General Discussion

joshcryer

(62,536 posts)

45. So it was OK to pass those trade agreements then?

Thu May 14, 2015, 07:35 AM

May 2015

And not now? When the world is 100x more interconnected and 90% of the goods you buy on a given day are made in foreign countries? Really?

The means of production have not changed substantially. Shit, even FDR was a multi-millionaire back then. The only substantial difference is that the income gap is larger but it's hardly significant enough to merit defending world trade then vs now.

I think FDR fucked up at Bretton Woods. Big deal. If he went with the International Clearing Union concept that Keynes proposed we probably would not be looking at the same income / wealth gap that the world is experiencing.

But regardless the gap is closing (yes, it is closing), making it academic at this point. What's done is done.

FDR fucked up and there are repercussions to this day. So what. People are fallible. Can't we just accept history and not bury our heads in the sand?

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Meet the Father of Free Trade. [View all] Drunken Irishman May 2015 OP

Yes, but his trade agreements were about the import and export of real products. They were not jwirr May 2015 #1

He heavily taxed corporations and the rich people who owned them and regulated those corporations pampango May 2015 #30

Exactly. That's the key. Hoyt May 2015 #54

Yes, but I don't know that those people will not just leave the country if we try that now. They jwirr May 2015 #65

Let em leave and good riddance; they just need to forfeit their assets. That'd be fine with me. InAbLuEsTaTe May 2015 #66

I agree. jwirr May 2015 #67

They might. Probably not. They have not left Europe, Canada, etc. in any significant way. pampango May 2015 #69

Yes,that is true. jwirr May 2015 #71

Exactly. He wouldn't be very pleased with oil companies getting billions of free dollars raouldukelives May 2015 #70

Lulz Jesus Malverde May 2015 #2

+1 joshcryer May 2015 #15

True that. nt okaawhatever May 2015 #3

Lol, not even a 'nice try'. sabrina 1 May 2015 #4

FDR's view of free trade was that brentspeak May 2015 #5

Thank you.^^^ RiverLover May 2015 #8

I don't think it's so much "ignorance" as it is Art_from_Ark May 2015 #56

He created the WTO and IMF. joshcryer May 2015 #11

How old are you, again? MrMickeysMom May 2015 #21

Um, FDR created the IBRD and IMF. joshcryer May 2015 #31

Yeah, josh…. I am... MrMickeysMom May 2015 #75

Complete revisionism. FDR does not equal Obama. FDR undetstood the Exilednight May 2015 #79

The WTO dates from 1994. GATT was established in 1948. Roosevelt was kind of dead by then. Scootaloo May 2015 #59

GATT was part of FDR's ITO. It was supposed to be a temporary organization to facilitate trade until pampango May 2015 #64

I have often thought that we would be much better off if each region provided jobs and products jwirr May 2015 #68

Yes. moondust May 2015 #73

Cant add anything to that excellent history lesson. hifiguy May 2015 #84

Who can argue with that? I guess the investor courts and the intellectual property provisions are neverforget May 2015 #6

The Father of Free Trade was the first man to be run over by a locomotive muriel_volestrangler May 2015 #7

FDR passed WTO and IMF. joshcryer May 2015 #14

Fear of the unknown is a hard fear for some to overcome. Major Hogwash May 2015 #9

bzzzt Flailing fail. falling down drunk fail. cali May 2015 #10

The WTO and IMF "bear little resemblance" to NAFTA? joshcryer May 2015 #12

Trade deals have become less and less, since NAFTA, about the nuts and bolts of cali May 2015 #16

No…. the poster DOES NOT get it... MrMickeysMom May 2015 #22

Do you support the WTO and IMF? joshcryer May 2015 #25

WTO (IBRD) and IMF are inherently NOT protectionist. joshcryer May 2015 #36

focus, josh- and try to respond to the facts: cali May 2015 #62

He sure shut up quickly. Bonobo May 2015 #76

This is TWM level discussion. joshcryer May 2015 #13

Say what, josh? I thought FDR was long dead in 1995 when the WTO cali May 2015 #17

Even the GATT negotiations didn't start until 1946 muriel_volestrangler May 2015 #23

IBRD was the foundation for WTO. joshcryer May 2015 #28

The World Bank? it's quite a different beast (nt) muriel_volestrangler May 2015 #35

IBRD is the BANK. joshcryer May 2015 #38

Yes, and that is not, in any form, GATT, the WTO, or free trade agreements muriel_volestrangler May 2015 #39

How does this happen without IBRD or the IMF? joshcryer May 2015 #40

The IMF is about international monetary stability muriel_volestrangler May 2015 #51

Bretton Woods Conference joshcryer May 2015 #26

Trying to use FDR to bolster your argument cali May 2015 #48

Yes, Josh and the world is exactly like it was back then too! Bonobo May 2015 #18

hey,didn't you know that FDR came back from the dead in 1995 cali May 2015 #20

The world is far more interconnected. joshcryer May 2015 #27

Yeah, so what? Bonobo May 2015 #44

So it was OK to pass those trade agreements then? joshcryer May 2015 #45

Now you are talking a different conversation. Bonobo May 2015 #50

So FDR is irrelevant to the 21st century? Is that the new liberal point of view? pampango May 2015 #34

I'd argue that in many ways, he isn't very germane cali May 2015 #37

Hoo boy. The spinning is growing ever more desperate. marmar May 2015 #19

Another lie. 99Forever May 2015 #24

"FDR was the father of modern globalization, a fact that both modern Democrats and Republicans choose pampango May 2015 #29

+1 joshcryer May 2015 #33

We don't live in that world. It's less than honest to pretend we do cali May 2015 #41

You are right. We don't live in the same world that FDR did. We live in the world he helped create. pampango May 2015 #47

The benefits are taxed, and can be taxed more. Hoyt May 2015 #55

Are you insane? Taxes? The repukes are in the process of eliminating taxes on the wealthy and Elwood P Dowd May 2015 #77

They are taxed, although as I've said, the regs need to be tightened. As to insanity? Hoyt May 2015 #78

FDR opposed FASCISM Octafish May 2015 #32

FDR used the power of the state to control corporations and the rich. He also proposed pampango May 2015 #43

ITO isn't WTO Octafish May 2015 #52

Never said that it was. It would have been much better than the WTO. pampango May 2015 #61

Well that makes it okay then... Feron May 2015 #42

But did he take away tariffs that protected industry using Americans to build products? cascadiance May 2015 #46

That is exactly what he did. pampango May 2015 #49

You got to quote the 1936 GOP platform to connect FDR to supporting TPP? Octafish May 2015 #53

No. My response was to a post about tariffs. TPP has little to do with tariffs which are already low pampango May 2015 #58

Kindred spirits. nt Romulox May 2015 #82

Good thing this is not a history test, FDR is NOT the father of free trade. Rex May 2015 #57

YAwn ...another FDR hater. L0oniX May 2015 #60

If that means somewhere there's a fucked up stepdad... cherokeeprogressive May 2015 #63

This message was self-deleted by its author moondust May 2015 #72

Meet the Mother of Inane OPs whatchamacallit May 2015 #74

Nothing with FDR qualifies under "inane" fadedrose May 2015 #81

Yes, it was a response to whatchamacallit May 2015 #83

That isn't John C. Calhoun MFrohike May 2015 #80