Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

LWolf

(46,179 posts)
171. Yes.
Mon Jun 22, 2015, 12:59 PM
Jun 2015

I think it's a reaction to threat; I've experienced it myself, although not about guns.

I think anytime we think that someone is threatening our autonomy we react defensively, and, in more extreme cases, offensively. It triggers an amygdala hijack.

It happens to all of us; when our emotions are engaged, reason is often short-circuited. Political and religious propaganda of all types take full advantage of this phenomenon.

People who live in fear and hate are particularly susceptible to this kind of manipulation. Which doesn't, of course, excuse acts of hate. I think hate is a mental illness, which is why I won't use the word lightly, and I do my best not to engage in hate.

Those obsessed with guns live in a state of fear and insecurity, and their guns can't cure them of that.

It might be a good conversation to talk about the purpose of, and a reasonable interpretation of, the 2nd amendment.

What was the original purpose? Does that purpose still apply, or is there another reasonable purpose?

"Arms" have evolved; what kind of "arms" fulfill the original OR evolved purpose of the 2nd amendment, and in what context?

I don't really have any answers. I've never owned a gun. I've been more concerned with other rights.

I'd have thunk it should be up to the church Cheese Sandwich Jun 2015 #1
Really? Like taxes, maybe? WinkyDink Jun 2015 #121
That's my thought. NaturalHigh Jun 2015 #176
Shouldn't that be up to the church and congregation if they allowed it? theycallmetrinity Jun 2015 #2
sure seems like the obvious answer. the band leader Jun 2015 #116
It seems to me that Jesus and Guns would not mix... kentuck Jun 2015 #117
Jesus got tortured and nailed to a cross. Maybe if he had had a gun... the band leader Jun 2015 #118
That probably makes a lot of sense... kentuck Jun 2015 #119
Why shouldn't a person be allowed to carry a firearm in church exactly? the band leader Jun 2015 #120
Churches are for worship. kentuck Jun 2015 #125
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, the band leader Jun 2015 #129
When you lose your common sense... kentuck Jun 2015 #131
when you lose you're right to self defense... the band leader Jun 2015 #132
When you are so paranoid that you cannot go to church without a weapon... kentuck Jun 2015 #134
yeah, because nobody ever needs to defend their life while sitting in church the band leader Jun 2015 #141
For some folks, there should be no "gun-free" zones... kentuck Jun 2015 #143
and then on the opposite end of the spectrum, there are folks like you the band leader Jun 2015 #149
What do "mass murdering psychopaths" have in common? kentuck Jun 2015 #154
complete disregard for gun control laws? the band leader Jun 2015 #189
Mine was the first multi-racial wedding in the county where I grew up in decades. ieoeja Jun 2015 #185
WWRJD LastLiberal in PalmSprings Jun 2015 #183
Why? We have laws that apply to all businesses and all citizens. Why not all churches? WinkyDink Jun 2015 #122
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise the band leader Jun 2015 #130
What if half the congregation is against guns in the church? kentuck Jun 2015 #140
the Church's board of trustees can figure it out. the band leader Jun 2015 #145
I forgot my Bible but I brought my gun... kentuck Jun 2015 #148
.... the band leader Jun 2015 #150
Should be up to the church. cherokeeprogressive Jun 2015 #3
Should it be a unanimous vote or.... kentuck Jun 2015 #6
Private property rights... beevul Jun 2015 #14
What about smoking? theycallmetrinity Jun 2015 #29
Incorrect parallel. beevul Jun 2015 #41
I'm just gauging where you stand on private property rights theycallmetrinity Jun 2015 #48
You didn't answer the question. beevul Jun 2015 #52
I never thought democracies were a good idea theycallmetrinity Jun 2015 #69
Welcome to DU, theycallmetrinity! calimary Jun 2015 #44
I'll probably make some enemies here but cigarette smokers theycallmetrinity Jun 2015 #61
I agree. So glad my husband finally gave it up. calimary Jun 2015 #72
Yes, and that's coming from a puff fiend . Welcome !!! orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #51
Please don't take my other post personal about smokers theycallmetrinity Jun 2015 #67
At the end of the day I have a pocket full of butts, the least I can do after putting extra smog in orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #73
You are one of the few theycallmetrinity Jun 2015 #79
many churches are owned by the congregation dsc Jun 2015 #93
I did not know churches were direct democracies. cherokeeprogressive Jun 2015 #75
It should be up to the pastor and board Travis_0004 Jun 2015 #82
The Church of the AK-47 Holy Rollers.... kentuck Jun 2015 #83
Should smoking be up to the bar owner? theycallmetrinity Jun 2015 #39
No opinion. Put that in your pipe and smoke it. cherokeeprogressive Jun 2015 #76
Jeanne Assam supports the right to carry in church. nt Nuclear Unicorn Jun 2015 #4
Same as the confiscation question, Not Me !!! A place for Holy spirit not for making spirits holes, orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #5
Thanks! kentuck Jun 2015 #8
I support the right of any private property owner to allow or bar firearms as petronius Jun 2015 #7
I'd rather see snakes in a church than guns... kentuck Jun 2015 #9
That's what Harrah's Reno says MurrayDelph Jun 2015 #31
Good for them! cherokeeprogressive Jun 2015 #78
Except when ? orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #49
Except when what? If you're referring to my last sentence, what I meant petronius Jun 2015 #63
OK, GOOD POINT ! That's why we need to scrutinize people carrying guns professionally . orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #70
Private property rights supersede everything? kentuck Jun 2015 #84
No, private property rights do not "supersede everything" petronius Jun 2015 #87
What do they not supersede? kentuck Jun 2015 #89
I gave an example in the post you replied to, it's the ten words petronius Jun 2015 #90
Good answer... Spatened Jun 2015 #88
It should be the decision of the governance board/authorites of the churches. aikoaiko Jun 2015 #10
No guns allowed on blood donors, even cops. The cops are almost always cool about it. brewens Jun 2015 #11
I have a suggestion. Cleita Jun 2015 #12
"I'd like to think I'm safe from some moron legally endangering my life and person. " kentuck Jun 2015 #16
The horse is way out of the barn on that one. aikoaiko Jun 2015 #17
Wow, my red state actually held off on that particular insanity until 2004. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jun 2015 #33
+ 1000 Well Put !!!!!! orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #50
"Registration" can not keep the guns out of the hands of sociopaths. beevul Jun 2015 #55
That's why I suggest we tackle this from a different perspective. Cleita Jun 2015 #60
If businesses can ban firearms on their premises CanonRay Jun 2015 #13
I think a church would have an obligation to to keep their Cleita Jun 2015 #15
Praying: "Wait a minute, God.." kentuck Jun 2015 #18
I went into bars up in Alaska back in the sixties that you had to surrender Cleita Jun 2015 #42
I think Wyatt Earp might have come closest to a solution? kentuck Jun 2015 #53
I think many towns in the developing West at the turn of the last century came Cleita Jun 2015 #57
+ 1000 !!! orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #80
A church might have a role in promoting the concept of vulnerability HereSince1628 Jun 2015 #24
How come you can't bring a loaded weapon to a gun show gwheezie Jun 2015 #19
I'll bet they don't allow guns inside the grounds of the republi-CON Convention next summer. calimary Jun 2015 #35
Most of the gun shows I've been to, allow concealed carry/open carry. beevul Jun 2015 #43
Not in virginia gwheezie Jun 2015 #94
Any of them loaded? gwheezie Jun 2015 #95
If I remember right they were. beevul Jun 2015 #114
Good point and a So. Carolina State Senator said the same yesterday. Cleita Jun 2015 #45
No. I support Rocket Launchers and Flamethrowers though. Possibly Nuclear Hand Grenades. Katashi_itto Jun 2015 #20
The First Congregation of Saint Truckasaurus Warren DeMontague Jun 2015 #25
:) Katashi_itto Jun 2015 #37
My choice is the holy hand grenade nadinbrzezinski Jun 2015 #54
If a killer rabbit is on the loose, Art_from_Ark Jun 2015 #190
What about fruit? sarisataka Jun 2015 #65
+1000! Katashi_itto Jun 2015 #81
What are you doing in a Church safeinOhio Jun 2015 #21
No, not ever, at any time. onecaliberal Jun 2015 #22
Why would a church be any different from any other building? Warren DeMontague Jun 2015 #23
Like schools, hospitals, gun shows gwheezie Jun 2015 #96
I'm not defending the "right" of people to bring guns into any building they want. Warren DeMontague Jun 2015 #97
I'm not trying to argue gwheezie Jun 2015 #98
NOT me. NOT EVVVVER! calimary Jun 2015 #26
The Republicans keep screaming forefather this and forefather that... Frustratedlady Jun 2015 #27
Actually, the 'founding fathers' knew of semi-auto weapons. X_Digger Jun 2015 #104
You caught me! I knew that didn't sound right... Frustratedlady Jun 2015 #106
It gets forgotten a lot. We seem to think that our generation has / had all the ideas (good or bad). X_Digger Jun 2015 #107
The NRA does and that stance supports them finacially Person 2713 Jun 2015 #28
The church is not robbing you of every cent, just 10%. Bring pea-shooter. nt edgineered Jun 2015 #30
The church should have sarisataka Jun 2015 #32
Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2015 #34
Welcome to DU, esreveR! calimary Jun 2015 #56
Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2015 #68
Didn't the Governor of SC recently sign that bill?? kentuck Jun 2015 #58
Not me mcar Jun 2015 #36
there are 6 people in our church that the pastor has asked that we carry littlewolf Jun 2015 #38
You can shoot anyone that steals from the offerings. kwassa Jun 2015 #109
Is your pastor being paranoid or are you in a very high crime area? And if this is a Christian pnwmom Jun 2015 #178
we have had 3 break ins at night when no one was there and he is concerned littlewolf Jun 2015 #187
Churches can ban all the weapons they want. LAGC Jun 2015 #40
In the case of the recent shooting, SC bans guns in church. beevul Jun 2015 #47
I think it's one of the stupidest things I've ever heard of. polly7 Jun 2015 #46
++++ Cleita Jun 2015 #62
If I attended a church where people were toting guns, Art_from_Ark Jun 2015 #191
According to some it depends on what state you're in wyldwolf Jun 2015 #59
Leave it up to the church Duckhunter935 Jun 2015 #64
Only in limited cases should gun yahoos be allowed to carry a gun out of their home. Hoyt Jun 2015 #66
Just because I can does not mean that I will ...and I won't. L0oniX Jun 2015 #71
I support the right ... 99Forever Jun 2015 #74
Whatever institution or business owns the place/building should have the say rock Jun 2015 #77
old days w0nderer Jun 2015 #85
I agree that private property should be allowed to choose. RichVRichV Jun 2015 #86
Churches are private property krispos42 Jun 2015 #91
But when they open their doors to the public the rules change. Ask any business owner. Cleita Jun 2015 #100
It does to an extent krispos42 Jun 2015 #102
Your argument is so tired, even caffeine won't fix it. Cleita Jun 2015 #112
This line of thought is what I call the "NO CAN DO" philosophy of the pro gun movement. CTyankee Jun 2015 #139
"Who carries routinely, every day, a handgun in addition to his cell phone and wallet and car keys." ieoeja Jun 2015 #186
do they also decide whether or not to pay taxes? kentuck Jun 2015 #110
They can apply for non-profit status. krispos42 Jun 2015 #111
I consider that to be up to the church. Lizzie Poppet Jun 2015 #92
The church can decide about its property just like I can decide about my property. Township75 Jun 2015 #99
Well, frankly, you cannot. Try, e.g., building without a permit. WinkyDink Jun 2015 #123
What building have to do with carrying firearms? Township75 Jun 2015 #188
I do not support open carry in public places. peacebird Jun 2015 #101
I HAVE A RIGHT TO - BARE ARMS! ESpecially when its HOT outside~~~ benld74 Jun 2015 #103
Sun's out, guns out. Know'm say'n? Iggo Jun 2015 #146
Absolutely not! We need less guns in our country, not more! Initech Jun 2015 #105
I think it is a really stupid idea, like taking it into a hospital or school imo. Rex Jun 2015 #108
The leaders of a church in Minneapolis Snobblevitch Jun 2015 #113
In my humble opinion... kentuck Jun 2015 #115
I don't mind people having guns in their houses gollygee Jun 2015 #124
They disrespect the rights of everyone else to live in peace and to feel unthreatened ... kentuck Jun 2015 #126
It's becoming like the wild west gollygee Jun 2015 #127
Gunowners seem to trust strangers with guns... kentuck Jun 2015 #128
Actually, Snobblevitch Jun 2015 #133
Sounds like a quibble. kentuck Jun 2015 #135
I read it somewhere. Snobblevitch Jun 2015 #136
I would say that the church is no place for either... kentuck Jun 2015 #138
Some a Christian denominations Snobblevitch Jun 2015 #155
I watched it. kentuck Jun 2015 #159
I went to their website. Snobblevitch Jun 2015 #177
Because you said. "some Christian denominations..." kentuck Jun 2015 #179
Nope, Snobblevitch Jun 2015 #184
Nope - the word is "ratsach" whatthehey Jun 2015 #137
I was using an English translation that may have Snobblevitch Jun 2015 #157
Well the most common translation is "slay" but again it's any violent death really whatthehey Jun 2015 #175
Well I too shall put it out in the open CBGLuthier Jun 2015 #142
Should be up to the church bigwillq Jun 2015 #144
I cannot imagine a church in this country that would vote to have everyone armed. kentuck Jun 2015 #147
If they vote against it, fine. bigwillq Jun 2015 #152
No right is absolute. Carry a cross, crescent, or zion or other holy symbol Agnosticsherbet Jun 2015 #151
What's allowed should be the property owner's decision madville Jun 2015 #153
A property owner's rights do not extend beyond his own property... kentuck Jun 2015 #156
Problem is criminals and psychopaths don't follow laws n/t madville Jun 2015 #160
So we should make it easier for them to get more guns... kentuck Jun 2015 #163
At DU? LWolf Jun 2015 #158
I cannot believe that very many Americans would support bringing guns into their churches... kentuck Jun 2015 #161
Yes. LWolf Jun 2015 #171
I think it is difficult to deny that we live in a violent society... kentuck Jun 2015 #172
That solution LWolf Jun 2015 #174
My parish would never allow guns in our church. hrmjustin Jun 2015 #162
Of course not! kentuck Jun 2015 #164
And your parish should have the option to decide that for itself, IMO, petronius Jun 2015 #173
No, church is not a place for guns. Why B Calm Jun 2015 #165
They have more faith in their gun than they do in their God.. kentuck Jun 2015 #166
LOL, so true. A real christian wouldn't have any fear of being killed. B Calm Jun 2015 #167
And they will give us 3 excuses before the rooster crows... kentuck Jun 2015 #168
I do....and I do. ileus Jun 2015 #169
So there is only a 50% chance of you getting blown away? kentuck Jun 2015 #170
Nope I just refuse to break the law, and try to limit my exposure ileus Jun 2015 #181
the 2nd amendment needs to go the way of most Magna Carta statues lebkuchen Jun 2015 #180
I own two shotguns and a revolver (two of the three were inherited). Elwood P Dowd Jun 2015 #182
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Let's just get it out in ...»Reply #171