General Discussion

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)

55. What I have a big problem with here on DU

Reply to DemocratSinceBirth (Original post)

Thu Apr 23, 2015, 05:51 PM

Apr 2015

is the canonization of Hillary, and how those of us who have serious doubts about her suitability to be President, keep on being told that She's Inevitable, and we need to just sit down and shut the fuck up.

I do NOT think she's indistinguishable from whoever the Republican candidate will end up being, but she is much too right of center to make me happy. Right now she's sort of saying all the right things to make her look like a Progressive, or a real candidate of the people, but I am not convinced she is either of those things.

And most of all I do NOT want a coronation. I want a genuine primary season, with at least three or four other good candidates. If she survives that to get the nomination, I'll stop complaining about her. And while I won't vote for the Republican candidate, I will not vote for her with any enthusiasm.

I also happen to live in a very blue state, so I could simply choose not to vote the Presidential line on the ballot. One of the reasons I so hate the Electoral College crap.

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To DU members who oppose Hillary Clinton [View all] DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 OP

OK, Issues it shall be. With credit to another DUer: NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #1

That's legitimate criticism and the criticism you levy deserves to be vigorously debated./NT DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #2

How is that legit criticism? JaneyVee Apr 2015 #34

Her record shall be her demise. She changes statements to suit her audience. NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #89

+1000 Katashi_itto Apr 2015 #114

Exactly right. Hillary's record shows she's always late to the party or a no-show altogether when it comes to progressive isues. InAbLuEsTaTe Apr 2015 #154

Looks like quote mining. Buzz cook Apr 2015 #166

Businesses and corporations dont create jobs? Telcontar Apr 2015 #180

Semantics Buzz cook Apr 2015 #188

Well said. Thanks for posting. nt el_bryanto Apr 2015 #6

Her 2016 platform hasn't even been released. procon Apr 2015 #38

I will not be weighing campaign rhetoric very heavily. merrily Apr 2015 #66

Do you expect her to have policies that don't appeal to the voters? procon Apr 2015 #76

Yes. tazkcmo Apr 2015 #84

Certainly she has a long political history. procon Apr 2015 #94

Her campaign rhetoric will be in keeping with today's issues, but I don't expect a change in merrily Apr 2015 #98

+1 And, she was in the public eye (and on the board of WalMart) even before that. merrily Apr 2015 #95

Apparently, you did not understand my post. merrily Apr 2015 #92

Anything is possible. nt procon Apr 2015 #96

Trust me. Hillary Clinton will make Obama look like a socialist. NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #131

Not too stupid to mesh with progressive, just not interested in us, she's a corporatist. NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #80

Simple solution: just find another candidate who's more electable. procon Apr 2015 #88

That's exactly what we are doing. nt NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #90

Who is more electable? procon Apr 2015 #101

Too soon to tell. Carter looked very electable running against Reagan: NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #115

It's not too soon. procon Apr 2015 #120

Someone like Warren would do well with less money, appeal to a very broad demographic. NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #121

They really don't have that much recognition. procon Apr 2015 #125

Appeal as measured among people who know her. Different from name recognition. NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #127

Anything is possible; best of luck then. nt procon Apr 2015 #130

Everybody in Iowa knows WHO Sanders and Warren are, bvar22 Apr 2015 #174

There are more than two choices... I hate liars Apr 2015 #93

Hillary versus a Fighter for the Middle Class. FMC would trounce her. nt NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #116

if you take politicians at their word, they will take you. yurbud Apr 2015 #152

+1000 jonno99 Apr 2015 #161

Yes. 840high Apr 2015 #168

NOT "Idle conjecture" bvar22 Apr 2015 #173

Well Spotted! imthevicar Apr 2015 #43

NYC SKP SoapBox Apr 2015 #48

What s/he said.^^^^ zentrum Apr 2015 #52

Such shallow criticism. joshcryer Apr 2015 #72

Are these "Party Planks"? bvar22 Apr 2015 #184

And "trust" is a character trait demwing Apr 2015 #74

Thank You. bvar22 Apr 2015 #79

I was going to ask how sad it is that off the top of my head I can add issues to the list hootinholler Apr 2015 #123

Anybody who still thinks there is no difference between Hilary (or any other Democrat) and a world wide wally Apr 2015 #156

Can you please document with links those DUers who say: bvar22 Apr 2015 #175

Apparently you didn't read the first reply to this OP world wide wally Apr 2015 #181

As with other DUers, we do know how the attacks from their side works and we do know how to ignore monmouth4 Apr 2015 #3

Thank's for helping to make the OP's point. William769 Apr 2015 #5

Hmm, he said SHOVING down throat...OK< so a republican who WILL win if we dont vote for our NoJusticeNoPeace Apr 2015 #54

The hatred shown was my point also the point of the OP. William769 Apr 2015 #62

Their was no hatred shown demwing Apr 2015 #82

How to express my reaction to the hyperbole of your post w/o getting into trouble? 1monster Apr 2015 #110

I did not see hatred. 840high Apr 2015 #169

I saw no "hatred". bvar22 Apr 2015 #176

No one is trying to shove her down your throat. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #126

Excellent OP. cwydro Apr 2015 #4

We don't need "character attacks to the Republicans" We just need to shout out their records libdem4life Apr 2015 #7

Fact based - GOPs especially on their anti-American Iliyah Apr 2015 #59

KnR sheshe2 Apr 2015 #8

What, in your opinion, are MannyGoldstein Apr 2015 #56

When GOP's Broken Clock tells the correct time twice a day 99th_Monkey Apr 2015 #9

motive is as important as the facts Sheepshank Apr 2015 #12

And if they attack her on policies it invalidates that for us. zeemike Apr 2015 #85

That's my point exactly. 99th_Monkey Apr 2015 #105

I limit my criticisms to policy issues. Maedhros Apr 2015 #10

Agreed - they are already attacking her so this is not going to be an easy win. jwirr Apr 2015 #11

Look what they did to Kerry and Obama. DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #14

If HRC wins the Democratic Primary I wonder how the GOP/RW/Libertarian Iliyah Apr 2015 #40

What is worse ? Turning your opponent into a joke or a miscreant? DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #46

on the contrary, I think it will be a comfortable win. which is why she should be pushed to Doctor_J Apr 2015 #22

On that I also agree with you. What I was referring to was the so called scandals that the Rs are jwirr Apr 2015 #26

It's unrealistic to expect a comfortable win in today's political landscape BainsBane Apr 2015 #29

I have been hearing "Your Slow steady message" for 50 years. In that time the "Leadership"of the Vincardog Apr 2015 #111

What slow, steady message? BainsBane Apr 2015 #119

I want the Democratic Party Platform to include: 1 Federal financing of all Federal Elections. Vincardog Apr 2015 #134

Great BainsBane Apr 2015 #136

IA is a caucus state, I have already started the Discussion with my local Democratic party Vincardog Apr 2015 #138

I tend to be issue oriented, but I am damned tired of being told what to post and what not to post. merrily Apr 2015 #13

i believe it was a request. DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #16

Potayto, pohtahto. merrily Apr 2015 #18

I am sad./NT DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #20

I as well. merrily Apr 2015 #24

Why?/NT DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #28

I haven't seen DU threads calling her a lesbian, witch, or murderer yurbud Apr 2015 #15

I have seen her called a witch here DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #19

Not fer nuttin, but the TOS apply to pm's as well. merrily Apr 2015 #25

I didn't even come close to suggesting you were the poster who called her a witch... DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #32

The disclaimer was not for your benefit. Obviously, you know I was not the poster involved. merrily Apr 2015 #35

I swear on a stack of Bibles it wasn't you. DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #37

I totally believe you that I didn't post that! merrily Apr 2015 #39

PS About pm's, They are not private. They are subject to perusal. merrily Apr 2015 #44

Wow, TY DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #49

I imagine you can ask Skinner in Ask the Admins. merrily Apr 2015 #63

There has been some very ugly stuff BainsBane Apr 2015 #36

GOPers got a smoking gun on Benghazi, seriously. Iliyah Apr 2015 #45

I often can't tell if people are serious around here anymore BainsBane Apr 2015 #47

Its not a joke. Iliyah Apr 2015 #65

Well, I am sorry then BainsBane Apr 2015 #69

I can't think of what that would be apart from stuff that would tar both parties yurbud Apr 2015 #151

Clinton cash is coming from a right wing source, but the bigger question is what is the truth? karynnj Apr 2015 #64

How is that a big question? BainsBane Apr 2015 #67

I agree completely that the best answer is getting all money out of politics karynnj Apr 2015 #73

Okay BainsBane Apr 2015 #75

....and maybe some of us just resent the Vote that killed a MILLION Iraqis. bvar22 Apr 2015 #83

A legitimate concern BainsBane Apr 2015 #107

"Stepford wife" is my favorite. joshcryer Apr 2015 #78

We need to be aware of the objective basis for some of the negatives the GOP is putting out leveymg Apr 2015 #17

If there is a basis in right wing criticism of Clinton, it is not in either Benghaaaazi or in... Buzz cook Apr 2015 #167

I don't ride that way (personal attacks). mmonk Apr 2015 #21

agreed cali Apr 2015 #23

Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2015 #27

I don't believe the GOP attacks for the most part Politicalboi Apr 2015 #30

Your fight is not with us. Baitball Blogger Apr 2015 #31

It was a request and not a fight. DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #42

I posed the question on DU in 2007 is Obama a ploy to take HILLARY OUT ? orpupilofnature57 Apr 2015 #33

I just hope that people question every attack made against Hillary. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #41

The Ed Show just did a whole segment based on "Clinton Cash" procon Apr 2015 #61

I don't watch him so I don't know if he is a fan or not of Hillary but he should know better. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #68

He very likely does - but that does NOT mean there is no issue there karynnj Apr 2015 #77

Carville's response was spot on. procon Apr 2015 #81

If it is a smear, NO -- if it is something that really is poor judgment or worse, then it needs to karynnj Apr 2015 #87

In his spare time, bvar22 Apr 2015 #91

Oh my, how very Reaganesque of him. nt procon Apr 2015 #102

Issues are issues... Oktober Apr 2015 #50

I agree with you that Republicans will do what they can to stop any Democrat karynnj Apr 2015 #51

There are members right here on DU that post nothing but relentless hit pieces on HRC. Lil Missy Apr 2015 #53

What I have a big problem with here on DU SheilaT Apr 2015 #55

brings back bad memories of 2007-08 carolinayellowdog Apr 2015 #103

+1. NRaleighLiberal Apr 2015 #104

I have a similar problem Art_from_Ark Apr 2015 #109

People have told you to sit down and be quiet? hrmjustin Apr 2015 #113

Basically, yes. SheilaT Apr 2015 #158

We advocate for her just like you advocate against her. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #160

My concern is that those advocating for her SheilaT Apr 2015 #164

I am concerned that some are blinded by their dislike of her. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #165

AMEN!!! Laser102 Apr 2015 #57

We have at least two Benghazi comments in this thread BainsBane Apr 2015 #58

So why nominate a candidate when we already know that Republicans JDPriestly Apr 2015 #60

I'm On The Same Page... AND ChiciB1 Apr 2015 #97

What if "character" IS an issue? demwing Apr 2015 #70

I Think I'm Missing Your Point... ChiciB1 Apr 2015 #71

7 elections, 4 of which we won. Warren DeMontague Apr 2015 #86

In all the reading of DU I have yet to see the post some claim are rampant here. zeemike Apr 2015 #99

"it is something she was involved in" Warren DeMontague Apr 2015 #100

She was SOS... zeemike Apr 2015 #106

Oh bull. Warren DeMontague Apr 2015 #122

It was tragic... DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #128

That is not what she is responsible for. zeemike Apr 2015 #135

ambassadors ambassadate. That's their job. Warren DeMontague Apr 2015 #137

She has no culpability...only responsibility. zeemike Apr 2015 #143

He knew the risk. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #139

I am sure he did. zeemike Apr 2015 #141

It means that he took the risk and unfortunately he died. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #142

And she made the decision...and is responsible for that only. zeemike Apr 2015 #144

And that means? hrmjustin Apr 2015 #145

Just what it says...it is not that hard to understand. zeemike Apr 2015 #147

And does this disqualify her in your view? hrmjustin Apr 2015 #148

Not at all. zeemike Apr 2015 #149

No one is censoring anything. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #150

Benghazi was a backwater embassy, far from the Capital Embassy in Tripoli. bvar22 Apr 2015 #177

There were several Republican led inquiries of Benghazi and they all clear her of any malfeasance. DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #118

Well of course it is harassment...what did you expect? zeemike Apr 2015 #140

You can always start an op on her and Benghazi if you want. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #124

Well I don't want to...it is a non issue IMO zeemike Apr 2015 #132

My pleasure. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #133

Most of the "attacks" on Clinton are issue based eridani Apr 2015 #108

I would not oppose any Dem or I who wants to run project_bluebook Apr 2015 #112

so nice to see this marym625 Apr 2015 #117

I used to love checking Pollster polls to see Obama catching up to HRC's big lead NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #153

ha! marym625 Apr 2015 #155

Some people think that the candidate became official when she announced, that we should "lockdown". NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #157

ABSOLUTELY! marym625 Apr 2015 #159

After Iowa where even Edwards beat her, I agreed. bvar22 Apr 2015 #178

yep marym625 Apr 2015 #183

Yes. bravenak Apr 2015 #171

Thanks bravenak! marym625 Apr 2015 #182

Oh yeah? I kinda like it. bravenak Apr 2015 #185

lol! marym625 Apr 2015 #186

Always. bravenak Apr 2015 #187

The purists always attack Hillary with the latest right wing lie workinclasszero Apr 2015 #129

What you said, and good luck with that. Hekate Apr 2015 #146

Well you're definitely promote Hillary, with almost every post! Nt Logical Apr 2015 #162

I comment on a veritable potpourri of topics but this topic is dear to my heart. DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2015 #163

I've noticed. 840high Apr 2015 #170

I oppose HRC LWolf Apr 2015 #172

You're being unrealistic about the primary process. Jim Lane Apr 2015 #179