General Discussion

bigtree

(94,203 posts)

145. I understand

Thu Mar 19, 2015, 02:07 PM

Mar 2015

...ignoring her own words and rationale for her actions is essential in perpetuating the myth of a vengeful soldier, and essential in denying the service she did for the nation - all that obfuscation and distortion, I suppose, to divert from all of the important revelations of crimes, abuses, and ethical misdeeds you and the government refuse to acknowledge or discuss.

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Give Edward Snowden the Same Deal General Petraeus Got for Leaking Info [View all] bigtree Mar 2015 OP

K&R G_j Mar 2015 #1

Absolutely. Octafish Mar 2015 #2

These are two different cases, Petraeus did not provide files to news sources. Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #3

different, yes bigtree Mar 2015 #5

Nice try marym625 Mar 2015 #35

"gave classified info to the American people"....and China, and Russia, and who knows who else. George II Mar 2015 #49

'and who knows' bigtree Mar 2015 #55

Just because Petraeus was not charged with theft avebury Mar 2015 #6

I am upset over Snowden, others committing crimes does not excuse what Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #22

Given the fact that the US has black sites avebury Mar 2015 #45

Shine a light on dirty little deeds, deeds like those addressed in a law passed in Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #86

That's a very good point - Petraeus faced his accusers and admitted what he did... George II Mar 2015 #51

So did Manning who got tortured and 35 yrs in Leavenworth. riderinthestorm Mar 2015 #62

So, do you think Manning's crime would be worth 35 years in Leavenworth? Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #87

Manning's a whistleblower. No. I don't think her "Crime" warrants this sentence. riderinthestorm Mar 2015 #88

I thought you knew what crime Manning was charged with but here is the info Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #89

Oh I'm 110% aware. We just completely disagree nt riderinthestorm Mar 2015 #90

Disagree with the crime? Well, Manning has been tried and sentenced. Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #92

that's what most people regard as whistleblowing; exposing government wrongdoing bigtree Mar 2015 #93

I got it, I can commit crimes, claim it is whistle blower. Just think we would not Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #94

you're deflecting from the point bigtree Mar 2015 #96

What crimes were those? randome Mar 2015 #116

Bush lying in his justifications for invading Iraq bigtree Mar 2015 #117

The collateral murder video is war and war is hell. randome Mar 2015 #118

what a pathetic summary of excuses bigtree Mar 2015 #119

Geeze, I basically agreed with your third point. randome Mar 2015 #120

firing on rescuers, including children? bigtree Mar 2015 #121

There was a curfew in place and -supposedly- everyone was aware of it. randome Mar 2015 #122

shooting rescuers and children wasn't their 'job' bigtree Mar 2015 #123

Manning would be a whistleblower if... Oktober Mar 2015 #106

she was prosecuted because she ran afoul of the espionage act bigtree Mar 2015 #113

It was physically impossible for him to have read what he released... Oktober Mar 2015 #114

she insisted she knew the content bigtree Mar 2015 #115

It's disingenuous to do basic math? Oktober Mar 2015 #130

I'll assert that if you insist failure to read them was the basis for her conviction bigtree Mar 2015 #131

How can you even have a conversation...? Oktober Mar 2015 #134

are you aware that the point is irrelevant in this case? bigtree Mar 2015 #135

You don't see a problem... Oktober Mar 2015 #138

you've made a judgment based on your own bias bigtree Mar 2015 #140

Aside from flunking basic... Oktober Mar 2015 #141

I consider that a minor point in the broader questions surrounding her dissemination of information bigtree Mar 2015 #142

Of course... Oktober Mar 2015 #144

I understand bigtree Mar 2015 #145

No obfuscation here... Oktober Mar 2015 #146

I guess it depends on the lens you're looking through bigtree Mar 2015 #148

+1 Jamaal510 Mar 2015 #127

Correction. Snowden did not 'run off to Russia' and everytime someone makes that false sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #143

"Run off to Russia" is short-hand for "run off to China"... randome Mar 2015 #149

Now once again, the facts. The US Govt stranded Snowden in Russia. On his way to S.America sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #173

The false claim of Snowden revealing information brought about a law in 2008, Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #150

This message was self-deleted by its author bigtree Mar 2015 #160

Daniel Ellsberg doesn't have any credibility? bigtree Mar 2015 #161

Who is talking about Daniel Ellsberg? I did not mention him in the post Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #163

I gave you the wrong Ellsberg quote, but you're off-base and need some perspective bigtree Mar 2015 #165

Did Snowden work for the NSA? Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #166

dissembling bigtree Mar 2015 #167

The truth is the truth, Snowden worked for a contractor within the NSA. Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #168

most of us don't require a government act to define who we feel are whistleblowers bigtree Mar 2015 #169

Apparently the government has defined who is excluded, this is a fact. Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #170

fuck the government bigtree Mar 2015 #171

Keep whatever opinion you want, it still does not change facts. Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #172

No, YOU stick to facts. First, a majority of the American people view Snowden as a Whistle Blower. sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #174

Let's stick to the facts, a person working in and around NSA is EXEMPT Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #175

the poster is clearly talking about what most regard as 'whistleblowing,' not the flawed law bigtree Mar 2015 #176

You say I have a reading comprehension and you come back with a flawed legistration Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #178

Thank you, excellent post. I have posted polls on this before, and wasnt about to go wasting time sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #179

And make him an advisor as well malaise Mar 2015 #4

That's funny. randome Mar 2015 #9

Betrayus is an advisor malaise Mar 2015 #10

And he shouldn't be, I would agree with that. randome Mar 2015 #11

Betrayus was a failure in Iraq. bvar22 Mar 2015 #18

Bear in mind that Petraeus is/was a general who lost a war Fumesucker Mar 2015 #12

He needs to be out. Period. Why he's 'advising' is beyond me. randome Mar 2015 #14

Snowden appears to be happy living in Freedom and Security in Russia. Agnosticsherbet Mar 2015 #7

Agreed. To do otherwise is rank hypocrisy. AtomicKitten Mar 2015 #8

Sigh... no. gcomeau Mar 2015 #13

his leaks were the only impetus for the calls for reform of the intelligence system today bigtree Mar 2015 #16

And if he'd left it at that, like I said, I might agree. gcomeau Mar 2015 #20

that's the state of opposition to his actions bigtree Mar 2015 #23

Generalizations? gcomeau Mar 2015 #27

harm done? bigtree Mar 2015 #33

He. Compromised. The. Intelligence. Penetration. gcomeau Mar 2015 #40

no. one. has. proven. that. bigtree Mar 2015 #41

It. Was. Confessed. To. gcomeau Mar 2015 #42

bull. shit. bigtree Mar 2015 #44

Yeah, that's funny. gcomeau Mar 2015 #53

so he provided the internet addresses that our NSA had been hacking? bigtree Mar 2015 #63

You must be joking. gcomeau Mar 2015 #68

you must be joking bigtree Mar 2015 #70

You mean governments spy on EACH OTHER???? GASP!!!!!! gcomeau Mar 2015 #72

you dismiss the spying, saying everyone does it bigtree Mar 2015 #77

Ok, seriously, are you trolling me? Just be honest. gcomeau Mar 2015 #133

Let's get busy with that confession link. DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2015 #50

Enjoy gcomeau Mar 2015 #54

that article doesn't support your claims of a 'confession' bigtree Mar 2015 #59

Yeah... it does. gcomeau Mar 2015 #61

that's not a Snowden confession bigtree Mar 2015 #66

Thanks for the link DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2015 #60

How do you feel about Petraeus giving top secret info... grasswire Mar 2015 #65

Try actually reading my first reply here. -eom gcomeau Mar 2015 #69

You're wasting your time. Major Hogwash Mar 2015 #79

Yeah, but I just can't help myself... gcomeau Mar 2015 #177

LOL, Petraeus wasn't committed knowingly and deliberately??? nt Logical Mar 2015 #56

Didn't say that. gcomeau Mar 2015 #71

Could have been a maybe ,,,, if Cryptoad Mar 2015 #15

the US government is behaving like a communist nation in its pursuit and prosecution of the man bigtree Mar 2015 #17

And should he receive some of the same punishment given by the Russian authorities Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #24

no bigtree Mar 2015 #25

If one opposed Putin they are killed. Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #26

ooh, Putin pablum bigtree Mar 2015 #36

Not me, I did not run to Russia Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #37

I assume you're not at risk bigtree Mar 2015 #83

I have been in a position in which I couldhave been charged with espionage, Thinkingabout Mar 2015 #85

It's that 'comrade' shit again... blackspade Mar 2015 #34

The soul of a 72-year old with the mind of someone much, much younger. DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2015 #47

I call all my buds in Russia , Comrade..! Cryptoad Mar 2015 #58

What can of worms would that be? blackspade Mar 2015 #110

Good for you,,,,, Cryptoad Mar 2015 #124

Sure...once he shows up to the bar of the court. nt msanthrope Mar 2015 #19

That's my position: I'm not against a similar deal on the similar charges alcibiades_mystery Mar 2015 #100

Snowden might start by hiring Petraeus' attorneys Blue_Tires Mar 2015 #21

Yes, the ACLU. Such a bunch of mooks.... riderinthestorm Mar 2015 #73

But the ACLU haven't gotten a deal done, have they? Blue_Tires Mar 2015 #78

Lol! Nice try but no dice. When your options are Manning's treatment or Drakes riderinthestorm Mar 2015 #81

Manning was tried under UCMJ which isn't applicable here... Blue_Tires Mar 2015 #84

And Snowden is charged under the Espionage Act of 1917 . . . markpkessinger Mar 2015 #97

Actually. ....it's unclear if the ACLU are Snowden's lawyers or merely msanthrope Mar 2015 #111

Ben Wizner is his attorney and you know that riderinthestorm Mar 2015 #132

Ben Wizner is not a criminal defense attorney. He is not listed on the federal docket msanthrope Mar 2015 #139

Go ahead and tell Snowden to complain about Wizner to the bar association riderinthestorm Mar 2015 #147

Why would Snowden complain about Wizner? Look, the lawyer he should be complaining about is msanthrope Mar 2015 #152

Because Wizner isn't a criminal defense attorney!!11!! riderinthestorm Mar 2015 #154

Exactly. blackspade Mar 2015 #28

That would involve change obxhead Mar 2015 #29

Dont think Petraeus gave the Chinese & russians anything secret. 7962 Mar 2015 #30

you can't know where Petraeus' info went. grasswire Mar 2015 #67

I CAN know that Snowden had a helluva lot more than Petraeus did. 7962 Mar 2015 #74

Petraeus gave the names of covert agents and conversations with the President neverforget Mar 2015 #82

questions, questions, questions... grasswire Mar 2015 #91

You dont think the govt already knows the answer to those questions? 7962 Mar 2015 #95

you seem to be willing to believe the authorities about any criminality... grasswire Mar 2015 #99

Yeah--void that deal and put Petreus in jail, too. MADem Mar 2015 #31

I keep seeing this same meme over and over..... blackspade Mar 2015 #38

Lots of people accuse Snowden of lying. No one, I mean NO ONE, can back those claims. DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2015 #48

Because the Chinese and Russians would be motivated to announce their advantage? MADem Mar 2015 #107

You have GOT to be kidding. You really think they just left him alone?? 7962 Mar 2015 #108

So the answer to my question is "no" blackspade Mar 2015 #109

So your opinion is that its just mere speculation? Then what do you think the odds are? 7962 Mar 2015 #125

The fact is that it's speculation. blackspade Mar 2015 #126

this nation will benefit from the reforms sparked by Snowden's revelations bigtree Mar 2015 #39

Patreus is a traitor and belongs in prison MohRokTah Mar 2015 #32

+1 about Petraeus but Manning is where she belongs, in prison. cstanleytech Mar 2015 #46

If Patreus doesn't have to sit his days out in prison, than neither should Manning. MohRokTah Mar 2015 #102

First off Manning isnt a traitor nor are Patreus or Snowden unless one of them gave cstanleytech Mar 2015 #103

I disagreed with the deal Petraeus was given and I disagree with giving Snowden a similar deal. cstanleytech Mar 2015 #43

How about Bradley Manning? midnight Mar 2015 #52

You mean Chelsea? I suspect there are limited options. cstanleytech Mar 2015 #104

I'm fairly certain an offer is probably on the table for Snowden and has been all along... Chan790 Mar 2015 #57

This is a fascinating post. I plan to mull this over for a bit. riderinthestorm Mar 2015 #76

What exactly would they prosecute Julian Assange for? He isnt an american citizen and if he wasnt in cstanleytech Mar 2015 #105

Two points: Chan790 Mar 2015 #128

I generally agree with your post except as to Wikileaks.... msanthrope Mar 2015 #112

Highly recommend. n/t Jefferson23 Mar 2015 #64

Yeah I just heard a few heads exploding from the logic of that and no way to refute it. Rex Mar 2015 #75

Well, there is, actually. They aren't similarly situated. msanthrope Mar 2015 #151

Wouldn't he be tried by a military court, thinking about it they are different. Rex Mar 2015 #155

No--Petraeus wasn't charged by the military because he was CIA head when the offenses took place. nt msanthrope Mar 2015 #159

Oh okay, I thought he was active military the entire time. Rex Mar 2015 #162

There almost certainly won't be any deal Blue_Tires Mar 2015 #80

Great post . . . markpkessinger Mar 2015 #98

Yep. The authoritarians gravitate to the side with the most official sounding title. GoneFishin Mar 2015 #137

The Definition of Cognitive Dissonance Demeter Mar 2015 #157

k/r 840high Mar 2015 #101

Once again it's not what you do, right or wrong. DirkGently Mar 2015 #129

In the interest of fair treatment, I think they should both be prosecuted. Sheepshank Mar 2015 #136

Snowden's act of whislteblowing has made a significant positive impact for American Citizens 2banon Mar 2015 #153

I regret that I have only One REC to give to this article! Demeter Mar 2015 #156

Nothing like a mention of Snowden SwankyXomb Mar 2015 #158

Issue Snowden a uniform and a chest covered with tinware and it would be a done deal. K&R Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2015 #164