellent post malaise Mar 2015 #37
Thank you! H2O Man Mar 2015 #74
Joseph Heller spoofs the whole 'loyalty oath' segment in "Catch 22" when his KingCharlemagne Mar 2015 #49
"Give me Eat". Major ___de Coverly. Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2015 #50
Holy shit! H2O Man Mar 2015 #53
was written by McCartney in India after he saw two GeorgeGist Mar 2015 #63
k&r... spanone Mar 2015 #65
K&Ring bit late! MannyGoldstein Mar 2015 #75
I missed this one H2O Man.. 2banon Apr 2015 #76
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