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In reply to the discussion: Dunkin Donut CEO Who Makes $4,887 an Hour Outraged at $15 Minimum Wage [View all]Dark n Stormy Knight
(10,486 posts)86. Both are necessary. I don't buy the magic markets BS.
Why the Idea of a "Free Market" Is Total BS
There has never been and never will be a "free" market. All markets have rules.
By Robert Reich / RobertReich.org September 16, 2013
One of the most deceptive ideas continuously sounded by the Right (and its fathomless think tanks and media outlets) is that the "free market" is natural and inevitable, existing outside and beyond government. So whatever inequality or insecurity it generates is beyond our control. And whatever ways we might seek to reduce inequality or insecurity -- to make the economy work for us -- are unwarranted constraints on the market's freedom, and will inevitably go wrong.
By this view, if some people aren't paid enough to live on, the market has determined they aren't worth enough. If others rake in billions, they must be worth it. If millions of Americans remain unemployed or their paychecks are shrinking or they work two or three part-time jobs with no idea what they'll earn next month or next week, that's too bad; it's just the outcome of the market.
According to this logic, government shouldn't intrude through minimum wages, high taxes on top earners, public spending to get people back to work, regulations on business, or anything else, because the "free market" knows best.
In reality, the "free market" is a bunch of rules about (1) what can be owned and traded (the genome? slaves? nuclear materials? babies? votes?); (2) on what terms (equal access to the internet? the right to organize unions? corporate monopolies? the length of patent protections? ); (3) under what conditions (poisonous drugs? unsafe foods? deceptive Ponzi schemes? uninsured derivatives? dangerous workplaces?) (4) what's private and what's public (police? roads? clean air and clean water? healthcare? good schools? parks and playgrounds?); (5) how to pay for what (taxes, user fees, individual pricing?). And so on.
These rules don't exist in nature; they are human creations. Governments don't "intrude" on free markets; governments organize and maintain them. Markets aren't "free" of rules; the rules define them.
http://www.alternet.org/why-idea-free-market-total-bs
There has never been and never will be a "free" market. All markets have rules.
By Robert Reich / RobertReich.org September 16, 2013
One of the most deceptive ideas continuously sounded by the Right (and its fathomless think tanks and media outlets) is that the "free market" is natural and inevitable, existing outside and beyond government. So whatever inequality or insecurity it generates is beyond our control. And whatever ways we might seek to reduce inequality or insecurity -- to make the economy work for us -- are unwarranted constraints on the market's freedom, and will inevitably go wrong.
By this view, if some people aren't paid enough to live on, the market has determined they aren't worth enough. If others rake in billions, they must be worth it. If millions of Americans remain unemployed or their paychecks are shrinking or they work two or three part-time jobs with no idea what they'll earn next month or next week, that's too bad; it's just the outcome of the market.
According to this logic, government shouldn't intrude through minimum wages, high taxes on top earners, public spending to get people back to work, regulations on business, or anything else, because the "free market" knows best.
In reality, the "free market" is a bunch of rules about (1) what can be owned and traded (the genome? slaves? nuclear materials? babies? votes?); (2) on what terms (equal access to the internet? the right to organize unions? corporate monopolies? the length of patent protections? ); (3) under what conditions (poisonous drugs? unsafe foods? deceptive Ponzi schemes? uninsured derivatives? dangerous workplaces?) (4) what's private and what's public (police? roads? clean air and clean water? healthcare? good schools? parks and playgrounds?); (5) how to pay for what (taxes, user fees, individual pricing?). And so on.
These rules don't exist in nature; they are human creations. Governments don't "intrude" on free markets; governments organize and maintain them. Markets aren't "free" of rules; the rules define them.
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Dunkin Donut CEO Who Makes $4,887 an Hour Outraged at $15 Minimum Wage [View all]
marmar
Aug 2015
OP
But the total amount of labor hours needed to produce current output is static
StrongBad
Aug 2015
#68
Nope, my math is correct if you want to pay all employees equally performing the same position.
StrongBad
Aug 2015
#77
"If that were the case, why not increase the price on the least popular item by $100? "
Dark n Stormy Knight
Aug 2015
#83
Yeah. I know. Scary for some to think people will finally revolt against this "free market" BS.
Dark n Stormy Knight
Aug 2015
#97
Why do working men and women take their business to these companies? There are much better donuts
kelliekat44
Aug 2015
#4
While he is doubtless overpaid and minimum wage earners the reverse, CEO pay comparisons are always
whatthehey
Aug 2015
#6
Great idea! Let's pay the CEO $0 per year and distribute all his money equally to DD employees.
StrongBad
Aug 2015
#8
The article implies you're upset at the disparity between CEO and employee pay.
StrongBad
Aug 2015
#12
The point is that someone making that much an hour is in no place to call $15 a ridiculously high
gollygee
Aug 2015
#25
And they all collectively can decide to layoff workers rather than raise prices.
StrongBad
Aug 2015
#33
But if he gave away his entire salary that would translate to a whopping 3 cent increase per hour.
StrongBad
Aug 2015
#15
Dude, you have no idea what sort of skills and work ethic is required to run a company.
StrongBad
Aug 2015
#29
are you saying that severe income disparity is always the cost of doing business?
pepperbear
Aug 2015
#84
Dunkin Donuts stockholders would like to know why the CEO has been hiring unneeded employees.
ieoeja
Aug 2015
#13
Sorry, you get paid depending on your skills and what value you provide to an employer.
StrongBad
Aug 2015
#72
How about businesses thrive or fail based on their value to society? If your business can't succeed
Dark n Stormy Knight
Aug 2015
#79
That's why I support income tax and redistribution rather than market intervention.
StrongBad
Aug 2015
#80
Living wages are for Eurotards. Look to Bangladesh for a better example.
HickFromTheTick
Aug 2015
#18