General Discussion

lovemydog

(11,833 posts)

60. I don't like the bickering but I do see a 'teachable moment' in it.

Tue Jul 21, 2015, 06:00 PM

Jul 2015

White people (myself included) can and should understand that racial matters are sometimes different from economic matters. And learn more about black history, which is very much a part of American history. And keep talking about race, get better at talking about it, and keep talking about economics too.

While I appreciate and take to heart what you're saying, I have a slightly different view. None of us have voted yet. We should all vote. And we should keep reaching out to each other, keep communicating. And not tear down other candidates in the democratic party or to the left of the mainstream democratic party. When we vote we win. So in that regard I think that we can bicker all we want as long as we keep voting.

I view this site as fun social interaction more than as some major vehicle for social change. I learn a lot here by reading. It helps me sharpen my views and hear a lot from others' perspectives. Perhaps it's up to each of us to share and relate to what we do apart from typing on computers. Communication via this message board is a nice way of interacting with people. Yes, we should try and make our communications pleasant when at all possible. Except for the trolls we all pretty much want the country to move to the left and also to elect more democrats. It's also great fun to laugh our asses off as much as possible.

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Some things never change. We're a self defeating bunch of nitwits [View all] Armstead Jul 2015 OP

Sad but true. senseandsensibility Jul 2015 #1

Well we might be busy doing several things el_bryanto Jul 2015 #2

Passionate debate is one thing Armstead Jul 2015 #5

The racism pot is boiling over.... kentuck Jul 2015 #22

Hi Kentuck Armstead Jul 2015 #32

Good to see you kentuck Jul 2015 #57

This wasn't 'the exploiters exploiting us all'. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jul 2015 #3

No it's the left banging on the left, yet again Armstead Jul 2015 #8

BS heaven05 Jul 2015 #64

This message was self-deleted by its author CANDO Jul 2015 #99

I have to say, I don't want to fucking wait for some candidate to come up with a plan Autumn Jul 2015 #118

Bernie can do it. He's in Congress right now. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jul 2015 #119

I don't know about that? kentuck Jul 2015 #120

True, and you also have to take into account that if it did get to the floor Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jul 2015 #121

I don't get why we have to wait for legislation no fucking way the pukes will let anything pass. Autumn Jul 2015 #122

Sure. Do it. I'm not against any of the things you're saying. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jul 2015 #123

I have no power to tell the DOJ what to do. I agree on the need for legislation but Autumn Jul 2015 #125

I worded that poorly. I was indicating agreement that things need to be done now, in addition to Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jul 2015 #126

Well, you gotta admit, it's a very clevery ruse. Atman Jul 2015 #4

I'm not talking about playing nicey nice to the racists on the right Armstead Jul 2015 #6

Well I think you are right. zeemike Jul 2015 #68

Yes, there are exploiters out there trying to divide. But there always will be. mmonk Jul 2015 #7

But we don't need to play into their hands Armstead Jul 2015 #10

I agree. Just do the right thing and don't let anyone take you off your message mmonk Jul 2015 #18

+1 n/t Triana Jul 2015 #9

I sort of agree but I'm with the People's Front of Judea. foo_bar Jul 2015 #11

Economic Justice and Social Justice should go hand in hand Armstead Jul 2015 #15

The principle of equality for all has been a sacred creed of progressives... kentuck Jul 2015 #36

oh boy, here it is again heaven05 Jul 2015 #69

+1000 sheshe2 Jul 2015 #76

thanks heaven05 Jul 2015 #80

Here it is again Armstead Jul 2015 #78

MLK???? heaven05 Jul 2015 #82

Whatever. Armstead Jul 2015 #85

I agree. MLK was "connecting the dots" among deutsey Jul 2015 #128

Perfect Phrase....We need more "dot connecting" Armstead Jul 2015 #135

Wow. You have cut to the bone of the matter. Tommymac Jul 2015 #129

Specifically.. kentuck Jul 2015 #87

I have explained heaven05 Jul 2015 #89

I read your recent posts... kentuck Jul 2015 #100

I don't think when it comes to POC heaven05 Jul 2015 #111

In that case... kentuck Jul 2015 #112

What a great point! calimary Jul 2015 #149

true and infected anew. Seems antibiotic resistant. heaven05 Jul 2015 #151

I hate to say it... kentuck Jul 2015 #154

You're gonna catch shit from people for this. Ignore them. Scootaloo Jul 2015 #108

",,,appeared only immediately after Bernie Sanders declared his candidacy...." navarth Jul 2015 #138

Splitter! geardaddy Jul 2015 #61

For my own part, I'm not concerned with sustaining the "American Dream." Maedhros Jul 2015 #73

Not all Progressives are heaven05 Jul 2015 #93

whenever contrasting the old production-oriented, MIC-run postwar economy of Fordism and Ike MisterP Jul 2015 #162

and as long as white people pretend that economic disparity is the same thing as racial disparity La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #12

I don't think its pretending that at all Armstead Jul 2015 #16

i guess you missed a lot of the threads this morning. my point is merely dismissing racism La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #19

My little tirade took those into account too Armstead Jul 2015 #21

again, my original point stands, dismissing and belittling the impact of racism on black people La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #23

and you are engaging in what I am talking about Armstead Jul 2015 #30

that's false equivalency. blame is not shared all around. some people have had to pay La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #31

I don't disagree Armstead Jul 2015 #35

again, just because income inequality is your priority, dismissing other people's priorities La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #40

Okay there is NOTHING as important as race. NOTHING. No otehr issue matters. Armstead Jul 2015 #41

it's exactly this attitude, and this dismissiveness and condescension that causes the rifts La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #42

Exactly. nt betsuni Jul 2015 #46

Yep you're right. Armstead Jul 2015 #47

Okay, so once the impact of racism on black people has been acknowledged by white progressives.. frylock Jul 2015 #53

are you serious? you can't think of policies a presidential candidate can champion La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #55

A presidential candidate? How about a sitting President with keen insight into what black people.. frylock Jul 2015 #59

+1 historylovr Jul 2015 #75

+2 hifiguy Jul 2015 #81

+3 nashville_brook Jul 2015 #88

+4 840high Jul 2015 #90

I would also like to know. WorseBeforeBetter Jul 2015 #98

plus 5 wilsonbooks Jul 2015 #106

Because the POTUS is from the monied power structure dreamnightwind Jul 2015 #109

Yep. Money is low priority, but those with the money are immune from criticism about race. Nailed it GoneFishin Jul 2015 #116

a very good point, the impact of racism must be faced and discussed for as long as it takes Sunlei Jul 2015 #58

They are not the same. blackspade Jul 2015 #20

while they are intertwined, doing one doesn't necisssate the other La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #24

What do you think a president should do to end racial disparity? JDPriestly Jul 2015 #25

this is like asking what a president can do about income inequality La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #27

There' a significnt difference there. hifiguy Jul 2015 #84

Not all laws affecting race are local La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #130

I agree with you but individual PDs hifiguy Jul 2015 #134

This is not about sanders or clinton La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #136

I asked the question because I can see how a president can, through his appointments, JDPriestly Jul 2015 #94

what can we point to in the Obama administration that a candidate can build on? nashville_brook Jul 2015 #95

Agreed La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #131

Racism on the left is worse in many ways than racism on the right. hunter Jul 2015 #63

YES!!!!! La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #165

Alert Results irisblue Jul 2015 #72

the alerter is way dramatic. La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #164

and wrong as well irisblue Jul 2015 #166

yeah that too, but it's one thing to be wrong, it's another to be dramatically wrong. La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #167

The Results are in! sheshe2 Jul 2015 #74

0-7 to LEAVE IT! poor little alert squad.. :( couldn't handle what she had to say.. :( Cha Jul 2015 #79

lol. how is this naked bigotry? La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #163

+1000 heaven05 Jul 2015 #83

I don't see how posts on a discussion board are the equal of eating our young... LanternWaste Jul 2015 #13

I agree with that actually. Armstead Jul 2015 #17

isn't complaining about trendy t-shirt cynicism itself a form of trendy t-shirt cynicism? Warren DeMontague Jul 2015 #28

And isn;t complaining about comp,laining about...etc? Armstead Jul 2015 #48

Yes- but as George Washington once said, "hypocrisy is the consistency of small internet hobgoblins" Warren DeMontague Jul 2015 #50

Yep, and I see the same screen names over and over and over that are doing the enflaming. hamsterjill Jul 2015 #14

ridiculous flamefests? Warren DeMontague Jul 2015 #26

And on top of this the teaparty morons in the House just voted to give tax breaks randys1 Jul 2015 #29

I wouldn;t say doomed -- But we're definetly allowing things to get worse Armstead Jul 2015 #38

As if anything here has any import outside this ingrown cyber bubble uhnope Jul 2015 #33

Enh, it's a reflection. Armstead Jul 2015 #37

Not of the debate at large uhnope Jul 2015 #45

Well the debate at large is who is going to win the next Final Four, or... Armstead Jul 2015 #49

Well... Dr Hobbitstein Jul 2015 #141

Yeah, white people should absolutely join with people of color so that we aren't gollygee Jul 2015 #34

Speak for yourself. japple Jul 2015 #39

Yep. And who do you suppose it was that bought the racism nonsense to DU? Zorra Jul 2015 #43

Zorra, shhhhh. hifiguy Jul 2015 #62

So true. I came to DU Sunday evening hoping to read recaps of Sunday morning shows blm Jul 2015 #44

The other side only needs to poke and prod us a wee bit before we turn on each other villager Jul 2015 #51

except in this case it is most definitely not the other side. it is people on our side La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #52

urgency and legitimacy of issues was never the problem; which targets we aim at usually is villager Jul 2015 #56

Yes and my contention is that we do this La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #132

If we take an "Eyes on the Prize" approach, what's the best strategy to get to where we want to be? villager Jul 2015 #142

No one expects democrats or government overall La Lioness Priyanka Jul 2015 #143

Right. And hopefully they will be more adamant with those powerful factions who ignore them even villager Jul 2015 #145

Myself... I know it is an emergency nadinbrzezinski Jul 2015 #70

You also bring up a good point about timelines, Nadin. We don't know, ultimately, how this will play villager Jul 2015 #144

I was scouring the nets nadinbrzezinski Jul 2015 #147

Again, this may have been our side obliging them with tactical choices, muffed responses, etc. villager Jul 2015 #148

I agree in the grand scheme of things nadinbrzezinski Jul 2015 #152

You're absolutely right, Nadin. We need that "grand coalition" if we're have even the remotest villager Jul 2015 #153

Exactly nadinbrzezinski Jul 2015 #155

What we need is to get the 1%ers at each other's throats villager Jul 2015 #156

That would be nice nadinbrzezinski Jul 2015 #157

Why wouldn't they use it. It works. It's hard to trace back to the source. And for right wingers it GoneFishin Jul 2015 #117

You don't even need heavy-handed overt "secret police" tactics when the reform faction so willingly villager Jul 2015 #146

For the present I should like merely to understand how it happens that so many men, jtuck004 Jul 2015 #54

Excellent post...I very much enjoyed reading it Oilwellian Jul 2015 #102

It's best printed and read in blocks - they probably had an easier time concentrating in 1550. <G>. jtuck004 Jul 2015 #104

I don't like the bickering but I do see a 'teachable moment' in it. lovemydog Jul 2015 #60

Agree with all of that, and there is entertainment value in debate too Armstead Jul 2015 #77

Very much agree with you lovemydog Jul 2015 #86

I gotta admit, this is why I find the streets nadinbrzezinski Jul 2015 #65

ive made my case angrychair Jul 2015 #66

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Nice to see you, too. Iggo Jul 2015 #67

Amen!!! n/t Oldtimeralso Jul 2015 #71

This message was self-deleted by its author Corruption Inc Jul 2015 #91

I suppose racism isn't an issue with you.... Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2015 #92

Oh I'm so glad you had the sarcasm thingy there Armstead Jul 2015 #96

Aren't those adrenalin surges a rush? Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2015 #97

This is actually a very interesting "fight" on DU Hydra Jul 2015 #101

I also took a break. glinda Jul 2015 #103

K&R awoke_in_2003 Jul 2015 #105

it will pass Scootaloo Jul 2015 #107

I love posts like this! Orrex Jul 2015 #110

No, it's not that DU sucks....It's just that certain things about DU (and the left) suck Armstead Jul 2015 #124

This is what it sounds like artislife Jul 2015 #113

Slightly over the top. Fearless Jul 2015 #114

It's a fucking mess. There's no getting past the defensiveness. The right wing has won. We're are GoneFishin Jul 2015 #115

I tried to say that yesterday, but you said it much better. CanonRay Jul 2015 #127

It's just a few loud voices, we are not divided, just being targeted with garbage sabrina 1 Jul 2015 #133

You got it. And far from doing nothing. raouldukelives Jul 2015 #137

American history has shown that when white people dominate social movements YoungDemCA Jul 2015 #139

You're making a lot of assumptions there Armstead Jul 2015 #140

I still think it was a good thing that I voted for Barack Obama... kentuck Jul 2015 #150

K&R X 1,000 You hit this nail right on the head. Divide and Conquer rides again! PatrickforO Jul 2015 #158

Ha! Go read some GOP sites if you want REAL dysfunction!! Trump leading? 7962 Jul 2015 #159

That's what gives me comfort...They're as f'd up as we are Armstead Jul 2015 #160

And here we all go again. WHEN CRABS ROAR Jul 2015 #161