General Discussion

Octafish

(55,745 posts)

90. ^ ^ ^ THIS ^ ^ ^

Sun Aug 30, 2015, 11:33 AM

Aug 2015

Seeing his friends drafted into the army by the colonial powers, seeing other friends join the rebels; Saki Mafundikwa opted out of the revolution in Rhodesia and came to the USA and became a scholar of graphic arts. He returned to Zimbabwe and started the first school for the digital arts. He also backs farming, having a traditional home in both the city and the country. He mentioned the GMO killer seeds that require farmers to buy new ones each planting season, rather than doing it the traditional -- and best -- way where the farmers use their best plants' seedlings to plant the next year's crop.

http://www.ted.com/talks/saki_mafundikwa_ingenuity_and_elegance_in_ancient_african_alphabets

An enlightened being, Mafundikwa is profound in every way.

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The anti-GMO movement is nothing but a pseudoscientific scam. [View all] alp227 Aug 2015 OP

Whatever. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2015 #1

Yep. hunter Aug 2015 #35

I've made mention of similar before... Lancero Aug 2015 #40

Saying that the reasons behind all GM's is the same, or the producers are the same or that Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2015 #42

Many, not all. Lancero Aug 2015 #46

I imagine if you talked to various anti-GM protesters out in the world Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2015 #47

And being piled on, wanting to know what monesto is paying me for daring to support medical GMOs. Lancero Aug 2015 #50

My insulin comes from genetically modified bacteria eridani Aug 2015 #56

Funny thing is, once the Carotene levels in golden rice were brought up.. X_Digger Aug 2015 #58

Hear about the anti-gmo group that tried to scare diabetics into not using insulin? Lancero Aug 2015 #81

Even that doesn't make sense, they always cite Agent Orange and the actions of the government... Humanist_Activist Aug 2015 #106

Monsanto is devoted to turning everyting into agribusiness, and then dominating that. eridani Aug 2015 #170

What does this post even mean? Monsanto is a for profit company, they are rather... Humanist_Activist Aug 2015 #193

I have, and, no, they don't. HuckleB Sep 2015 #277

the issue of the actual science is quite different from the marketing issue virtualobserver Aug 2015 #2

Well said Lorien Aug 2015 #12

"Labeling lets people decide for themselves." alp227 Aug 2015 #21

Candidate Obama thought labels were a good idea nationalize the fed Aug 2015 #22

Green for victory!!...nt SidDithers Aug 2015 #37

Candidate Obama also thought "clean coal" was a thing too. progressoid Aug 2015 #164

I honestly don't know much about GMO davidpdx Aug 2015 #177

Costco might not have been fully honest about that. HuckleB Sep 2015 #249

I have no reason to believe or disbelieve your supposed scientific FACT..... virtualobserver Aug 2015 #29

That's how markets work. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2015 #41

Imposing unnecessary government regulation to increase one industry's market share... Major Nikon Aug 2015 #152

"Imposing unnecessary government regulation" TBF Aug 2015 #173

Owch davidpdx Aug 2015 #176

Sure, because unnecessary government regulation is what the left is all about Major Nikon Aug 2015 #179

Bashing the government is not TBF Aug 2015 #187

You funny Major Nikon Aug 2015 #188

The left doesn't like regulation just because they think it's a pretty word kcr Aug 2015 #189

I didn't say we support all regulation - TBF Aug 2015 #200

No, you just claimed I was right wing because I don't support stupid chemophobic regulation Major Nikon Aug 2015 #208

Does it actually? Chan790 Aug 2015 #228

Does abortion cause cancer you mean? kcr Sep 2015 #239

That was what I asked... Chan790 Sep 2015 #241

That's it! The OP seems to lump legitimate criticism and overzealous labelers into one category. n/t Betty Karlson Sep 2015 #236

"Legitimate criticism." HuckleB Sep 2015 #243

It's fine by me. People want to know what they are eating regardless of whether Monsanto GoneFishin Aug 2015 #3

Yes, the overwhelming consensus of the scientific community, including cpwm17 Aug 2015 #4

Great, they're safe. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2015 #43

Then companies can label their products as GMO free for people that are into that stuff. cpwm17 Aug 2015 #45

And many are. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2015 #48

No one is trying to block that. HuckleB Aug 2015 #136

No. The American Medical Association said: GreatGazoo Aug 2015 #49

Glyphosphate sure the fuck is not. And the purpose of Monsanton's GMOs is to-- eridani Aug 2015 #55

Really? Major Nikon Aug 2015 #60

we can just take for granted handmade34 Aug 2015 #157

I'll take that as a no Major Nikon Aug 2015 #158

The New England Journal of Medicine does not agree. enough Aug 2015 #5

No, Philip J. Landrigan and Charles Benbrook don't agree. cpwm17 Aug 2015 #23

Dr Charles Benbrook found that organic foods had higher antioxidant levels and lower cadmium GreatGazoo Aug 2015 #51

Way to ignore the full results of a researcher who has been debunked over and over again. HuckleB Aug 2015 #138

Okay, if it's a "pseudoscience scam," chervilant Aug 2015 #6

Likewise the organic industry should have no problem with "fertilized with cow shit" labels Major Nikon Aug 2015 #155

As someone who grew up on farms... Chan790 Aug 2015 #229

Actually synthetic nitrogen fertilizers are derived from natural gas Major Nikon Sep 2015 #231

Deal laundry_queen Sep 2015 #251

Except one has exactly shit to do with food safety Major Nikon Sep 2015 #252

Totally equivalent laundry_queen Sep 2015 #253

And you are pretending all synthetic nitrogen comes from fracking Major Nikon Sep 2015 #254

No I didn't laundry_queen Sep 2015 #262

I predict greatness for this thread Coventina Aug 2015 #7

Does it come with free ears? Hydra Aug 2015 #8

Oh heck no! Coventina Aug 2015 #10

GMO-free salt Kali Aug 2015 #9

Enjoy your Roundup Ready GMO corn with added pig proteins and antibiotics! Lorien Aug 2015 #11

Bacon flavored popcorn right off the cob?? Hydra Aug 2015 #14

Almost no sweet corn on the market is GMO. MohRokTah Aug 2015 #135

My thoughts exactly! odd_duck Sep 2015 #272

You agree with silly Internet fictions? HuckleB Sep 2015 #273

It isn't the science behind it all that i question hifiguy Aug 2015 #13

Within a few weeks after the Iraq invasion Oilwellian Aug 2015 #19

Yep laundry_queen Aug 2015 #25

Jurassic Park time, eh? Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2015 #44

Corporate ownership of the food supply and ruined lives of farmers WDIM Aug 2015 #61

This is a big problem too Bettie Aug 2015 #178

All types of seeds can be patented. HuckleB Aug 2015 #184

Then there shouldn't be a problem with labeling it. jazzimov Aug 2015 #15

I want my food labeled that it contains no Leprechaun feces. progressoid Aug 2015 #162

silly H2O Man Aug 2015 #16

My bacon flavored popcorn told me to vote you an Un-Rec Hydra Aug 2015 #17

How serious is your problem on the RFS scale? Major Nikon Aug 2015 #156

What is your financial interest in GMOs? roody Aug 2015 #18

Wow, is everything a conspiracy to you? Your tinfoil hat is on a little too tight. Humanist_Activist Aug 2015 #24

Your financial interest is still unknown. roody Aug 2015 #28

You are just reinforcing my point. n/t Humanist_Activist Aug 2015 #32

Ironic, really: a "poisoning the well" fallacy committed by someone... Lizzie Poppet Aug 2015 #93

I guess he could go for guilt by association, I'm born and raised in St. Louis after all. n/t Humanist_Activist Aug 2015 #99

They are generally cheaper than the alternative Major Nikon Aug 2015 #64

Right. And Dupont and Monsanto have never put a poisonous product on the market pnwmom Aug 2015 #20

When you want to peddle putrid shit to the public, JohnyCanuck Aug 2015 #26

Thanks. So that was just published a few days ago in a peer-reviewed journal. pnwmom Aug 2015 #31

Séralini Major Nikon Aug 2015 #212

Another intelligent response of yours. n/t pnwmom Aug 2015 #214

Sure, because channeling Seralini is so smart Major Nikon Aug 2015 #226

Good that this is a long term study. immoderate Aug 2015 #207

The anti-GMO crowd are just as bad as the anti-vaxxers. Deadshot Aug 2015 #27

They own a number of patents. roody Aug 2015 #30

Yup. tymorial Aug 2015 #53

It's annoying how the anti-GMO crowd pretends to be as knowledgeable as scientists. Oneironaut Aug 2015 #131

Monsanto is on record suing family farmers WDIM Aug 2015 #74

Sounds like you have a problem with the poisons and not the GMOs. Deadshot Aug 2015 #86

Nonsense Major Nikon Aug 2015 #88

All corporations are greedy POS. Oneironaut Aug 2015 #132

Science relies on logic. Conflating the 93% of american who want GMO foods labelled with the 7% who GreatGazoo Aug 2015 #159

Nope. Deadshot Aug 2015 #160

+1,000,000 ... 000 HuckleB Sep 2015 #271

What's REALLY "so damn pathetic" is DUers shilling for multinational corporations who want scarletwoman Aug 2015 #33

^ ^ ^ THIS ^ ^ ^ Octafish Aug 2015 #90

Myth 4: Before Monsanto got in the way, farmers typically saved their seeds and re-used them Major Nikon Aug 2015 #92

Oh. So farmers do get to use their crops' seeds? Octafish Aug 2015 #95

They can reuse them all they want Major Nikon Aug 2015 #102

Myth 4, detail. Gormy Cuss Aug 2015 #97

Myth 5: Most seeds these days are genetically modified. Major Nikon Aug 2015 #104

It's more work to find NON-GMO seeds for corn and soybeans Gormy Cuss Aug 2015 #111

Voluntary, albeit disingenuous, labeling and mandatory labeling are two different things Major Nikon Aug 2015 #115

Yes, they are. Gormy Cuss Aug 2015 #116

I could care less really Major Nikon Aug 2015 #118

I don't shill for multinational corporations. I loathe them. progressoid Aug 2015 #163

Exactly. Lorien Aug 2015 #166

You know, it's good that the conversation is Ron Green Aug 2015 #34

DU rec... SidDithers Aug 2015 #36

I went through Seralini's study. immoderate Aug 2015 #210

WRONG WRONG WRONG SoLeftIAmRight Aug 2015 #38

Good post. Good links. Kickin'... (eom) CanSocDem Aug 2015 #54

When attempting to contradict, it's best to include relevant facts Major Nikon Aug 2015 #62

Some of what you brought up are valid concerns, they have nothing to do with GMOs... Humanist_Activist Aug 2015 #68

I find that sad Bradical79 Aug 2015 #186

GMO's are like tattoos SoLeftIAmRight Aug 2015 #190

That's a straw man. No one is asking for salt to be labeled GMO-free. We are asking for the opposite: pnwmom Aug 2015 #39

You can ask all you want Major Nikon Aug 2015 #63

Oh, she'll bring up her favorite organic shill as soon as she can. HuckleB Aug 2015 #123

Thank you for revealing your "pro-free market," climate denial, Koch colors so clearly! pnwmom Aug 2015 #126

As usual, your response is less than honest. HuckleB Aug 2015 #134

Mine is completely honest. I don't trust Koch- funded "debunkers" and climate science deniers, pnwmom Aug 2015 #137

Hogwash. HuckleB Aug 2015 #139

I understand that when corporations are the ones doing the funding, the "science" pnwmom Aug 2015 #144

That's funny as hell Major Nikon Sep 2015 #237

So if you reject Seralini because of his connections, why don't you reject all the research pnwmom Sep 2015 #244

Glad you asked. The answer is because that would be completely fucking stupid. Major Nikon Sep 2015 #250

God. How I love a well formed non "feelings" based opinion. tymorial Aug 2015 #52

The problem is that the anti-GMO edhopper Aug 2015 #57

And in the process deligitamize such concerns, similar to how some anti-vaxxers have... Humanist_Activist Aug 2015 #65

I don't disagree edhopper Aug 2015 #71

GMOs are anti-farmers and anti-family farms. WDIM Aug 2015 #69

Yes edhopper Aug 2015 #72

so why not call for "sustainably farmed" labels rather than "GMO free?" mike_c Aug 2015 #127

Probably because they wouldn't be able to support the claim. HuckleB Aug 2015 #141

That's not unique to GMO Major Nikon Aug 2015 #75

That is not a myth. WDIM Aug 2015 #77

Then post just one instance of it happening Major Nikon Aug 2015 #78

I added a link of Monsantos harrassment. and intimidation after you replied WDIM Aug 2015 #80

Just one instance of Monsanto suing someone for overseeding Major Nikon Aug 2015 #82

No you ask for one example due to seed drift WDIM Aug 2015 #85

Wrong Major Nikon Aug 2015 #89

Ok so I know your problem you cant read. WDIM Aug 2015 #94

You funny Major Nikon Aug 2015 #100

He was sorting seeds he believed to be non-gmo WDIM Aug 2015 #107

You funny Major Nikon Aug 2015 #112

It is a myth. Deadshot Aug 2015 #87

NPR article Major Nikon Aug 2015 #91

Yep. Deadshot Aug 2015 #98

Another apologist for the mega corporations WDIM Aug 2015 #59

GMOs are regulated by the FDA, EPA, and USDA Major Nikon Aug 2015 #66

If a company submitting its own research WDIM Aug 2015 #70

That's exactly how transport aircraft are certified Major Nikon Aug 2015 #73

Do you think tobacco is safe? WDIM Aug 2015 #76

Caution: Cigarette Smoking May be Hazardous to Your Health (1966) Major Nikon Aug 2015 #79

The Tobaccos industry's manipulation of science is WDIM Aug 2015 #83

And yet warning labels have existed at least since 1966 Major Nikon Aug 2015 #84

Only because of independent studies WDIM Aug 2015 #96

Because they are regulated by the government Major Nikon Aug 2015 #101

Post removed Post removed Aug 2015 #108

I'm not going to respond to a personal attack other than pointing it out Major Nikon Aug 2015 #114

Anti-GMO activists are the ones practicing “tobacco science”. HuckleB Aug 2015 #122

Ever notice how those who get their feathers ruffled over this use words like 'poison' and 'toxic' Major Nikon Aug 2015 #67

Wrong target HassleCat Aug 2015 #103

Certain types of GMOs have pesticides in their DNA WDIM Aug 2015 #109

Which is also true for most non-GMO plants Major Nikon Aug 2015 #129

99% of the pesticides we ingest are produced in plant DNA. And that goes for organics, too. Nailzberg Aug 2015 #149

Why are you blowing their minds with reality? HuckleB Aug 2015 #230

Reuters:Germany starts move to ban GMO crops: ministry letter RufusTFirefly Aug 2015 #105

Politics, not science. HuckleB Sep 2015 #275

Bullshit Trajan Aug 2015 #110

Is this really your bullshit call? Major Nikon Aug 2015 #151

I agree, but the seperate issue of labeling food and transparency by a private corporation Rex Aug 2015 #113

I do not make a case that GMO's are evil and should have a scarlet letter/should be banned. KamaAina Aug 2015 #117

You ever eat an Ruby Red grapefruit? Major Nikon Aug 2015 #125

It comes in pretty handy in saving lives. progressoid Aug 2015 #165

Ever eaten a seedless watermelon? jeff47 Aug 2015 #202

How about a Ruby Red grapefruit? Major Nikon Sep 2015 #238

Yep, was just covering chemical mutagens since grapefruit was in another reply. (nt) jeff47 Sep 2015 #247

Anyone remember Genetically Modified Tomatoes HockeyMom Aug 2015 #119

No Major Nikon Aug 2015 #128

[Citation Needed] Oneironaut Aug 2015 #133

If GMOs were so safe you wouldn't need a marketing campaign TBF Aug 2015 #120

I go with the scientists. cpwm17 Aug 2015 #124

every major scientific organization in the world has found GMOs crops safe... mike_c Aug 2015 #130

I am fully in support of vaccinations - TBF Aug 2015 #150

I'm happy to answer that question.... mike_c Aug 2015 #154

Europeans are more inclined to fall for bad health and medical science than Americans. cpwm17 Aug 2015 #161

In many cases it's the exact same people Major Nikon Aug 2015 #153

AGAIN, how are "roundup ready" crops with added pig protein and antibiotics Lorien Aug 2015 #167

There are no commercially available GMO food crops that have been spliced with animal DNA Major Nikon Aug 2015 #182

"Answer the damn question already!" mike_c Aug 2015 #197

No, what you need is a marketing campaign to get people to buy jeff47 Aug 2015 #203

Indeed. it's stunning and scary to see so many people for the anti-GMO deceptions. HuckleB Aug 2015 #121

Perhaps those DUers who have lost loved ones to GMO foods could weigh in? (nt) Nye Bevan Aug 2015 #140

Exactly WHO has "lost loved ones," and precisely HOW? Archae Aug 2015 #143

Well I keep reading here how horribly dangerous these "GMO foods" are. Nye Bevan Aug 2015 #145

I hope you're being sarcastic. Archae Aug 2015 #147

I'm still trying to figure out where all the bodies are buried Major Nikon Aug 2015 #146

How about GMO grass seed? My dad lived down the road from Scottslawn Lorien Aug 2015 #168

The reduction in the pirate population is causing global warming Major Nikon Aug 2015 #181

You are quite literally spouting bullshit, what GMO grass seed? Seriously, what the fuck are you... Humanist_Activist Aug 2015 #194

Just like Climate Change is pseudoscience. Dont call me Shirley Aug 2015 #142

Sure, except the scientific consensus goes the other way Major Nikon Aug 2015 #148

No, more like Climate Change "Skepticism" is pseudoscience. The reverse of your claim. n/t Humanist_Activist Aug 2015 #195

But poisoning the planet with toxic pesticides and herbicides required for gmos is A-okay?! Dont call me Shirley Aug 2015 #198

That doesn't require GMOs. jeff47 Aug 2015 #204

Yup. Look at the reality of Chipotle's non-GMO move. More you know what. HuckleB Aug 2015 #217

Uhm, that has nothing to do with GMOs, but rather industrial farming in general. Humanist_Activist Aug 2015 #209

It has everything to do with gmos. Dont call me Shirley Aug 2015 #213

No, it doesn't. You were shown reality, but you ignored it. Why? HuckleB Sep 2015 #258

GMOs have reduced pesticide use, and allowed for the use of less toxic herbicides. HuckleB Aug 2015 #216

These pesticide and herbicide dependent gmos are creating superweeds and superbugs. Dont call me Shirley Aug 2015 #218

Superweeds are fewer since GMOs were introduced. HuckleB Aug 2015 #220

This message was self-deleted by its author Dont call me Shirley Aug 2015 #221

So the data shows your claims to be false, and that's all you have to offer? HuckleB Aug 2015 #222

just in.... Dont call me Shirley Aug 2015 #223

Ah, Seralini in another pay for play journal and a post that is nothing but a distraction. HuckleB Aug 2015 #224

At least channeling Seralini validates the OP Major Nikon Sep 2015 #240

Indeed. HuckleB Sep 2015 #274

So... you're all fine and dandy with cross-pollination between organic and GMOs? sakabatou Aug 2015 #169

Bacteria that are modified to produce human insulin are also modified-- eridani Aug 2015 #171

THIS POST. YES I AM YELLING. LeftOfWest Aug 2015 #172

You realize that this doesn't actually work, right? jeff47 Aug 2015 #205

And they keep making changes to keep up with bacterial evolution eridani Sep 2015 #234

It's the exact same mechanism as antibiotic resistance. jeff47 Sep 2015 #246

So where are the insulin secreting bacteria in the wild? Evidence, please eridani Sep 2015 #256

If there's profit to be had they are fine with it - TBF Aug 2015 #174

Sure, because there's nothing more anti-democrat than agreeing with your government Major Nikon Aug 2015 #191

Not everyone wants your chemicals in their food - TBF Aug 2015 #199

I generally deal with it by not giving a day old dog shit Major Nikon Aug 2015 #201

There's also a big profit to be made by scaring you into buying more expensive crops. jeff47 Aug 2015 #206

Absolutely - TBF Aug 2015 #211

Yup. HuckleB Aug 2015 #215

Cross-pollination can happen with any type of crops. HuckleB Aug 2015 #175

Here's the really fun part Major Nikon Aug 2015 #180

Yup! Label the MBOs! NOW! HuckleB Aug 2015 #183

Yeah, except you never hear that rallying cry Major Nikon Aug 2015 #185

The anti-GMO movement is far more evil than anything they hope to prevent Major Nikon Aug 2015 #192

I would say most of them are just ignorant of biology, though its frustrating trying to debate... Humanist_Activist Aug 2015 #196

^^^THIS^^^ mike_c Aug 2015 #227

When someone throws around words like "poison", "toxic", and "cancer causing".... Major Nikon Sep 2015 #233

They are EXACTLY like climate change deniers. alarimer Aug 2015 #219

That which can be debunked should be Major Nikon Sep 2015 #232

Gluten-free GM wheat could help celiac patients HuckleB Aug 2015 #225

Good luck baking bread without gluten n/t eridani Sep 2015 #235

Per the article... Major Nikon Sep 2015 #242

+1,000,000 ... 000 HuckleB Sep 2015 #248

Still looks like a fucking brick eridani Sep 2015 #255

Oh, for Pete's sake. HuckleB Sep 2015 #257

Why don't you confess to postulating a silly solution in search of a problem? eridani Sep 2015 #259

In other words, honesty is not your thing. HuckleB Sep 2015 #260

I have already stated support of bacterial human insulin and golden rice eridani Sep 2015 #261

So what? HuckleB Sep 2015 #263

"Honest" = pro-corporate. I'll try to remember that eridani Sep 2015 #264

Nice confession! HuckleB Sep 2015 #265

Science is a systematic approach to knowledge that can be applied for just about anything eridani Sep 2015 #266

And you double down on the confession! Nicely done. HuckleB Sep 2015 #268

Oddly, when scientists are paid by corporations, their "impartial" findings-- eridani Sep 2015 #269

And now you go to the shilling scientists routine. HuckleB Sep 2015 #270

Like the EPA? eridani Sep 2015 #278

You actually posted that piece? It was debunked at DU, earlier today. HuckleB Sep 2015 #279

All science is political, period. There is no good reason for ramping up glyphosate at all eridani Sep 2015 #280

Uh, yeah, Benbrook. Been there, debunked that. HuckleB Sep 2015 #281

I didn't see any debunking of the increased use of glyphosate n/t eridani Sep 2015 #282

Ah, you respond with classic intellectual dishonesty. HuckleB Sep 2015 #283

Big ag happens to be highly inefficient eridani Sep 2015 #284

Oh, brother. HuckleB Sep 2015 #285

Requiring 100 calories or more of input for every calorie of output is just not efficient eridani Sep 2015 #286

You do realize that your claim is astoundingly false, right? HuckleB Sep 2015 #287

Let's see your link showing that we get more calories out ofhigh input farming eridani Sep 2015 #288

So you want me to disprove a claim you made that you can't prove? HuckleB Sep 2015 #289

Probably Scientific American isn't scientific enough for you, but anyway-- eridani Sep 2015 #290

Pollan is an anti-GMO quack. HuckleB Sep 2015 #291

The human body isn't a machine that runs on fossil fuel Major Nikon Sep 2015 #292

The food our bodies use is grown with huge fossil fuel input. eridani Sep 2015 #294

More like misleadingly huge when expressed in calories Major Nikon Sep 2015 #295

It is the exact same thing n.t eridani Sep 2015 #296

Sure. That's why when I full up my car at the gas pump the meter reads in calories. Major Nikon Sep 2015 #297

Chemists and physicists don't run gas stations. n/t eridani Sep 2015 #298

So that's why the meters don't read in calories, eh? Major Nikon Sep 2015 #299

This thread keeps getting bumped by posts I can't see. HuckleB Sep 2015 #245

REC! nt LostOne4Ever Sep 2015 #267

The war against genetically modified organisms is full of fearmongering, errors, and fraud. HuckleB Sep 2015 #276

Seriously???? PatSeg Sep 2015 #293

Praise GMO's, especially if you love carcinogens in your food, air, and rainfall. L. Coyote Sep 2015 #300