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Savannahmann

(3,891 posts)
48. I was going to leave that alone.
Thu Mar 5, 2015, 02:29 PM
Mar 2015

But instead I'll discuss numbers with you. How many soldiers, active duty and reserve do we have? The answer may be surprising when you consider how much money we spend. We have half a million active duty soldiers. We have fewer than two million including reserves and all branches of the military. That includes troops in Korea, Europe, and all other deployed personnel.

If we tried to Federalize the police, that would bring us another two million. That includes all county, city, state, and federal personnel authorized to wear a badge and arrest people.

So right now we have a total of four million. For the sake of argument, let's go with five million for fun.

There are 250 million people in the nation. But for now, to placate you, we'll pretend that none of the other states would object if you marched Federal troops into Alabama to shut down the State Supreme Court and force them to act like you want. That by the way, is a huge stretch of the imagination.

The Southern Poverty Law Center says there are nearly 1,000 known hate groups. Assume that there are at least that many that are unknown because they don't post on the internet. How many of them would sit idly by and take no action when you invade Alabama?

But let's keep it simple. Let's say that one person in ten will object to your actions. Let's say that half of those, or one in twenty will be motivated to take action themselves. Attacking federal employees, attacking federal buildings, or attacking police.

Five percent of the population is more than ten million people scattered across fifty states. Most will be in red states. But how do you propose to deal with an insurgency in the United States when we could never really get an insurgency under control in Afghanistan or Iraq? Especially when early victories will swell their ranks with recruits who are now convinced that the Democratic party and Obama are going to use Martial Law to subvert the Constitution?

Oh we have them out gunned, we have tanks, and helicopters, and drones, and fighter jets that are awesome or something. Yet Tanks, Drone, Helicopters, and awesome fighter jets haven't yet even put a dent in ISIS/ISIL/IS, and they are occupying much less territory than the United States.

Estimates show that there are 90 guns per 100 people in the United States. A vast and overwhelming majority of those are owned by people who are generally speaking opposed to the Democratic Party. That is a lot of guns. So invading Alabama would result in some of those coming out in opposition. How many would come out? Ten, a hundred, a thousand, a million?

As long as your proposed actions remained confined to Alabama, then you could theoretically win. But if it spread to one more state, and there are several it would almost certainly spread to, then the Federal Government would lose. Would Texas remain quiet and obedient when images of Federal troops firing on American Citizens flashed across the web? Georgia? Tennessee? South Carolina? Kentucky? West Virginia? How about Oklahoma, Wyoming, Iowa, Idaho, Mississippi, or Montana? Would every one of the 49 remaining states remain loyal and obedient. Not most of them, every single one of them? Not just the political types, the individuals, the people. How long would we fight for Kansas? How long could we afford to fight for Louisiana? Could we afford to lose the refineries on the Gulf Coast? If we did, how could we fuel those helicopters, tanks, and drones and those awesomely cool fighter jets?

Imagine if President Obama was deposed by a coup. Would you stand by silently and remain loyal to the Government? Or would you go out and protest? Would you go out and drive your car into a crowd of oppressors to try and stop them from destroying the nation? Would you join with a group of people protesting the idea, and attack the police who tried to break up the protest?

The nation would split. It would be a five way civil war. It would be unimaginably awful. Millions would die, and millions more would suffer unimaginably.

Take some time, look at the numbers, and study how things break down. The general rule of thumb on an insurgency is that it takes ten soldiers to fight one insurgent. Do you think that the opponents we're talking about could round up half a million people who believe as they do in this nation? If so, the odds would be even. If they got more, the Federal Government would be outnumbered, assuming we could count on every one of those city, county, and state police officers to support us. Any bets on that?

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

You first. Scootaloo Mar 2015 #1
+1 pinboy3niner Mar 2015 #3
Sending current troops on 4 and 5 combat tours is breaking down the volunteer army. CK_John Mar 2015 #6
So rather than sending no one, how the hell does sending others do anything but continue the crap? uppityperson Mar 2015 #15
It's the policy of military operations that is the problem. NM_Birder Mar 2015 #34
We do not need to fight those wars. The draft upaloopa Mar 2015 #55
youre correct it should be the same people going over and over again - doing tour after tour Romeo.lima333 Mar 2015 #7
The draft does just the opposite. It makes more troops available upaloopa Mar 2015 #56
I done my USMC service in 57-60. CK_John Mar 2015 #5
It's alright, sounds like you've had a long break now it is time to relieve the troops! TheKentuckian Mar 2015 #46
Here's what I have to say about this. stone space Mar 2015 #2
for those who dont know Romeo.lima333 Mar 2015 #8
No. We don't. cherokeeprogressive Mar 2015 #4
We need to stop sending troops abroad Man from Pickens Mar 2015 #9
It would be nice but the world has never been that way and it's time to be practical. CK_John Mar 2015 #10
Right Man from Pickens Mar 2015 #12
Exactly. The answer is not throw more young men and women in but to throw less. uppityperson Mar 2015 #17
For at least the last 10000 yrs there has been wars, get real. CK_John Mar 2015 #19
OK fine, let's get real Man from Pickens Mar 2015 #22
You want some wars then fight and pay for them and I'll do the same. TheKentuckian Mar 2015 #33
The U.S. didn't take good care of WWII veterans? Trillo Mar 2015 #93
I never said that, what are you referring to. CK_John Mar 2015 #94
Let`s start by sending all the chickenhawks. democrank Mar 2015 #11
We need able body troops to rescue our current overburdened armed forces before CK_John Mar 2015 #13
Stop over burdening them then, jack! You act like these actions are for our benefit or something TheKentuckian Mar 2015 #35
What do you call the last 13yrs, peacetime. Not. CK_John Mar 2015 #36
What about the last 13 years tells you more capacity is beneficial? TheKentuckian Mar 2015 #59
Include the children of everyone talking about a draft... cherokeeprogressive Mar 2015 #88
Fuck no. And if the next thing is "make it the same for everyone", how about instead stopping uppityperson Mar 2015 #14
It is never going to happen. CK_John Mar 2015 #20
You don't believe congress will use people appropriately yet believe they will pass a uppityperson Mar 2015 #24
It will be as fair as it needs to be; they did pretty good in the 60's everybody knew their number CK_John Mar 2015 #25
Are you serious? People did not get out of the draft, especially those of political or money connec uppityperson Mar 2015 #27
We can't afford a fair draft hack89 Mar 2015 #16
The money comes with need. CK_John Mar 2015 #21
As evidenced by all the money that has come for vets in need? You mean like that? uppityperson Mar 2015 #62
It's still much too big. alarimer Mar 2015 #47
No. And for those who say this will galvanize folks into demonstrating and voting - guess what? djean111 Mar 2015 #18
US Soldiers Readying for Ukraine Deployment. CK_John Mar 2015 #23
The sure fire solution to problems w/the military is simultaneous wars w/ Russia & Iran leveymg Mar 2015 #28
I said not to send them and want the funding cut. I don't want any reinforcements. TheKentuckian Mar 2015 #38
Are you on your way to Ukraine? Bye! stone space Mar 2015 #61
Or maybe we could quit getting in so many fights? Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2015 #26
You are ready to start a civil war backwoodsbob Mar 2015 #29
Alabama Supreme Court is the one committing insurrection. How far will they carry this situation CK_John Mar 2015 #31
I was going to leave that alone. Savannahmann Mar 2015 #48
No. No draft. SheilaT Mar 2015 #30
Pass. City Lights Mar 2015 #32
Perfection will not get in the way of necessity. CK_John Mar 2015 #37
There is no necessity whatsoever. TheKentuckian Mar 2015 #39
Necessity is in the eye of the beholder. City Lights Mar 2015 #45
As long as we have a voluntary military service, these stupid wars will continue. Paladin Mar 2015 #40
Do you consider children means or ends? stone space Mar 2015 #53
You're making my argument for me. Many thanks. (nt) Paladin Mar 2015 #65
I don't think so. stone space Mar 2015 #74
Speaking of Netanyahu, ... stone space Mar 2015 #57
As the grandma of a 15 year old boy I cringe when the draft is mentioned. But that is the point. One jwirr Mar 2015 #60
Once the Viet Nam draft ended, the anti-Viet Nam war movement disappeared. Paladin Mar 2015 #66
Especially when it comes to who is fighting them. How many of our elected leaders actually have jwirr Mar 2015 #68
For some reason we are supposed to believe that congress will pass an equitable and fair uppityperson Mar 2015 #70
Well I was born during WWII and so far that has not worked out very well. I would be very glad to jwirr Mar 2015 #71
The draft ended in 1/27/73. Direct US military involvement ended 8/15/73. The war ended 4/75. uppityperson Mar 2015 #72
Maybe in your neck of the woods, but not mine. Paladin Mar 2015 #73
You do know that having the draft kept Viet Nam going longer, right? Protests decreased when they uppityperson Mar 2015 #79
Of course the anti-Viet Nam war movement disappeared when the draft ended Art_from_Ark Mar 2015 #86
Wrong. Paladin Mar 2015 #87
Think again Art_from_Ark Mar 2015 #89
Post #72. (nt) Paladin Mar 2015 #91
The last troops from Vietnam arrived home long before August Art_from_Ark Mar 2015 #92
How about instead of figuring out an equitable draft, they figure out how to properly use those who uppityperson Mar 2015 #63
An all-volunteer military invites misuse. Always will. (nt) Paladin Mar 2015 #67
As does a draft. Always will. So how about we work instead on figuring out how to not misuse uppityperson Mar 2015 #69
An all volunteer military should create caution. stone space Mar 2015 #81
Do you consider Dubya's use of the voluntary military to have been "cautious"? Paladin Mar 2015 #82
He used the word in the same Orwellian sense that you use it. (nt) stone space Mar 2015 #83
Whatever. (nt) Paladin Mar 2015 #84
At best those troops would not be ready Savannahmann Mar 2015 #41
Sounds like its time for you to jump on a plane and go to the front lines! dissentient Mar 2015 #42
See Post 5. CK_John Mar 2015 #44
Post 5 is irrelevant. You go. My two daughters and 4 grandchildren will stay here. (nt) stone space Mar 2015 #54
No draft. Period. MineralMan Mar 2015 #43
Maybe... Oubaas Mar 2015 #49
Do you really think the people's will matters any more? I do not. Four years between presidents djean111 Mar 2015 #76
This dumb draftee is against it but the late Colonel Hackworth had an interesting perspective Brother Buzz Mar 2015 #50
Nope. abelenkpe Mar 2015 #51
You want to take someone's kids and make killers upaloopa Mar 2015 #52
No thank you. H2O Man Mar 2015 #58
A draft to be written by what Congress? Orsino Mar 2015 #64
Only a coward would attack somebody's children and grandchildren. stone space Mar 2015 #75
You're not making any since. CK_John Mar 2015 #77
People in this thread are talking about attacking people through... stone space Mar 2015 #78
Hmm... Oubaas Mar 2015 #80
There's nothing quite like die'n for someone else's piece of dirt. L0oniX Mar 2015 #85
I was opposed to the draft during the Vietnam Era HeiressofBickworth Mar 2015 #90
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