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merrily

(45,251 posts)

88. The description of that battle was not a matter of translating 1 or 2 words or a filling in one

Sat Mar 28, 2015, 02:19 AM

Mar 2015

"lacuna" in a particular way. (I question the existence of an "accurate" way to fill in a lacuna anyway, but that is a different story). So, I don't know that your comment about the King James version applies to my post to Nye, though it probably applies in other contexts. Conversely, I don't know that that any translation of the Bible that is agenda free says a lot about abortion or inducing miscarriages, let alone about imposing a duty on believers to make sure the secular laws of the places they may live prohibit and contraceptives and abortion. Or the rhythm method.

I am not a Biblical scholar, but I have met at least one person who specialized in differentiating among various translations and people like him debate which translation is most accurate. So, accuracy of various translations is subjective, to a degree. And, since I'd have to take someone else's opinion on which version is the most accurate, I'd just as soon make my own choice. At least I can explain my reason for my own choice.

I understand the objections to the King James, but use it for a particular reason. I think most who produce a new "translation" of the Bible have one or more agenda. The same may well have been true of the King James translators. However, their agendas are probably mostly moot at this point, while more modern translators have more modern agendas.

For just one example, from a lay person, there are all kinds of variations and nuances that words and phrases have, so subjectivity enters in in many translation choices, even if you have no agenda. Moreoever, meanings and nuances change over time. "Don we now our gay apparel" can convey something today that it did not even hint at when the carol was first penned.

Only God knows (pun intended) what was in the minds of the first people to write down various things that we now consider part of the Bible. And who knows how many iterations existed in the original ancient Hebrew and Greek before the documents modern scholars work from.

So, for the reason stated above, I will stick with the King James.

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what the bible says about abortion: [View all] niyad Mar 2015 OP

Are you expecting extremist Christians to read the Bible? get the red out Mar 2015 #1

I know, how silly of me. comes from an insufficient caffeine intake today. niyad Mar 2015 #2

Or any fundie preacher stealing $s from his flock erronis Mar 2015 #18

Don't expect fundie Christians to pay any attention to Numbers and Leviticus Yupster Mar 2015 #61

They're hypocrites though. They throw out the dietary stuff while hammering on Lev 18:22. nomorenomore08 Mar 2015 #75

They do have an explanation for that. However, whenever I post it, I get treated as though I merrily Mar 2015 #81

They always claim the prohibition against homosexuality is still active, while the other stuff isn't nomorenomore08 Mar 2015 #82

There is an answer for that, too, but, it's time consuming to give and, as stated, I've learned merrily Mar 2015 #84

The one NT passage they can cite is Romans 1:27-32. But those are Paul's words, not Christ's. nomorenomore08 Mar 2015 #85

The position I referred to is not a one passage argument or I would have cited it. merrily Mar 2015 #90

DAYUM! calimary Mar 2015 #3

ouch! another question: guillaumeb Mar 2015 #4

thank you. funny how their jesus is so different from the one most of us have heard of- niyad Mar 2015 #6

Well, indirectly.. Jesus did speak about abortion, Motown_Johnny Mar 2015 #26

He stated that he came to fulfill and perfect the Law. guillaumeb Mar 2015 #29

... awoke_in_2003 Mar 2015 #47

the bible book they redacted guillaumeb Mar 2015 #57

Actually no. Check this out... nomorenomore08 Mar 2015 #76

Years ago, I encountered a translation of the bible that omitted Hosea 13:16 arcane1 Mar 2015 #5

whenever I hear someone using the bible as a basis for whatever, I ask which one of the niyad Mar 2015 #7

Exactly.. sendero Mar 2015 #19

What a humane and enlightened assemblage of fairytales. hifiguy Mar 2015 #8

The talmud does specifically reference abortion, actually. Kber Mar 2015 #9

My late MIL was no scholar but she certainly knew about this. She said to me.... Hekate Mar 2015 #11

it also tells you what to do if your dog violates your cleaning lady--it's prepared for EVERY MisterP Mar 2015 #34

What's the prescribed "remedy"? Just curious. nomorenomore08 Mar 2015 #77

Oh those Hebrews.. mountain grammy Mar 2015 #35

A minister's job is to give a sermon in safeinOhio Mar 2015 #10

I knew it... ileus Mar 2015 #12

Numbers says all we need to know... uponit7771 Mar 2015 #13

Numbers, chapter 5 explains how a priest should do an abortion perdita9 Mar 2015 #14

When the day cometh that it become immoral and criminal to force a woman to carry an unwanted Dont call me Shirley Mar 2015 #15

Great references from the one reference they say they will always stand behind Jon82 Mar 2015 #16

Most fundamental Christians Cryptoad Mar 2015 #23

Matthew 18:6 says nothing about harming a child ProdigalJunkMail Mar 2015 #17

There are many Bibles versions. Cryptoad Mar 2015 #22

there are plenty of 'iffy' things if you pick and choose ProdigalJunkMail Mar 2015 #31

Beyond taking liberty, I would call it lying. I read the referenced passages. Shrike47 Mar 2015 #116

I was trying to be nice about it, but you are Right,,,,,, nt Cryptoad Mar 2015 #125

There are over 41,000 Christian Sects,,,,, it unfair Cryptoad Mar 2015 #20

no offense angrychair Mar 2015 #25

Matthew 18:6 sulphurdunn Mar 2015 #21

It really is.....but then, mentioning the significance of the fact....... WillowTree Mar 2015 #27

Yes, and there is certainly sulphurdunn Mar 2015 #93

I just can't get over the sacrificing the 1st born . Fla Dem Mar 2015 #24

you think this is about sacrificing ProdigalJunkMail Mar 2015 #32

Consecration is not the same as sacrifice. colorado_ufo Mar 2015 #33

The firstborn was to be dedicated to the service of God, not killed. merrily Mar 2015 #78

1st born animals too? How does that work? nt Fla Dem Mar 2015 #94

My Bible says something different in Numbers 5:21. appleannie1 Mar 2015 #28

I aslo recall ending someone's pregnancy being a lesser punishment Bradical79 Mar 2015 #30

Such death of a fetus is mentioned a couple of times in the bible happyslug Mar 2015 #40

Only one of these verses is from the New Testament which is the only part former9thward Mar 2015 #36

See my cite below, I had to stop after looking up the first three "Cites" happyslug Mar 2015 #39

Oh the context argument again phil89 Mar 2015 #43

If you throw out phil89 Mar 2015 #41

I'm not throwing out anything. former9thward Mar 2015 #44

Cannibalism of live children? A Simple Game Mar 2015 #37

You really thought the verses quoted in the OP were real? former9thward Mar 2015 #45

Perhaps not word for word, but yes I do think they are really from the bible. A Simple Game Mar 2015 #50

I have a Bible. former9thward Mar 2015 #53

To be honest I was mainly concerned with the cannibalism. A Simple Game Mar 2015 #62

For the sake of honesty, okasha Mar 2015 #80

The Old Testament is full of violence because that era in human history former9thward Mar 2015 #89

I'm sure they cooked them first. Enthusiast Mar 2015 #49

Well to be honest it does say the children should eat their parents too. n/t A Simple Game Mar 2015 #51

Sounds like a nice book. Enthusiast Mar 2015 #52

That would be Ezekiel 5:10 and a couple of others. Cerridwen Mar 2015 #65

What a bad set of bibical quotes... happyslug Mar 2015 #38

And you think phil89 Mar 2015 #42

Bible hub is just what it sounds like. Cerridwen Mar 2015 #60

Actually it depends on the translations, is it still in copyright? happyslug Mar 2015 #131

Leviticus does not say that oberliner Mar 2015 #46

It's all serious distortion trying to make it say what they want to be able to claim that it says. WillowTree Mar 2015 #48

I would agree with that oberliner Mar 2015 #99

which version? niyad Mar 2015 #96

Take your pick oberliner Mar 2015 #100

there are some 500 versions out there. niyad Mar 2015 #101

Leviticus is the basis of the anti-gay thing, right underpants Mar 2015 #54

Leviticus 20, which starts with forbidding sacrificing children... happyslug Mar 2015 #132

May God bless and keep you all... onpatrol98 Mar 2015 #55

Here's a picture depicting exactly how much I care what the bible or any other religious text says PeaceNikki Mar 2015 #56

I tried turning the paper over guillaumeb Mar 2015 #58

That side depicts how much our government should care. PeaceNikki Mar 2015 #59

nice guillaumeb Mar 2015 #63

that is exactly as it should be. niyad Mar 2015 #106

The OP is lying. Matthew 18:6--see text below: Wella Mar 2015 #64

The image in the OP is wrong about Matthew 18:6. Cerridwen Mar 2015 #66

I'll check out the others, verse by verse. But the OP and the image are lying Wella Mar 2015 #67

The image has some issues. The OP is mistaken, not lying. Cerridwen Mar 2015 #68

so what about the other 11 citations? hobbit709 Mar 2015 #83

I suspect that the author of the poster is taking most of the verses quoted out of context or just jwirr Mar 2015 #92

again, to which of the some 500 versions out there do you refer? niyad Mar 2015 #105

The bible, a tabloid book of tales chosen for political impact of that day! n/t RKP5637 Mar 2015 #69

+1000 smirkymonkey Mar 2015 #70

Hey. Niyad. sheshe2 Mar 2015 #71

wow. PeaceNikki Mar 2015 #72

oh my, had not realized. thank you so much for letting me know. niyad Mar 2015 #107

This message was self-deleted by its author sheshe2 Mar 2015 #73

Thanks to all who went to the trouble of debunking this! Nye Bevan Mar 2015 #74

It is not completely debunkable because the Bible does say some of those things. At least, merrily Mar 2015 #79

The King James version isn't that good a translation. winter is coming Mar 2015 #87

The description of that battle was not a matter of translating 1 or 2 words or a filling in one merrily Mar 2015 #88

of course, since the bible was not originally written in english, and most of us niyad Mar 2015 #126

I did specify exactly which version I meant and please see also Reply 88. merrily Mar 2015 #130

you mean, thanks to the people who were using one of the other 500 versions? niyad Mar 2015 #98

Okay. Well you know most people probably have no idea of the full Gospel canon. Rex Mar 2015 #86

my favourite comment about the bible: "it is amazing that white europeans follow niyad Mar 2015 #97

LOL! Rex Mar 2015 #114

and then, of course, we have the thomasine and marian gospels. niyad Mar 2015 #108

Kickin' Faux pas Mar 2015 #91

K&R! marym625 Mar 2015 #95

RIghtwing asses hate abortion because it is a woman making a choice on her own NoJusticeNoPeace Mar 2015 #102

that is exactly correct. niyad Mar 2015 #103

That is it exactly! smirkymonkey Mar 2015 #129

I'm soooooooo tired of the freakin' bible. nt valerief Mar 2015 #104

especially when it is being used to promote legislation in a secular nation. it would be amusing niyad Mar 2015 #109

Yeah. Too bad the blind can't see their own reflection. (No offense to visually valerief Mar 2015 #124

So sorry, but WHY was the earlier Jesus thread locked, but this one thrives? Atman Mar 2015 #110

I have no idea to which thread you are referring. must have missed it. niyad Mar 2015 #111

Might have been because Willie P posted it. Atman Mar 2015 #112

thank you for posting the link. I had not yet seen it. niyad Mar 2015 #113

Oh, and if this all Biblical and God and stuff...why can't they get the date right? Atman Mar 2015 #115

new vacation schedule? n/t ProdigalJunkMail Mar 2015 #117

HE IS RISEN! Atman Mar 2015 #118

oh, so because we try to superimpose our solar calendar ProdigalJunkMail Mar 2015 #119

"People like me." Atman Mar 2015 #121

essentially... ProdigalJunkMail Mar 2015 #122

BWHAHA! So now it's "disdain." Atman Apr 2015 #135

Quit knocking the Roman Empire..... happyslug Apr 2015 #133

So, Jesus goes fishing one day. Atman Mar 2015 #120

Now THAT is a good walkin' on water joke... ProdigalJunkMail Mar 2015 #123

oh dear, you almost owed me a keyboard. niyad Mar 2015 #127

my favourite walking on water joke: niyad Mar 2015 #128

So Jesus and Moses go golfing one day Yupster Apr 2015 #134

always liked it. back when I first heard it, "but he thinks he's arnold palmer" niyad Apr 2015 #136