General Discussion

Adrahil

(13,340 posts)

171. I almost completely agree with you.

Mon Jun 29, 2015, 09:20 AM

Jun 2015

I'm not a believer in the "if we work hard enough" meme. The fact is that there are things beyond our control. Dynamics that are not within our immediate ability to control. We can be most effective by recognizing those things beyond our control and making what progress we can with those in mind.

Like you, I'm an idealist in my heart, but a pragmatist in my head. Fortunately, most of the time, my head wins the argument in such cases!

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Is President Obama a corporatist? [View all] Sancho Jun 2015 OP

I hope you're correct. Little Star Jun 2015 #1

my questions would be these HFRN Jun 2015 #2

Obama himself told us that his economic policies are 1980's Republican LondonReign2 Jun 2015 #3

Exactly. BillZBubb Jun 2015 #9

Yup. And people somewhow do not want to believe hifiguy Jun 2015 #70

Yeah-- I don't get why so many people build these elaborate narratives to Marr Jun 2015 #11

Simply stated Yes he is and he admits it. Vincardog Jun 2015 #33

People are placated by social stances while the divide between poor and rich grows wider. EndElectoral Jun 2015 #68

There can be no socal justice without ecomonic justice. "Fiscal conservative" = FASCIST Vincardog Jun 2015 #86

It amazes me RichVRichV Jun 2015 #41

Yep-- and the mental gymnastics they have to do to reconcile that simple admission Marr Jun 2015 #45

I thought he compared himself to a "moderate" republican of the pre-Reagan era, not pampango Jun 2015 #49

The quote: PETRUS Jun 2015 #59

To me that is ambiguos. Many think of moderate republicans as like Eisnehower and conservative pampango Jun 2015 #65

We'd have to ask Obama for clarification in order to know what he meant. PETRUS Jun 2015 #79

A Rockefeller Republican to the core. LittleBlue Jun 2015 #77

Nope. He said his policies were moderate 1980s Republican LondonReign2 Jun 2015 #99

As opposed to 'conservative' 1980's republican policies which is what Reagan pursued. pampango Jun 2015 #102

You can twist yourself up all you'd like trying to rationalize his policies as "not as bad as Reagan LondonReign2 Jun 2015 #104

Being an "avowed republican economically" is not bad if Eisenhower is your version pampango Jun 2015 #109

That is not consistent with what Pres. Obama said. delrem Jun 2015 #131

I thought he said "moderate", not "conservative", republican. Reagan was not "moderate" and pampango Jun 2015 #137

The Left have lots of myths about Reagan's TM99 Jun 2015 #139

Well, in fairness the right have that myth too Recursion Jun 2015 #144

Re-quoting from EndElectoral's reply #68 delrem Jun 2015 #166

Can you post the quote and it's comtext? Adrahil Jun 2015 #156

Google is pretty simple to use LondonReign2 Jun 2015 #163

Fine. He's basically right. Moderate Republicans used to reject the whole Trickle Down Bullshit. Adrahil Jun 2015 #172

I find it amusing that in their loyalty to Obama LondonReign2 Jun 2015 #174

I eschew labels... DemocratSinceBirth Jun 2015 #4

'I just want them to live by the rules the rest of us do' HFRN Jun 2015 #6

Nobody is asking that corporations go away. That isn't the issue. BillZBubb Jun 2015 #12

Corporations wrote TPP. HooptieWagon Jun 2015 #18

Believe it. KeepItReal Jun 2015 #5

'He is just a fiscal conservative'---> for whom? HFRN Jun 2015 #10

He's in line with the EU austerity movement, Wall Street, and big money politics KeepItReal Jun 2015 #13

He is most certainly not in line with the EU austerity movement. geek tragedy Jun 2015 #23

The whole "Sequester" BS was how we implemented EU-style austerity KeepItReal Jun 2015 #25

I liked the Eulogy PowerToThePeople Jun 2015 #7

I don't think he's in anyone's pocket. He simply believes in trickle down economics. Marr Jun 2015 #8

"Without Penny Pritzker, it is unlikely that Barack Obama ever would have been elected" KeepItReal Jun 2015 #16

and not backstage now: she is the current Secretary of Commerce afterall corkhead Jun 2015 #37

Interesting...I didn't know this background Sancho Jun 2015 #61

^^ This. winter is coming Jun 2015 #17

"...can we take Obama's word that the TPP will be good for American's jobs?" NO. truebluegreen Jun 2015 #14

the oldest game in the world is HFRN Jun 2015 #15

What's your point? truebluegreen Jun 2015 #123

Yet it might still be good for American jobs. darkwing Jun 2015 #56

Or not... BillZBubb Jun 2015 #93

The middle class in Asia is growing faster than anywhere else. darkwing Jun 2015 #117

"Open up Japan? Art_from_Ark Jun 2015 #134

Agriculture darkwing Jun 2015 #162

Japan already imports 60% of its food, and there is no food shortage. Art_from_Ark Jun 2015 #167

As far as farmers are concerned, more is better. darkwing Jun 2015 #168

Which farmers? Art_from_Ark Jun 2015 #170

That's because Japan has one of the most protectionist farm industries in the world... darkwing Jul 2015 #178

Japanese food is some of the most wholesome in the world Art_from_Ark Jul 2015 #179

He is a neo-liberal. TM99 Jun 2015 #19

+1 Very well said. /nt RiverLover Jun 2015 #22

+1 BrotherIvan Jun 2015 #46

Bingo. roamer65 Jun 2015 #54

Or he is an imperfect liberal. "He is a human being like all of us, and he is a politician." pampango Jun 2015 #95

Do I have to post the video yet again TM99 Jun 2015 #119

"Obama's (2015) budget with a proposed increase in the maximum federal tax on capital gains pampango Jun 2015 #135

We can go back and forth more if you would like. TM99 Jun 2015 #138

Reagan raised capital gains taxes later in exchange for a slashing of income tax on the rich. pampango Jun 2015 #154

The Democratic Party is never going to bring down Starry Messenger Jun 2015 #20

He can be well-intentioned but wrong geek tragedy Jun 2015 #21

+1, I agree. Marr Jun 2015 #43

Good intentions and $3 tblue Jun 2015 #47

That is exactly the mindset I'm talking about. You assume because he geek tragedy Jun 2015 #48

"Obama Sides W/ the Wrong People for the Wrong Reasons at the Wrong Time" RiverLover Jun 2015 #24

He "introduced" the TPP? Way back in 2005? Recursion Jun 2015 #26

Indeed......this was the point I was going to write on....nt msanthrope Jun 2015 #29

True, but I meant he's been promoting it. Sancho Jun 2015 #72

His policy makers put the work in. joshcryer Jun 2015 #100

GWB signed on Brunei and Chile (nt) Recursion Jun 2015 #101

Fair enough. joshcryer Jun 2015 #103

in 2008 he was my next to last choice going into the caucuses rurallib Jun 2015 #27

Me too. I think many of us thought the same. eom Cleita Jun 2015 #38

I actually had some hope, naive in retrospect, hifiguy Jun 2015 #71

The Southern Democrats joined the Republicans when LBJ got the 65 INdemo Jun 2015 #83

Most likely, in my armchair non-economist opinion, TPP will either be good or neutral for jobs. randome Jun 2015 #28

+1. Hoyt Jun 2015 #58

+1 darkwing Jun 2015 #64

He is a complex human being Agnosticsherbet Jun 2015 #30

His whole life has been a rejection of the corporate path BeyondGeography Jun 2015 #31

The ACA was not a compromise. Advocates of single payer were not even Cleita Jun 2015 #32

Single payer had 8-10 votes in the Senate. Taking away everyone's health insurance geek tragedy Jun 2015 #52

The Wayne Gretzky Rule applies here. hifiguy Jun 2015 #73

How many shots did Michael Jordan attempt from beyond half-court? geek tragedy Jun 2015 #75

Single payer did not fail or implode. It was shot down by Gov. Shumlin. Cleita Jun 2015 #81

Because the politics of the necessary tax increase were toxic. nt geek tragedy Jun 2015 #82

Exactly, it had nothing to do with the failure of the program. It was never tried because the Cleita Jun 2015 #85

If the politics are toxic in VT, that's not very encouraging for national efforts nt geek tragedy Jun 2015 #87

No shit Sherlock. Some of us have been trying for decades to do just that because it works. eom Cleita Jun 2015 #89

Single payer was Medicare for all and it has been tested, mostly notably our neighbors to the Cleita Jun 2015 #74

Who would process claims in the Medicare for All program? geek tragedy Jun 2015 #76

It would be financed with the money that now goes to insurance companies and Cleita Jun 2015 #80

Single payer is the best end result. geek tragedy Jun 2015 #84

As long as the fox is in the henhouse, he will not leave until there are no more hens to eat. Cleita Jun 2015 #88

Precisely. hifiguy Jun 2015 #91

Gay marriage wasn't possible either, not so long ago. Marr Jun 2015 #158

Her's the thing... Adrahil Jun 2015 #157

Yes, as long as the insurance and pharmaceutical industries are Cleita Jun 2015 #165

Out comes the names, I have found when the argument is going away from some then the Thinkingabout Jun 2015 #34

Come in from the (brain) dead zone, Sancho Doctor_J Jun 2015 #35

Perhaps. Perhaps not. But, the sytem he operates in is. Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2015 #36

Basically, yes. alarimer Jun 2015 #39

I woke up in the middle of the night composing a letter to him which asked that question. The jwirr Jun 2015 #40

It's not just the TPP, but every step of the way he puts corporations first... polichick Jun 2015 #42

YOU BETTER BELIEVE IT! n/t JTFrog Jun 2015 #130

He must think it will do us good treestar Jun 2015 #44

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. BillZBubb Jun 2015 #92

Everyone wants business to continue to do well. treestar Jun 2015 #116

yes. restorefreedom Jun 2015 #50

It's easy to believe he is for it Art_from_Ark Jun 2015 #136

almost forgot about the reagan years restorefreedom Jun 2015 #149

If Obama's heart is in the right place, then that must say something about the current state AZ Progressive Jun 2015 #51

This message was self-deleted by its author AZ Progressive Jun 2015 #55

I can't beleive the 2008 Presidential canidate said the things he did, and saw orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #53

Let me remind everyone that even Bernie the fighter has a history of being a pragmatist AZ Progressive Jun 2015 #57

1983 Is no 1984, He was also the first Mayor of a city to indict the CIA , for orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #96

I am not sure, but he is corporeal. Vattel Jun 2015 #60

Another thing one must consider about the TPP is that it's likely a hail mary pass AZ Progressive Jun 2015 #62

I get why it's US policy but it's a fool's errand Recursion Jun 2015 #90

See, I don't care what he believes. It is a non factor as the road to Hell is TheKentuckian Jun 2015 #63

Yes, and he always has been. ananda Jun 2015 #66

Yes. He definitely is a corporatist. Never doubted he oratory skills. It's his actions I have a GoneFishin Jun 2015 #67

Is the Pope Catholic? hifiguy Jun 2015 #69

Yes he is INdemo Jun 2015 #78

What specifically is a "corporatist"?? DCBob Jun 2015 #94

Some would say fascist Lite, incorporating us with business, by force . orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #105

I don't see how there can be any doubt. Broward Jun 2015 #97

The founding fathers were corporatist. joshcryer Jun 2015 #98

Oh like Jefferson saying they were the new enemy ? FDR was a corporatist ? orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #106

Hamilton laid the foundation for corporate America. joshcryer Jun 2015 #108

And Aaron Burr was the best editor the ' New York Evening Post ' ever had, no doubt orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #110

WTF are you talking about? joshcryer Jun 2015 #112

WTF ? He was an upstart who would have built another monarchy if given the chance , a real Bush. orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #113

He was an orphan who rose to the top. joshcryer Jun 2015 #114

No it's the ilk who will do whatever they need to profit, Orphaned great people included, Corporatist orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #118

The stock market did better during FDR's first two terms than it has under Obama. Does that pampango Jun 2015 #111

He saved US from, not for Capatalism . orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #115

Of course FDR was a corporatist Recursion Jun 2015 #143

Reorganize ?? You mean organize, and this is how much he liked corporations.. orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #145

That's a Jefferson quote Recursion Jun 2015 #146

I'm sorry didn't mean to confuse presidents and centuries, those coalitions you speak of created orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #147

His TPP was the Reciprocal Trade Agreements Act and the Ex-Im bank Recursion Jun 2015 #148

The Founders had a fairly healthly distrust of corporations dflprincess Jun 2015 #128

You had the Jefferson and Hamilton camps. joshcryer Jun 2015 #129

We lost . orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #132

Oh man, if Jefferson won... joshcryer Jun 2015 #140

Agreed, Bailouts included, but your right he was a Libertarian . And orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #142

The first Halliburton . orpupilofnature57 Jun 2015 #133

If actions speak louder than words "Yes" Joe Turner Jun 2015 #107

Obama: Knock, Knock, Who's There? Fred Sanders Jun 2015 #120

YES!!! burrowowl Jun 2015 #121

He's won a lot of battles that we needed him to win..corporatocracy just wasn't one of them.. now lostnfound Jun 2015 #122

In a word, yes. 99Forever Jun 2015 #124

I can't decide TheFarseer Jun 2015 #125

I have formulated an opinion about TPP SusanCalvin Jun 2015 #126

i have no doubt restorefreedom Jun 2015 #151

Has This Question Already Been Answered By past Actions cantbeserious Jun 2015 #127

The "corporatist" confusion: Why a prominent political term needs to be retired -- The Salon DCBob Jun 2015 #141

Salon.com 3/2015 Rahm has "corporatist worldview"... RiverLover Jun 2015 #150

Actually, his being a corporatist was clear long before the vocal support of the TPP. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jun 2015 #152

i guess it all depends on if you think he gives more consideration raouldukelives Jun 2015 #153

I believe the President is a pragmatist. Adrahil Jun 2015 #155

I'm both an idealist and a pragmatist AZ Progressive Jun 2015 #169

I almost completely agree with you. Adrahil Jun 2015 #171

If the system is Right Wing and Racist, then being a "pragmatist" means supporting that status quo. Romulox Jun 2015 #176

Nonsense. Adrahil Jun 2015 #177

Yeah he is a corporatists betterdemsonly Jun 2015 #159

No, he's a communitarian. haele Jun 2015 #160

Yes, see his appointments, follow the money, and ask again honestly. TheKentuckian Jun 2015 #161

Is President Obama a corporatist? sjk.fly4ever Jun 2015 #164

Wish I could K&R more than once SCantiGOP Jun 2015 #173

He is absolutely a corporatist. nt Romulox Jun 2015 #175