Welcome to DU!
The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards.
Join the community:
Create a free account
Support DU (and get rid of ads!):
Become a Star Member
Latest Breaking News
Editorials & Other Articles
General Discussion
The DU Lounge
All Forums
Issue Forums
Culture Forums
Alliance Forums
Region Forums
Support Forums
Help & Search
General Discussion
In reply to the discussion: Why Edward Snowden Belongs in Prison [View all]Hissyspit
(45,790 posts)58. Why?
https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2015/06/14/sunday-times-report-snowden-files-journalism-worst-also-filled-falsehoods/
Whats the problem with that Sunday Times passage? Its an utter lie. David did not visit Snowden in Moscow before being detained. As of the time he was detained in Heathrow, David had never been to Moscow and had never met Snowden. The only city David visited on that trip before being detained was Berlin, where he stayed in the apartment of Laura Poitras.
The Sunday Times journalists printed an outright fabrication in order to support their key point: that Snowden had files with him in Moscow. This is the only fact included in their story that suggests Snowden had files with him when he left Hong Kong, and its completely, demonstrably false (and just by the way: its 2015, not 1971, so referring to gay men in a 10-year spousal relationship with the belittling term boyfriends is just gross).
Then theres the Sunday Times claim that Snowden, a former contractor at the CIA and National Security Agency (NSA), downloaded 1.7m secret documents from western intelligence agencies in 2013. Even the NSA admits this claim is a lie. The NSA has repeatedly said that it has no idea how many documents Snowden downloaded and has no way to find out. As the NSA itself admits, the 1.7 million number is not the number the NSA claims Snowden downloaded they admit they dont and cant know that number but merely the amount of documents he interacted with in his years of working at NSA. Heres then-NSA chief Keith Alexander explaining exactly that in a 2014 interview with the Australian Financial Review:
AFR: Can you now quantify the number of documents (Snowden) stole?
Gen. Alexander: Well, I dont think anybody really knows what he actually took with him, because the way he did it, we dont have an accurate way of counting. What we do have an accurate way of counting is what he touched, what he may have downloaded, and that was more than a million documents.
Lets repeat that: I dont think anybody really knows what he actually took with him, because the way he did it, we dont have an accurate way of counting. Yet someone whispered to the Sunday Times reporters that Snowden downloaded 1.7 million documents, so like the liars and propagandists that they are, they mindlessly printed it as fact. Thats what this whole article is.
Then theres the claim that the Russian and Chinese governments learned the names of covert agents by cracking the Snowden file, forcing MI6 to pull agents out of live operations in hostile countries. This appears quite clearly to be a fabrication by the Sunday Times for purposes of sensationalism, because if you read the actual anonymous quotes they include, not even the anonymous officials claim that Russia and China hacked the entire archive, instead offering only vague assertions that Russian and China have information.
Beyond that, how could these hidden British officials possibly know that China and Russia learned things from the Snowden files as opposed to all the other hacking and spying those countries do? Moreover, as pointed out last night by my colleague Ryan Gallagher who has worked for well over a year with the full Snowden archive Ive reviewed the Snowden documents and Ive never seen anything in there naming active MI6 agents. He also said: Ive seen nothing in the region of 1m documents in the Snowden archive, so I dont know where that number has come from.
The Sunday Times journalists printed an outright fabrication in order to support their key point: that Snowden had files with him in Moscow. This is the only fact included in their story that suggests Snowden had files with him when he left Hong Kong, and its completely, demonstrably false (and just by the way: its 2015, not 1971, so referring to gay men in a 10-year spousal relationship with the belittling term boyfriends is just gross).
Then theres the Sunday Times claim that Snowden, a former contractor at the CIA and National Security Agency (NSA), downloaded 1.7m secret documents from western intelligence agencies in 2013. Even the NSA admits this claim is a lie. The NSA has repeatedly said that it has no idea how many documents Snowden downloaded and has no way to find out. As the NSA itself admits, the 1.7 million number is not the number the NSA claims Snowden downloaded they admit they dont and cant know that number but merely the amount of documents he interacted with in his years of working at NSA. Heres then-NSA chief Keith Alexander explaining exactly that in a 2014 interview with the Australian Financial Review:
AFR: Can you now quantify the number of documents (Snowden) stole?
Gen. Alexander: Well, I dont think anybody really knows what he actually took with him, because the way he did it, we dont have an accurate way of counting. What we do have an accurate way of counting is what he touched, what he may have downloaded, and that was more than a million documents.
Lets repeat that: I dont think anybody really knows what he actually took with him, because the way he did it, we dont have an accurate way of counting. Yet someone whispered to the Sunday Times reporters that Snowden downloaded 1.7 million documents, so like the liars and propagandists that they are, they mindlessly printed it as fact. Thats what this whole article is.
Then theres the claim that the Russian and Chinese governments learned the names of covert agents by cracking the Snowden file, forcing MI6 to pull agents out of live operations in hostile countries. This appears quite clearly to be a fabrication by the Sunday Times for purposes of sensationalism, because if you read the actual anonymous quotes they include, not even the anonymous officials claim that Russia and China hacked the entire archive, instead offering only vague assertions that Russian and China have information.
Beyond that, how could these hidden British officials possibly know that China and Russia learned things from the Snowden files as opposed to all the other hacking and spying those countries do? Moreover, as pointed out last night by my colleague Ryan Gallagher who has worked for well over a year with the full Snowden archive Ive reviewed the Snowden documents and Ive never seen anything in there naming active MI6 agents. He also said: Ive seen nothing in the region of 1m documents in the Snowden archive, so I dont know where that number has come from.
Edit history
Please sign in to view edit histories.
Recommendations
0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):
94 replies
= new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight:
NoneDon't highlight anything
5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
RecommendedHighlight replies with 5 or more recommendations
"Funny, Snowden despised leakers & those who put spies' lives at risk until *this* President was
Cha
Jun 2015
#3
Good that our site's resident Tories put so much faith in the anonymous Tory sources over there...
villager
Jun 2015
#77
I'm pretty sure that most people are able to focus on more than one story at any given time.
LanternWaste
Jun 2015
#72
I know it. But anybody that sounds as though their mom still does their laundry shouldn't really be
GoneFishin
Jun 2015
#16
Yep. If there weren't rogue spying activities being carried out against innocent Americans, and
GoneFishin
Jun 2015
#18
And This Is Why Hillary Will Have Difficulties... Nobody Is Buying This Crap Anymore...
WillyT
Jun 2015
#25
We aren't buying your crap and the anonymous sources that pushes this crap.
Luminous Animal
Jun 2015
#32
I am waiting for the new set of lies Snowden will be telling next, I am sure he will have a
Thinkingabout
Jun 2015
#36
Oh, please, your evidence is anything a right-wing British government and anonymous intelligence
Hissyspit
Jun 2015
#71
After having lived through the Iraq War and the garbage stenography that made it to the front pages
Hissyspit
Jun 2015
#78
I used to think I had a pretty Manichean view of the world but the denizens of this board
DemocratSinceBirth
Jun 2015
#83
Well, the American people have already made up their minds about the idiot. And "hero" doesn't.....
Tarheel_Dem
Jun 2015
#84