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RainDog

(28,784 posts)
63. No doubt - some people should not use cannabis
Thu May 17, 2012, 11:14 PM
May 2012

even so - as your first link notes:

Paul Corry, spokesman for Rethink, a mental health group, said there isn't enough data to know whether marijuana leads to aggression, or if kids living in environments that promote aggression are more prone to smoke marijuana.


and as your second links notes:
Studies show that violence can occur more often among people who use marijuana regularly, rather than those who use it occasionally or not at all. It is unclear why this is the case, but it may be because people with violent tendencies can also have a range of other psychosocial problems and are therefore more likely to use marijuana. marijuana is also part of the illegal drug market, which may increase the chances of violence occurring in some social interactions.

Research also shows that marijuana users who commit violent acts usually have a history of violence before they start using the drug.


There's nothing new under the sun about these two reports. Some people should not drink alcohol, either. They become aggressive - tho not everyone does. It seems the aggression is linked to the individual, not the alcohol itself, since millions of people drink and never start a fight. We do not prohibit alcohol because a subset of the population may have social or mental problems if they drink.

A subset of the population will have a problem with any substance, aspirin, coffee, milk... and so if someone is in that subset, that person should not consume those things.

But what anyone who has ever dealt with people with substance abuse problems knows is this: people often use substances like alcohol, and probably marijuana, to self-medicate. Causation isn't there - the causation exists in someone's individual vulnerability to mental health problems that, generally, exist within that person's family, as well. Of course, if someone never drank, they would not develop alcoholism. But they would very likely still have the same mental health problems that exist outside of the use of alcohol.

What we do as a society is regulate alcohol so that young people do not have easy access to it - it's easier for a teenager to get marijuana than to get alcohol. If young people are more susceptible to problems because of cannabis use - then regulating its use would help to keep cannabis out of the schools where it is sold.

If cannabis were regulated, one issue that is now of concern, that came about because of the war on drugs, is the higher levels of THC in some strains that may cause negative outcomes for some people - but only while they are under the influence of the THC, which would mean a few hours.

Higher levels of THC mean lower levels of CBD. These two cannabinoids balance out one another and, with less CBD, some people are likely to experience negative outcomes like paranoia - this is an effect of the THC without compensating CBD. If cannabis were regulated, however, people could make responsible choices based upon levels of THC and CBD. Some people might choose very low levels of THC in order to utilize the effects of CBD, instead. CBD isn't associated with intoxication - and is, in fact, under study as a possible treatment for schizophrenia.

Even though the studies you include indicate no causation, there may be a miniscule causation AMONG YOUNG PEOPLE between some mental illness issues and cannabis. As a large study indicated:

If...cannabis use is relatively common in the population but appears to cause schizophrenia rarely, it would follow that at least one of the other component causes in the causal constellation is rare. Indeed, calculation of the overall risk for schizophrenia associated with cannabis use revealed that cannabis use confers only a twofold increase in relative risk for schizophrenia.

Cannabis does not appear to represent a sufficient or a necessary cause for the development of psychosis but forms part of a causal constellation.


The development of psychosis, however, can happen without the use of cannabis.

http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/184/2/110.full

The above link is not "pro-cannabis." What it is HONEST about is this: cannabis, in and of itself, cannot be considered a cause of mental illness. As Roger Pertwee (Britain's leading pharmacologist regarding cannabis) noted - cannabis may be part of a constellation of factors. Not the cause.

What the study I quoted, above, does is make an assessment of studies to indicate that, yes, we should discourage cannabis use among teenagers - especially very young teens. I don't know anyone who disagrees with this statement. So, the issue then becomes - what is the most effective way to prevent cannabis use among very young teens?

1. Education about risks for use as a young person, most ESPECIALLY if they have a family history of particular mental illnesses.
and
2. Regulation of distribution to limit access to those who are of legal age.

As this study noted, as well, cannabis use is part of the actions of the general population and the majority of people have no problem with it at all - so, the question becomes this: how do we work to limit access to very young people? The answer is: in the same way that we limit access to alcohol. Kids, generally, do not sell alcohol at school. They do sell cannabis, however, and there are no constraints on their actions to sell to very young teens.

All this mental health information, above, whether it explicitly states this reality or not, confirms Roger Pertwee's statement that cannabis should be legalized because it poses no significant risk for schizophrenia for the general population. (Again, Pertwee is the leading pharmacologist who studies cannabis in the UK, with decades of data to draw upon.)

http://www.britishscienceassociation.org/web/News/FestivalNews/_Rethinkingcannabis.htm

...you could identify people who might be at risk of developing schizophrenia. Cannabis is one factor which increases the risk of schizophrenia, but only if it's mixed with a bad childhood environment or a genetic predisposition to schizophrenia.


So, it seems to me that scare stories only work if someone wants to make false statements about the danger of cannabis for the general population. The fact remains that cannabis is one of the most benign substances that exists for the treatment of illness and the associated problems with other illnesses. It is also less harmful than alcohol or cigarettes, two substances that are legal.

iow, the reality remains that prohibition of cannabis is bad policy.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Marijuana use connected to aggression [View all] True Earthling May 2012 OP
well this proves it Travon guilty!!!11 I owe a May 2012 #1
My experience is that people are more mellow when high on pot. Chemisse May 2012 #2
That is also my experience and I have been around pot smokers for many years. More likely to go jwirr May 2012 #35
Unless you happen to be bogue-ing the last of the Doritos HillWilliam May 2012 #141
LOL. They do tend to eat you out of house and home. jwirr May 2012 #142
Such bullshit! Webster Green May 2012 #3
Marijuana Use Linked to Risk of Psychotic Symptoms True Earthling May 2012 #19
Pantload. Webster Green May 2012 #31
Did you post this because Trayvon Martin had THC in his bloodstream? RainDog May 2012 #69
Plus here's this documentary with proof: REP May 2012 #136
It's because the good weed is GONE Politicalboi May 2012 #4
No it isn't. Webster Green May 2012 #8
Yes, so do I Politicalboi May 2012 #20
Visit N Cal. roody May 2012 #28
don't have bluedave May 2012 #104
or Vermont - the Green Mountain State, indeed! piratefish08 May 2012 #92
LOL.. dude, you gotta stop smoking dirt then.... dionysus May 2012 #41
Really? I wonder what it was I smoked with a friend last month then...... kestrel91316 May 2012 #46
it's a pro-prohibition website, aka self serving government propaganda.... mike_c May 2012 #5
I've known a LOT of smokers TroglodyteScholar May 2012 #6
there'll be people who are aggressive when high.. but they're douchebags who are dionysus May 2012 #42
The only thing I've ever seen a pot head aggressive about is food. vaberella May 2012 #49
I know a few people who completely lose their appetite when high waddirum May 2012 #129
Same here. Drunks and speed freaks yes hifiguy May 2012 #58
I can assure that this is not correct......... panader0 May 2012 #7
In other news: Masturbation makes you go blind bupkus May 2012 #9
"I'll quit when I need glasses!" LongTomH May 2012 #30
National Cannibis Prevention and Information Center??? longship May 2012 #10
National Cannibis Prevention and Information Center Webster Green May 2012 #17
Probably funded by big pharma and alcohol distributors. nt Comrade_McKenzie May 2012 #21
Actually, National == Australia longship May 2012 #43
Here's a German university study linking Marijuana to psychotic symptoms True Earthling May 2012 #23
Psychotic in this context JonLP24 May 2012 #94
Alternatively, aggressive people self-medicate with marijuana to make themselves less aggressive. nt Ian David May 2012 #11
That's possible loyalsister May 2012 #124
lol @ propaganda bullshit Go Vols May 2012 #12
lies fascisthunter May 2012 #13
This OP is almost comical. marmar May 2012 #14
Almost, if it weren't so incredibly disgusting. NT EOTE May 2012 #112
That website is NOT HONcode Certified. Ian David May 2012 #15
People, this statement is key... cynatnite May 2012 #16
I had a friend who reacted badly to his first fully stoned experience. tridim May 2012 #27
My choice is "Here, There, and Everywhere" waddirum May 2012 #130
It is a very common reaction; it is a "paranoid/self-conscious" not "paranoid/violent" type of thing inna May 2012 #138
Here's another unpicked cherry from one of the links... Bluenorthwest May 2012 #39
Good Catch ProfessorGAC May 2012 #93
In this case... I'll take anecdotal evidence over propaganda. nt Comrade_McKenzie May 2012 #18
Judging from personal experience, I don't trust this study. Jamaal510 May 2012 #22
I have an outburst right now Life Long Dem May 2012 #24
That doesn't prove cause and effect, IMO. Honeycombe8 May 2012 #25
That explains all the ax murders and what-not. JNelson6563 May 2012 #26
Marijuana use connected to aggression against Suzy Q's and Ding Dongs Autumn May 2012 #29
And Aggressive Giggling JimGinPA May 2012 #34
KNOW YOUR DOPE FIEND. YOUR LIFE MAY DEPEND ON IT! DefenseLawyer May 2012 #32
I would tear this OP up one side and down the other XemaSab May 2012 #33
This is ludicrous. MrSlayer May 2012 #36
Check out the facts in this important documentary!!1! pipoman May 2012 #37
bwahaahaahaha...Waiting for the link to the Onion! chiffon May 2012 #38
i can say with forty some years of personal experience this is utter horseshit. spanone May 2012 #40
LOL. If by aggressive, this means the menacing behavior of eating pizza and cookie dough myrna minx May 2012 #44
Hahahahahaha! Could have fooled me. the only aggression I kestrel91316 May 2012 #45
ROFL. I said the same thing. I have seen them seriously crazy about that. vaberella May 2012 #52
Go ahead: Show your naivete by arguing it ONLY makes you MELLOWWWW... cherokeeprogressive May 2012 #47
I don't understand your point at all. Even with the disclaimer. n/t vaberella May 2012 #50
The point is cherokeeprogressive May 2012 #54
ROFL. Are you suggesting that gang members are stoned when they commit their crimes? vaberella May 2012 #55
I don't need links. I grew up with vatos in Norwalk. cherokeeprogressive May 2012 #61
Are you certain that it was the pot that makes them aggressive? Webster Green May 2012 #62
Doesn't make everyone think of cookie dough or pizza. cherokeeprogressive May 2012 #72
Actually I don't. Hence the reason I asked for links and supporting evidence. vaberella May 2012 #66
Pulling out those teen years in 1970's Norwalk , eh? U4ikLefty May 2012 #118
Despite the people mocking you, I know what you say is true from experience Capt. Obvious May 2012 #132
You need to brush up on the concept of cause & effect. Webster Green May 2012 #59
"connected to" and "makes people aggressive" are two different things. cherokeeprogressive May 2012 #75
Most of them stoned all the time? Chemisse May 2012 #91
There is a difference between weed and Sherm. MrSlayer May 2012 #133
Okay. By this post alone I realize you want to say Trayvon Martin deserved to die. vaberella May 2012 #48
+1 Starry Messenger May 2012 #90
After 45 years experience, Blue_In_AK May 2012 #51
Bwa-ha-ha! BULLLLLLLLLLLLL SHIT. Poll_Blind May 2012 #53
^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^ Zorra May 2012 #68
No.1 thing I ascertained in this thread is that there are a lot of illegal drug users here. vaberella May 2012 #56
I could care less what they call us waddirum May 2012 #131
Oppressor!! Trying to take away my precious right to fry my brain however I choose! BlueIris May 2012 #57
some people don't need any help n/t RainDog May 2012 #67
You clearly fried yours long ago. EOTE May 2012 #114
Perhaps aggressive juvenile delinquents happen to use a lot of drugs cthulu2016 May 2012 #60
No doubt - some people should not use cannabis RainDog May 2012 #63
Correlation is not causation. HuckleB May 2012 #64
I think what you see here is the "boy who cried wolf" effect RainDog May 2012 #73
I don't buy it. HuckleB May 2012 #78
this post is not good science RainDog May 2012 #83
So, your anecdotes somehow overcome a decade of hostility and emotional rampage ... HuckleB May 2012 #84
I'm not supplying anecdotes. I posted links to science RainDog May 2012 #86
None of that has a thing to do with my response to the OP. HuckleB May 2012 #106
LOL. okay RainDog May 2012 #113
I think these studies ohheckyeah May 2012 #65
I only felt that once marlakay May 2012 #70
So Marijuana=Aggression=Okay to murder someone who smokes pot... ScreamingMeemie May 2012 #71
Low post count zimmerman apologists are a source of aggressive behavior on du. Warren Stupidity May 2012 #74
You might find one (or 25) in Meta. ScreamingMeemie May 2012 #77
+1,000,000,000,000 HuckleB May 2012 #79
Concern trolling at its best, and most passive aggressive. ScreamingMeemie May 2012 #80
It was a good joke. HuckleB May 2012 #85
you realize screaming meemie is saying the OP is attacking Trayvon Martin, right? n/t RainDog May 2012 #88
Thanks RainDog. ScreamingMeemie May 2012 #101
You realize that it's a joke, right? HuckleB May 2012 #105
Yes. Which is why I responded that he could find a study in H&M perhaps. ScreamingMeemie May 2012 #100
Marijuana Use Connected To Munchies/Pink Floyd Concerts... WillyT May 2012 #76
pot made me paranoid and aggressive. provis99 May 2012 #81
You must be predisposed to support people like George Zimmerman then. cherokeeprogressive May 2012 #82
Nah, he's from the same hood in Norwalk as you. U4ikLefty May 2012 #121
True, if you run out of it. Rex May 2012 #87
It leads to irrational behavior, like drug warriors spending $60 Billion a year to keep it illegal. Warren DeMontague May 2012 #89
REEFER MADDNESS!!... Evasporque May 2012 #95
Well shit, Trayvon obviously was crazed and deranged and out for blood!1!! pinboy3niner May 2012 #96
Oh - Horseshit leftynyc May 2012 #97
Bullshit. 99Forever May 2012 #98
Only peacefreak May 2012 #99
and dumb ass blog posts are connected to gross, stupendous stupidity CatWoman May 2012 #102
Definitely! hobbit709 May 2012 #103
I voted to hide this crap. It violates *MY* community standards. Needed 2 more... nt Romulox May 2012 #107
Is this a "they drank milk, so that proves milk makes you violent" 2pooped2pop May 2012 #108
The bullshit is getting awfully thick around here. WilliamPitt May 2012 #109
Seriously. One of the most disgusting posts I've read on this subject. NT EOTE May 2012 #111
This is one of the most sickening and disgusting things I've ever seen posted on DU. EOTE May 2012 #110
More reefer madness RainDog May 2012 #115
Yeah, it's disgusting for multiple reasons. EOTE May 2012 #116
I notice this same person is all outraged about poor people taking illegal tax breaks RainDog May 2012 #119
Reminds me of that joke about teabaggers and the 1%. EOTE May 2012 #120
YOINK!!! U4ikLefty May 2012 #123
You're welcome to it, it's not mine :p NT EOTE May 2012 #126
You have to be pretty stupid to believe that shit. tabasco May 2012 #117
Hey, we'll see who's laughing when you or a loved one are killed in a Skittles related crime. EOTE May 2012 #122
Blatantly untrue, but even so... theaocp May 2012 #125
oh bullshit. one can find "studies" on any side of anything cali May 2012 #127
Yes, I agree Marijuana use can and does cause agression notadmblnd May 2012 #128
Teens & Pot otohara May 2012 #134
Just wait until you hit your 50's Oilwellian May 2012 #135
Lions & Tigers & Bears!!! H2O Man May 2012 #137
it is too strong for some people Beringia May 2012 #139
well my research was conducted over the entire decade of the 90s arely staircase May 2012 #140
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