General Discussion

MellowDem

(5,018 posts)

56. Depends on the person...

Tue Sep 1, 2015, 03:03 PM

Sep 2015

For people raised in, and often indoctrinated into, the Church, and who believe fervently in its teachings, the Church will have some psychological power, cultural power, even socioeconomic power. The more a person relies on the Church for their identity, for their morality, for their community, and for even financial help, the more power it can have over their lives.

Quite a few people never leave the Church because it would be too inconvenient to do so, the costs would outweigh the benefits, etc. etc., even if they don't believe.

Any organization that pushes misogynsitc shaming, and then makes it easier for women to obtain "forgiveness" from the organization more readily for their "sins", shouldn't be applauded. But religion has so much power and privilege that even progressives applaud the Pope for the equivalent of an abusive spouse saying they will accept the abused's apologies for misdeeds from 7 to 9 instead of 7 to 8.

To an outsider, it's really fucked up.

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Pope Francis To Allow Priests To Forgive Women Who Had Abortions [View all] kpete Sep 2015 OP

Well, that's big of him... Erich Bloodaxe BSN Sep 2015 #1

Perfect response LOL- I can't wait till less than 10% of the population follows mythology snooper2 Sep 2015 #23

I'll second that emotion. Arugula Latte Sep 2015 #35

Oh, you are SO much more genteel Le Taz Hot Sep 2015 #36

lol. Liberal_in_LA Sep 2015 #82

The idea that women are in need absolution for reproductive choice is disgusting. PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #2

THIS! nt LostOne4Ever Sep 2015 #90

an important step for bringing the church into the 21st century Blue_Adept Sep 2015 #3

I agree; these positive steps by Pope Francis are not taken cynically, Ron Green Sep 2015 #4

Yep Blue_Adept Sep 2015 #5

Blue_Adept kpete Sep 2015 #9

Same here Blue_Adept Sep 2015 #15

I saw your post about guns cost lives that do not need to be lost. I offer you these facts: Bluenorthwest Sep 2015 #26

I live in a community that is Catholic. hunter Sep 2015 #28

WHAT?!??! Can you expand on this part, please? PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #29

The Church can't make me pay for an aircraft carrier named U.S.S. George H.W. Bush. hunter Sep 2015 #40

Make you pay? Gosh, that's privilege. And a far cry from proving your RIDICULOUS claim. PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #41

If you think I tithe as Mormons or Fundamentalists do, you are mistaken. hunter Sep 2015 #46

I didn't say "you", I said "Dollars tithed". PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #47

Against my will, I "tithed" for war in Iraq. hunter Sep 2015 #49

That doesn't make the US government "far more regressive than the RCC" PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #50

You're not a dead body in Iraq. hunter Sep 2015 #52

That brings us back to the millions of dead in Africa who were told by your Church that condoms Bluenorthwest Sep 2015 #55

Additionally, the Catholic Church in Rwanda was complicit in the genocide of the Tutsis... SidDithers Sep 2015 #58

Francis fans do not want to talk about Africa at all. Bluenorthwest Sep 2015 #62

And? Here we are. hunter Sep 2015 #65

What leverage do you have on Iraq and aircraft carriers? Why can't you speak to what I said? Bluenorthwest Sep 2015 #122

How is the secular government far more regressive and oppressive than the Church? Arugula Latte Sep 2015 #37

The Church has never stopped anyone in my family or among my friends from marrying. hunter Sep 2015 #45

How nice for you. Is your community capable of responding to what is said to them instead of making Bluenorthwest Sep 2015 #53

I'm very familiar with all the "facts." hunter Sep 2015 #104

I have no idea what post of mine you're referencing Blue_Adept Sep 2015 #30

It was addressed to the OP, not to you. My point is that if we care about sensless wastes of human Bluenorthwest Sep 2015 #57

Another good step towards progress. onehandle Sep 2015 #24

Agreed all around. Turning around an institution like the RCC hifiguy Sep 2015 #27

There's the secular segment that's just against anything that the church does Blue_Adept Sep 2015 #31

I've been an atheist going on 40 years. hifiguy Sep 2015 #32

pssssh. To borrow from another DUer PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #33

The reason why the Pope is making this step is because Catholics are voting with their feet Major Nikon Sep 2015 #109

That will never happen. Their entire schtick is Men = good. Women = icky/unclean/sinning/inhuman. Arugula Latte Sep 2015 #111

the RCC has written of western europe and north america Warren Stupidity Sep 2015 #115

Understand this is big but it still pisses me off dembotoz Sep 2015 #6

Oh, fuck him. Lars39 Sep 2015 #7

Will priests be providing forgiveness for all medical procedures?... SidDithers Sep 2015 #8

Also note that is still at the discretion of the priest. PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #10

I'm sure all the RCC clergy (men, of course) who have raped children are already forgiven. Arugula Latte Sep 2015 #39

Sad as it is, since the current position as it stands is much worse... Xyzse Sep 2015 #11

This is a big step LWolf Sep 2015 #12

he seems to be talking only about women who "bear a scar in their heart" over this decision. CTyankee Sep 2015 #13

Women do not need forgiveness from anyone bigwillq Sep 2015 #14

Correct, they don't need it Blue_Adept Sep 2015 #17

I can agree with that (nt) bigwillq Sep 2015 #18

Except it's not good... MellowDem Sep 2015 #21

mmm hmm PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #22

What kind of "power" does the Church really have here in the U.S.A.? hunter Sep 2015 #51

Depends on the person... MellowDem Sep 2015 #56

You seem to focus exclusively on the US and affluent Americans. Bluenorthwest Sep 2015 #59

What "power" does the Church have over you? hunter Sep 2015 #76

Great post. kwassa Sep 2015 #88

Ever hear of Prop 8? Personhood amendments? PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #60

A lot more than you think.. Feron Sep 2015 #64

Plus this. PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #67

I think they ought to give ice cream LuvNewcastle Sep 2015 #16

That was awesome. Thank you. Starry Messenger Sep 2015 #19

wow kpete Sep 2015 #20

He can fuck right off. JTFrog Sep 2015 #25

+10000000 CharlotteVale Sep 2015 #34

It will be a happy day when all the women of the world just tell the Vatican to go fuck itself. Arugula Latte Sep 2015 #38

Me, too. demmiblue Sep 2015 #42

So do you think you should be PPRd for reproducing that offensive image in GD? nt el_bryanto Sep 2015 #61

Good Dog, are you that obtuse? demmiblue Sep 2015 #69

I'm just asking - it's a pretty hateful image. el_bryanto Sep 2015 #70

Um, duh. demmiblue Sep 2015 #75

Ah - so when you mentioned a witch hunt earlier you weren't opposed el_bryanto Sep 2015 #80

Lol! You can champion the conservative viewpoint all you want... I will not. demmiblue Sep 2015 #81

That's a filthy lie; I don't champion conservative view points. el_bryanto Sep 2015 #84

well you do believe that homosexuals have to go to hell. Warren Stupidity Sep 2015 #114

Please link me to a post where I have said that. nt el_bryanto Sep 2015 #116

You haven't a clue who made that, do you? rug Sep 2015 #87

This message was self-deleted by its author rug Sep 2015 #89

Pope Forgives Molested Children Orrex Sep 2015 #43

Brilliant... SidDithers Sep 2015 #48

Look, if you don't believe, you don't. We'll all find out too soon. WinkyDink Sep 2015 #44

Likely not. Arugula Latte Sep 2015 #85

Papal patronization propagating the precept of power and control over women. Solly Mack Sep 2015 #54

^^^This^^^ beam me up scottie Sep 2015 #63

Something about produce and reptiles that cause good women to go bad. Solly Mack Sep 2015 #66

It's all Eve's fault. beam me up scottie Sep 2015 #68

Damn, Eve. Stepping out of line that way. Solly Mack Sep 2015 #71

And every woman who ever experienced the agonizing pain of child birth has her to thank. beam me up scottie Sep 2015 #72

Great quote. Solly Mack Sep 2015 #74

Jezebel Spirit!!! PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #73

Don't leave out the part about dogs eating her flesh. Solly Mack Sep 2015 #77

Amen, sister. Good catch. PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #78

The year long �Jubilee of Mercy� (his words, not mine) begins December 8th. We better hurry! Solly Mack Sep 2015 #86

Exactly. This corrupt, grifting, murderous institution has caused women untold suffering Arugula Latte Sep 2015 #83

Nice alliteration. LWolf Sep 2015 #100

If you say so. Solly Mack Sep 2015 #101

it's an interesting case study for incrementalism foo_bar Sep 2015 #107

Fark nailed it... Glassunion Sep 2015 #79

Abortion, or helping someone procure one, incurs an automatic excommunication in the Catholic Church rug Sep 2015 #91

Or... We can voice our opposition over such a barbaric policy. PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #92

You can voice anything you want. Make sure you know what you're talking abot. rug Sep 2015 #94

Why don't you start one about how a priest raping a child PeaceNikki Sep 2015 #96

Yeah. Strange set of priorities, there... SidDithers Sep 2015 #98

Be my guest. I love debnking bullshit. rug Sep 2015 #99

So tell me, does child molestation lead to an automatic excommunication? n/t Humanist_Activist Sep 2015 #105

As you know, no. Neither does adultery, same sex relationships or anything but a handful of acts. rug Sep 2015 #117

My mom is the sort who could be excommunicated for physically attacking a Pope. hunter Sep 2015 #121

Oh, so it's a device to help the church boost membership... SidDithers Sep 2015 #93

Do you have trouble reading words as written, Sid? rug Sep 2015 #95

I wonder how many Catholics choose to get baptized... MellowDem Sep 2015 #102

38,042 in the U.S. last year. rug Sep 2015 #103

And 775,000 infant or minor baptisms... MellowDem Sep 2015 #118

79.7 million self-identified Catholics. rug Sep 2015 #119

The decline is in baptisms... MellowDem Sep 2015 #120

-allow- ?? ananda Sep 2015 #97

This Catholic agrees with you. 840high Sep 2015 #106

So why be a Catholic and put up with this bullshit? Arugula Latte Sep 2015 #110

I did walk away - found myself 840high Sep 2015 #112

it is disgusting misogynistic garbage Skittles Sep 2015 #108

they have to admit that they are awful murderesses and beg for forgiveness Warren Stupidity Sep 2015 #113