General Discussion

MADem

(135,425 posts)

76. In some countries men get leave and the kid is with a parent for up to YEAR....

Tue Mar 24, 2015, 01:38 AM

Mar 2015

It's taking off in more countries as well.

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2011/jul/19/norway-dads-peternity-leave-chemin

Norway, the fatherland
Paternity leave law helps to create more equal households

In France, Audun Lysbakken would probably pass for a rather offhand politician. Last autumn after the birth of his daughter, the Norwegian minister of childhood, equality and social cohesion took four months' paternity leave. Lysbakken changed nappies, did the shopping and cooked for 16 weeks while his wife went back to work. "I wanted to spend time with my baby and show that important though work is, it does not justify shying away from family responsibilities," he said. "Being at home means taking care of little things and big ones, knowing when the baby has eaten, knowing her habits, putting away her clothes, being there when she smiles for the first time."

Lysbakken is not especially original in this. A few weeks after he left on paternity leave, the justice minister, Knut Storberget, also took three months' paternity leave to take care of his baby, Ingrid. "A few years ago this would have been fairly controversial," said Lysbakken with a smile. "But today it's quite the opposite. Now not taking paternity leave would be controversial. In 20 years people's mentality has really changed.

"Norwegians think it normal for fathers to spend time with their children. If we want women to have equality in the workplace, we have to share the responsibilities in the home better."

In Norway this family revolution has a name: pappapermisjon. After every birth, the parents both benefit from a two-week leave and then divide up the 46-week parental leave paid at 100%, or alternatively, 56 weeks paid at 80%. In this way Norwegian babies spend their first year with both their parents. To encourage men to take care of their children, a special 10-week quota is reserved for them. If they are reluctant to take pappapermisjon, they lose the 10 weeks, since the time can't be transferred to the mother and the whole family loses out. The results have been spectacular. In Norway, 90% of fathers take at least 12 weeks' paternity leave.

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Clever girls, stupid boys? [View all] DavidDvorkin Mar 2015 OP

even when boys' work is just as good, the higher grade is more likely to go to a girl Romeo.lima333 Mar 2015 #1

Brace yourself. DavidDvorkin Mar 2015 #2

did i crack open pandora's box Romeo.lima333 Mar 2015 #3

Post ho ergo prompter hoc LanternWaste Mar 2015 #10

What evidence do you have for that? n/t pnwmom Mar 2015 #26

that's what it said in the article Romeo.lima333 Mar 2015 #48

Yeah, the article said it, but did the study, really? Adrahil Mar 2015 #50

Even today, men dominate the sciences. Perhaps we know why. yes we do Romeo.lima333 Mar 2015 #53

WTF? Adrahil Mar 2015 #69

women shouldnt let sexist asshats define their future Romeo.lima333 Mar 2015 #71

Shut up, you Patriarch. AngryAmish Mar 2015 #32

How about because girls have to be twice a good to get half as far? alarimer Mar 2015 #4

That's not what this study shows. DavidDvorkin Mar 2015 #5

Why is there a wage gap? Major Nikon Mar 2015 #6

Because discrimination is in no way related to the circumstances of most womens' lives... antigone382 Mar 2015 #18

And men are expected to work more hours in less favorable conditions Major Nikon Mar 2015 #19

Difference being one is formally financially compensated and the other is not. antigone382 Mar 2015 #20

Which goes into the same household income Major Nikon Mar 2015 #23

Oh good, I'll just let my hypothetical husband do the earning for me. antigone382 Mar 2015 #24

Or alternatively, we could address gender disparities so everyone has a chance to earn an income... antigone382 Mar 2015 #25

In my household there were no such disparities Major Nikon Mar 2015 #27

I'm glad for your individual, anecdotal experience, comprising a single data point in a sea of stats antigone382 Mar 2015 #28

As was yours Major Nikon Mar 2015 #36

I haven't yet referenced my personal experience. antigone382 Mar 2015 #39

I could care less if you do Major Nikon Mar 2015 #45

I see your point. antigone382 Mar 2015 #54

Oh, SNAP! chervilant Mar 2015 #77

Most European countries have the same wage gap we do davidn3600 Mar 2015 #47

I think the specific cases and studies I referenced to paint a picture of discrimination. antigone382 Mar 2015 #55

Who exactly do you want to write that check, though? davidn3600 Mar 2015 #73

I think there are different ways of structuring that. antigone382 Mar 2015 #74

In some countries men get leave and the kid is with a parent for up to YEAR.... MADem Mar 2015 #76

LOL, it's not the fities anymore. bettyellen Mar 2015 #42

shh Tuesday Afternoon Mar 2015 #58

unless you know somebody snooper2 Mar 2015 #16

"Girls are more likely to be better behaved in class" DirkGently Mar 2015 #7

Famous movie lines #823 Fumesucker Mar 2015 #8

This is a serious problem. But it's not politically correct to talk about it. davidn3600 Mar 2015 #9

men are not going to college less. their numbers are not escalating like womens. seabeyond Mar 2015 #11

Excellent point. Of course, as usual, DirkGently Mar 2015 #13

+1 Starry Messenger Mar 2015 #21

Judging from the men whining about this, you are right. alarimer Mar 2015 #40

I think zero-sum thinking is hard-wired. DirkGently Mar 2015 #56

it's interesting because when men act selfishly they often cite women as the reason- they need more bettyellen Mar 2015 #62

if we are talking biological, i would say more survival. with a greater income of more, seabeyond Mar 2015 #63

Cooperative society calls for different values DirkGently Mar 2015 #66

well, ya. and that is exactly the point. we do not have to eat so fast. we can slow down. seabeyond Mar 2015 #67

distinction without a difference. woolldog Mar 2015 #33

Thank you Seabeyond Matariki Mar 2015 #43

There is a lack of women in STEM. You don't think that's a problem that should be addressed? DanTex Mar 2015 #12

I didn't say it wasn't a problem davidn3600 Mar 2015 #15

If they're being denied access, then yes. If they're choosing other majors, then no. n/t lumberjack_jeff Mar 2015 #31

Both factors are in play. And they are related. DanTex Mar 2015 #35

Testosterone! The most lethal substance on earth. hunter Mar 2015 #14

PEOPLE are often stupid. DavidDvorkin Mar 2015 #17

gee if mercuryblues Mar 2015 #37

you do not know how hard i had to fight for my two boys RIGHT to be smart while in middle school seabeyond Mar 2015 #38

nope- it's just that more women and minorities are going, and somehow this bettyellen Mar 2015 #44

You get out what you put in? Starry Messenger Mar 2015 #22

Naw, it couldn't be that. Jamastiene Mar 2015 #51

It must be our fault that boys don't do homework either Starry Messenger Mar 2015 #59

Yes, they will say we distract them too much. Jamastiene Mar 2015 #61

exactly women. i finally went in and read the damn thing, and ya. and the men are saying in this seabeyond Mar 2015 #64

I don't think those types will ever "get it." Jamastiene Mar 2015 #65

Exactly right. lumberjack_jeff Mar 2015 #29

when I was a little boy we use to say dumb old girls. . . B Calm Mar 2015 #30

Girls rule; Boys drool. MineralMan Mar 2015 #34

Is it too late for this? Matariki Mar 2015 #41

Or maybe they are just smarter? treestar Mar 2015 #46

Yes, the author confuses ability and performance. Karia Mar 2015 #72

I look forward to your Ops. trumad Mar 2015 #49

... Jamastiene Mar 2015 #52

Clever girls. Stupid article. eom. Tuesday Afternoon Mar 2015 #57

here is the thing. for the last two decades i have been knee deep in this, seabeyond Mar 2015 #60

I got something completely different from the actual OECD link where they discuss the survey stevenleser Mar 2015 #68

I raised a boy and a girl... one_voice Mar 2015 #70

Hmmm.... Wella Mar 2015 #75