General Discussion

Maedhros

(10,007 posts)

12. The United States has been in a state of continual, undeclared "War" since 9/11/2001.

Thu Mar 5, 2015, 04:38 PM

Mar 2015

Civil rights have suffered greatly during this war, like they have in all previous wars. The nature of war nearly always results in the invocation of "extreme measures" to defeat the enemy. In the past the ending of the war has heralded the end of the extreme measures, so the civil rights setbacks have been temporary.

Not any more.

We now have a war that will never end, with an ever-increasing list of "extreme measures" that are necessary to defeat an ever-shifting and growing roster of "terrorists." These "extreme measures" are now standard operating procedure, and will stay in effect until the "war" is over - which doesn't appear to be anytime on the perceptible future.

Hillary as President is guaranteed to continue the state of "war," which means that we are guaranteed to suffer additional "extreme measures" to "keep us safe." She can take largely rhetorical stances on social issues, but if the Government continues to imprison and assassinate people based upon secret laws, secret courts and secret prisons, does it really move us forward?

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Regarding Hillary Clinton [View all] H2O Man Mar 2015 OP

I had a couple of conversations with her on health care. She made an impression on me. Autumn Mar 2015 #1

I've spoken with four H2O Man Mar 2015 #19

I know in my heart that had Hillary won in 2008, we would have had a strong public option Autumn Mar 2015 #23

I was speaking with another H2O Man Mar 2015 #25

But wait, how would she get it past the people that Obama clearly knew he couldnt get it past? NoJusticeNoPeace Mar 2015 #30

Hillary would have fought tooth and nail for it. n/t Autumn Mar 2015 #36

do you think she would have allowed it DonCoquixote Mar 2015 #51

No, I don't believe she would not have backed down on that. Autumn Mar 2015 #52

You mentioned foreign policy - her biggest negative is her track record on war - disqualifying IMHO leveymg Mar 2015 #2

The Neocons love HRC's foreign policy. rhett o rick Mar 2015 #8

I would count her as a neocon, and as a key ally, even if she's not a PNAC signatory. leveymg Mar 2015 #10

I also consider her a neocon. The neocons consider her a neocon. nm rhett o rick Mar 2015 #13

I believe her judgment is open to discussion roguevalley Mar 2015 #14

I agree. H2O Man Mar 2015 #22

cool. :) roguevalley Mar 2015 #57

Hillary Clinton showed terrible judgment on Iraq, or she was willfully complicit Martin Eden Mar 2015 #95

it is pretty horrendous isn't it, Martin Eden? roguevalley Mar 2015 #97

People see what they want to see Martin Eden Mar 2015 #98

Precisely right. Hillary's propensity to shoot herself in the foot knows no bounds. InAbLuEsTaTe Mar 2015 #103

If one uses the correct, H2O Man Mar 2015 #21

"Never-ending war is the shortest route to completing the journey from constitutional democracy, to rhett o rick Mar 2015 #48

Well said. H2O Man Mar 2015 #20

In a Dem Primary, I won't vote for any candidate who was for the IWR Martin Eden Mar 2015 #69

I agree. H2O Man Mar 2015 #90

Hillary's foreign policy stumbles and IWR vote are HUGE negatives, yes, but her Wall Street leanings are just as bad IMHO... InAbLuEsTaTe Mar 2015 #102

I'm not in her camp for economic based reasons (and fracking). mmonk Mar 2015 #3

I've been thinking H2O Man Mar 2015 #24

Well you know me. Excellent idea. mmonk Mar 2015 #49

great idea! Agony Mar 2015 #53

go for it! wordpix Mar 2015 #83

Thanks! H2O Man Mar 2015 #85

You are right about not much being in the media...but here are a few pkdu Mar 2015 #4

Thank you. H2O Man Mar 2015 #27

Not my favorite but it's not like the GOP TBF Mar 2015 #5

Very good! H2O Man Mar 2015 #28

Yes, for Julian Castro. His history and political background is nigh perfect...he's just a bit young libdem4life Mar 2015 #37

Well said... Spazito Mar 2015 #6

Thank you. H2O Man Mar 2015 #32

I disagree. bvar22 Mar 2015 #55

Well said. H2O Man Mar 2015 #60

That was "Teabagger Summer" when all those insane ... bvar22 Mar 2015 #87

k&r... spanone Mar 2015 #7

Thank you. H2O Man Mar 2015 #61

I will likely support the Democratic candidate no matter who that will be. blogslut Mar 2015 #9

Good points. H2O Man Mar 2015 #62

Truly, a lot of intense invective being spewed. byronius Mar 2015 #11

+1 Awesome. bravenak Mar 2015 #54

Great points! H2O Man Mar 2015 #63

The United States has been in a state of continual, undeclared "War" since 9/11/2001. Maedhros Mar 2015 #12

One could argue, with some justification, that GW I never really ended. Jackpine Radical Mar 2015 #64

Valid point. H2O Man Mar 2015 #66

Very important points. H2O Man Mar 2015 #65

Mass media is fanning the flames, thus "the obnoxious-to-toxic flavor." hunter Mar 2015 #15

The media definitely H2O Man Mar 2015 #71

You do realize that some of her "support" is because she is acting at the behest of the President OKNancy Mar 2015 #16

She had a lot H2O Man Mar 2015 #72

I wasn't clear I guess OKNancy Mar 2015 #73

You were clear. H2O Man Mar 2015 #75

While she's not my preferred candidate, she's not Satan's spawn, either. ColesCountyDem Mar 2015 #17

Can I steal that last line please? NoJusticeNoPeace Mar 2015 #33

Be my guest. ColesCountyDem Mar 2015 #34

Our party's worst candidate would still be orders of magnitude better than the best GOP candidate. NoJusticeNoPeace Mar 2015 #35

It bears repeating. ColesCountyDem Mar 2015 #38

can I be in the Amen Corner? Thank you. n/t libdem4life Mar 2015 #39

Let me say it this way NoJusticeNoPeace Mar 2015 #42

The candidates that H2O Man Mar 2015 #74

I like your list, and would add the late Sen. Paul Simon to it. ColesCountyDem Mar 2015 #76

Good addition. H2O Man Mar 2015 #80

Is she for free trade or fair trade? Rex Mar 2015 #18

Right. I agree. H2O Man Mar 2015 #78

Regardless of anything... Oubaas Mar 2015 #26

Agreed. H2O Man Mar 2015 #79

You knew Carter? And you have met Hillary twice? NoJusticeNoPeace Mar 2015 #29

Rubin and I were H2O Man Mar 2015 #41

Thank you, one more if I may. NoJusticeNoPeace Mar 2015 #43

Sure. H2O Man Mar 2015 #46

Oh, guess if I had looked at the credits on the record I would know that, but I didnt, thanks NoJusticeNoPeace Mar 2015 #47

People still love that song. H2O Man Mar 2015 #84

So here it is. Enthusiast Mar 2015 #67

Nice! Thanks! H2O Man Mar 2015 #81

Hell I'll vote for her (if only) because of the made up Benghazi bullshit! B Calm Mar 2015 #31

As the sheep would say...Baaaaaaaaaaaad. Indeed. libdem4life Mar 2015 #40

Kind of the way some white folk reacted to OJ verdict NoJusticeNoPeace Mar 2015 #44

LOL +1 B Calm Mar 2015 #45

Very good! H2O Man Mar 2015 #88

Things I'd like someone to ask her about include, but are not limited to: herding cats Mar 2015 #50

Great questions. H2O Man Mar 2015 #91

Kicking--sane discussion is needed. panader0 Mar 2015 #56

Thank you. H2O Man Mar 2015 #92

KnR H2O Man. Man I would love to meet the people you know! Hekate Mar 2015 #58

Thanks. H2O Man Mar 2015 #93

Strange Fruit from another toxic bandwagon jumper. Beausoir Mar 2015 #59

Do you have a link for that rather astounding assertion? Hekate Mar 2015 #96

Have at it... Beausoir Mar 2015 #104

Hey! You asked for proof...I gave you proof. Step up. Beausoir Mar 2015 #112

We will see everyone with a mother complex project much in this primary. McCamy Taylor Mar 2015 #68

A fine gentleman I know says men who trash Hillary have issues about their self images. greatlaurel Mar 2015 #70

Maybe some do, John Poet Mar 2015 #107

there is a simple reason to that the major new story involves something most feel was wrong karynnj Mar 2015 #77

Good and interesting points. H2O Man Mar 2015 #94

" " " n/t MBS Mar 2015 #99

she has a huge prob with donation$ to the Clinton Foundation from wordpix Mar 2015 #82

Interesting! H2O Man Mar 2015 #86

I don't know where people are getting their numbers from for the Clinton Foundation. Rex Mar 2015 #100

I will rec this awoke_in_2003 Mar 2015 #89

Very good. H2O Man Mar 2015 #108

This is one of the best threads I have seen on DU in a while, frank open discussions, I loved it. Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #101

Right. H2O Man Mar 2015 #109

Thank You Water Guy! kydo Mar 2015 #105

Thank you! H2O Man Mar 2015 #110

Social policy is my main thing - and it's the key point where Hillary repels me daredtowork Mar 2015 #106

Very interesting. H2O Man Mar 2015 #111