General Discussion

Major Nikon

(36,927 posts)

19. Ad hominem, seriously?

Wed Mar 11, 2015, 08:46 PM

Mar 2015

Do you think it's a bad idea for the industry to support university research in areas that are beneficial to both the industry and consumers? Do you even know if Hellmich was collaborating with Monsanto at the time, or did you just dig this up on a google search? Even if he was the very best you have is still ad hominem nonsense.

The National Academy of Science is hardly concerned with your ad hominem accusations. They selected scientists from a broad spectrum, including the industry, to produce an informed result. Had you gone much farther in your ad hominem investigation you would have also found people from universities, the USDA, and the Union of Concerned Scientists all of which were involved in the research.

The allegation, published in the Journal Science suspected a link between bt corn and monarch deaths.
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v399/n6733/abs/399214a0.html

That study destroyed that link. It's been out for over 10 years and nothing has refuted it.

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MoJo: What Did Monsanto Show Bill Nye to Make Him Fall "in Love" With GMOs? [View all] 99th_Monkey Mar 2015 OP

might just be ideology--he's also saying there's that "STEM shortage" MisterP Mar 2015 #1

really? i think he's gone over to the dark side. too bad. i used to like him on seattle tv. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #2

not quite "dark side," don't worry!--but he's a hydraulic engineer and impresario, MisterP Mar 2015 #4

Ah, I see. He's got a BA in mechanical engineering. The "science guy" is an engineer. And ND-Dem Mar 2015 #37

Easy there.... Adrahil Mar 2015 #122

And I have an MS in a science (more closely related to this topic than nye's) and ND-Dem Mar 2015 #123

I imagine a huge salad of 50's and 100's roguevalley Mar 2015 #79

"which have been linked pretty decisively to the decline of monarch butterflies" Major Nikon Mar 2015 #3

It's easier to rant and rave than realize that farmers are trying to grow as much food as possible. HuckleB Mar 2015 #5

Oh baloney. The US pays farmers *not* to grow food to keep prices up, and the only reason ND-Dem Mar 2015 #38

Keep ranting. HuckleB Mar 2015 #67

You don't want to discuss with me because you can't refute the truth. All you have are canned ND-Dem Mar 2015 #78

#Irony. HuckleB Mar 2015 #80

refute it then. without studies from people affiliated with monsanto. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #85

That's been done with you. HuckleB Mar 2015 #86

ditto, huckleberry. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #88

To get a sense why the monarch butterflies are in decline, I called Lincoln Brower, a professor of ND-Dem Mar 2015 #9

So what's the alternative? Major Nikon Mar 2015 #11

The alternative to what? The scientist says that Roundup is the primary cause of Monarch ND-Dem Mar 2015 #13

I'll make it simple for you Major Nikon Mar 2015 #15

Is that 'simple"? You seem to be saying that without GM & Roundup, something *worse* for ND-Dem Mar 2015 #17

It works both ways Major Nikon Mar 2015 #21

first i want to make sure that that is indeed you argument. as for your pirate chart, it's ND-Dem Mar 2015 #22

I've already read everything you're parroting Major Nikon Mar 2015 #29

so you're not even going to tell me if that is indeed what your claim is, that if there weren't ND-Dem Mar 2015 #31

You have it exactly backwards Major Nikon Mar 2015 #39

No more misleading than your claim that corn production has 'skyrocketed,' especially ND-Dem Mar 2015 #41

Series? Major Nikon Mar 2015 #44

"Increased" doesn't = "Skyrocketed". And if it increased because a big corporation lobbied ND-Dem Mar 2015 #46

That seems like it's more to do with monocultural swaths of land Marr Mar 2015 #18

"Genetically engineered crops have increased food output exponentially" ND-Dem Mar 2015 #33

Fine, let us just say "greatly increased food production" then. Marr Mar 2015 #34

Well, I'd say you'd get an argument if you claim GM crops have "greatly increased food production". ND-Dem Mar 2015 #36

I think I'd win the argument. Norman Borlaug's work alone increased the output of Marr Mar 2015 #43

The Green Revolution was 40s-60s, which is what you're referring to. Borlaug didnt do ND-Dem Mar 2015 #45

Here's one work on the subject from a person with credentials. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #56

Hmm-- some interesting information there. Marr Mar 2015 #57

"Particularly the part about genetically modified crops being unavailable... ND-Dem Mar 2015 #60

Huh-- now I can't find it. It must've been in one of the Marr Mar 2015 #66

thanks. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #77

Hardly "destroyed". It said the only variety of GM that would cause a problem is one being phased ND-Dem Mar 2015 #10

Ad hominem, seriously? Major Nikon Mar 2015 #19

I don't think you understand the meaning of ad hominem. And I only looked at the first two ND-Dem Mar 2015 #35

So why did you even bother to bring it up in the first place? Major Nikon Mar 2015 #40

Why did I bother to bring *what* up? Pointing out that some scientists have interests that ND-Dem Mar 2015 #42

Something really green I bet... ananda Mar 2015 #6

Haha.. well played Hutzpa Mar 2015 #7

Must have eaten some Monsanto corns Hutzpa Mar 2015 #8

Evidence FLPanhandle Mar 2015 #12

so what was the evidence? i believe that was the original question. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #14

+1,000,000 ... 000 HuckleB Mar 2015 #20

Here you go. DeSwiss Mar 2015 #52

One picture is not evidence. FLPanhandle Mar 2015 #58

Bill Nye and I share something... Archae Mar 2015 #16

Wow......... Logical Mar 2015 #23

"Nova" is one of the better TV shows, always has been. Archae Mar 2015 #24

I did an eight grade oral report on the Bermuda Triangle. zappaman Mar 2015 #27

So true! nt Logical Mar 2015 #30

Do you also share a BS in Mechanical Engineering? That's the sum total of his science experience. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #47

It's better than... Archae Mar 2015 #49

Certainly. But it's not a degree that gives Nye any relevant qualification to judge the ND-Dem Mar 2015 #50

Tenuous Position ND ProfessorGAC Mar 2015 #59

Certainly a BS in Engineering gives him the right to an opinion, and a general knowledge of ND-Dem Mar 2015 #61

Then We Still Disagree ProfessorGAC Mar 2015 #63

I also have a science degree: at a higher level, and more relevant than nye's. i've done ND-Dem Mar 2015 #64

You keep making this claim, but you keep showing that you don't understand the issue at all. HuckleB Mar 2015 #68

where do you find these people? wingnuts funded by the kochs and monsanto ND-Dem Mar 2015 #89

Oh, brother. HuckleB Mar 2015 #96

If you want to use Koch & Monsanto-linked sources, be prepared to be called on it. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #98

You can connect almost anything to anything. HuckleB Mar 2015 #101

no, you owe *me* an apology. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #103

The lack of shame is astounding. HuckleB Mar 2015 #104

can't stand the heat, eh? your koch references don't hold up to scrutiny eh ND-Dem Mar 2015 #124

And? ProfessorGAC Mar 2015 #69

someone can posit an opinion anytime they want. doesn't mean their opinion is ND-Dem Mar 2015 #90

"Do you also share a BS in Mechanical Engineering? That's the sum total of his science experience." NCTraveler Mar 2015 #106

No, it's the truth. A BS Eng. and some experience working at & consulting with ND-Dem Mar 2015 #112

Understood. NCTraveler Mar 2015 #121

They fed him Experiment #703? Rex Mar 2015 #25

Uh oh... GaltFreeDiet Mar 2015 #84

Movies are so cool. HuckleB Mar 2015 #87

Facts and evidence. Agnosticsherbet Mar 2015 #26

I'm guessing it was scientific evidence. bravenak Mar 2015 #28

I would love to hear the evidence that changed Nye's mind booley Mar 2015 #32

Nye has a BS in Mechanical Engineering. He worked at Boeing after he graduated, before ND-Dem Mar 2015 #48

NYE is a science advocate booley Mar 2015 #71

If you follow the evidence... HuckleB Mar 2015 #72

Uhh are you sure about that? booley Mar 2015 #74

It appears that you don't understand the topic very well at all. HuckleB Mar 2015 #82

right, no one understands the topic very well except the guy who keeps putting ND-Dem Mar 2015 #91

Lots of people understand the topic. HuckleB Mar 2015 #97

ooh, 'despicable' eh? ironic. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #100

No irony. Reality. HuckleB Mar 2015 #102

This thread isn't about Vandana shiva, and you're the only one who brought her into it. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #114

A fat check perhaps ? CentralMass Mar 2015 #51

It's either cash, power or sex. DeSwiss Mar 2015 #53

Or, you know, evidence. NuclearDem Mar 2015 #65

They've been trying to assimilate him to the borg for awhile. I guess they were ND-Dem Mar 2015 #93

Um, I'm vegan and both eat and have no issues with GMOs. NuclearDem Mar 2015 #94

and do you eat organic as well? ND-Dem Mar 2015 #95

Not generally, because the label "organic" doesn't equate to healthier foods. NuclearDem Mar 2015 #107

bill nye thinks it does. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #108

Good for him, but I'm my own man and can make my own decisions based on the evidence. NuclearDem Mar 2015 #109

and him eating organic when organic is 'meaningless' doesn't bring his reliability ND-Dem Mar 2015 #111

I don't know why he eats organic. And frankly, I don't care. NuclearDem Mar 2015 #113

nye the scientist loves organics (which many of our resident DU scientists think = ND-Dem Mar 2015 #115

Again, I don't know why he eats organic foods. NuclearDem Mar 2015 #116

it's only a fallacy if you claim his inconsistency proves his position must be wrong. which ND-Dem Mar 2015 #118

I'm done here. NuclearDem Mar 2015 #119

bye ND-Dem Mar 2015 #120

Youse can have the check or youse can leave. Now youse can't leave Monk06 Mar 2015 #54

Interestingly, my guess was that Nye was vegetarian or vegan, because he has 'the look'. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #55

Debate will continue until all results of putting these gene changes into the environment can be mmonk Mar 2015 #62

You have never advocated for "truth in labeling," just demonization via labeling. HuckleB Mar 2015 #70

How is it demonization? booley Mar 2015 #73

You don't? HuckleB Mar 2015 #81

easy... Monsatin converted him into a Genetically Modified Organism. Kip Humphrey Mar 2015 #75

What could account for such a change? That's some photo of employees with a faux Bill Bow Tie. appalachiablue Mar 2015 #76

So you think Bill is a big sucker! HuckleB Mar 2015 #83

Ha, ha. Not a big sucker, far from it. He seems like a person who knows just what he's doing. appalachiablue Mar 2015 #110

They've apparently been wooing him for some time. ND-Dem Mar 2015 #92

Proof he�s the Science Guy: Bill Nye is changing his mind about GMOs HuckleB Mar 2015 #99

The anti-GM lobby appears to be taking a page out of the Climategate playbook HuckleB Mar 2015 #105

... ND-Dem Mar 2015 #117